Bitwig Thoughts & Issues After Two Years (Long Post)

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antic604
KVRAF
11129 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:54 am

KTlin wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:49 am
dupont wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:30 am
Ableton :
pros :
follow action clips
Bitwig also has follow actions for clips and although I never use them I heard they are even better than Ableton's.
No, they're inferior in Bitwig, for example there's no real scene follow actions + clip actions in Live can have a probability defined mix of 2 different actions.
Music tech enthusiast
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20856 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:23 am

antic604 wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:54 am
KTlin wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:49 am
dupont wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:30 am
Ableton :
pros :
follow action clips
Bitwig also has follow actions for clips and although I never use them I heard they are even better than Ableton's.
No, they're inferior in Bitwig, for example there's no real scene follow actions + clip actions in Live can have a probability defined mix of 2 different actions.
They also have capabilities that Live doesn't.

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antic604
KVRAF
11129 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:02 am

pdxindy wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:23 am
antic604 wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:54 am
KTlin wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:49 am
dupont wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:30 am
Ableton :
pros :
follow action clips
Bitwig also has follow actions for clips and although I never use them I heard they are even better than Ableton's.
No, they're inferior in Bitwig, for example there's no real scene follow actions + clip actions in Live can have a probability defined mix of 2 different actions.
They also have capabilities that Live doesn't.
That doesn't make them on par, at least for me it doesn't.
Music tech enthusiast
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20856 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Sat Oct 23, 2021 8:42 am

antic604 wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:02 am
pdxindy wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:23 am
antic604 wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:54 am
KTlin wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 4:49 am
dupont wrote:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:30 am
Ableton :
pros :
follow action clips
Bitwig also has follow actions for clips and although I never use them I heard they are even better than Ableton's.
No, they're inferior in Bitwig, for example there's no real scene follow actions + clip actions in Live can have a probability defined mix of 2 different actions.
They also have capabilities that Live doesn't.
That doesn't make them on par, at least for me it doesn't.
I like the scene follow actions in Live 11... Will a scene move to the next scene if there is a gap between them? Or are they limited that way like clips?

The probability mix in Live of 2 different actions looks more impressive than I have found it actually useful. I do more purposeful than random arrangements.

The next action groups in Bitwig have some use for me... mainly organizational. I especially like the 'return to arrangement' option so I can have the Arrangement playing, trigger a clip(s) in the Launcher and it then when complete it automatically returns to the Arrangement. I don't remember Live doing that as a follow action.

Neither Live nor Bitwig have non-random branching logic so both always requires manual triggering of clips and/or scenes for non random stuff.

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dupont
KVRian
1174 posts since 23 Jun, 2007

Post Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:08 am

In bitwig only one clip launch mode : trigger
In live, 4 modes this is a plus in a live gig :
Trigger: down starts the clip; up is ignored.
Gate: down starts the clip; up stops the clip.
Toggle: down starts the clip; up is ignored. The clip will stop on the next down.
Repeat: As long as the mouse switch/key is held, the clip is triggered repeatedly at the clip quantization rate.

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20856 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Sun Oct 24, 2021 6:42 am

dupont wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:08 am
In bitwig only one clip launch mode : trigger
In live, 4 modes this is a plus in a live gig :
Trigger: down starts the clip; up is ignored.
Gate: down starts the clip; up stops the clip.
Toggle: down starts the clip; up is ignored. The clip will stop on the next down.
Repeat: As long as the mouse switch/key is held, the clip is triggered repeatedly at the clip quantization rate.
Yeah, Live is more sophisticated that way.

ihearanewworld
KVRist
72 posts since 29 May, 2019

Post Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:31 pm

pdxindy wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 6:42 am
dupont wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:08 am
In bitwig only one clip launch mode : trigger
In live, 4 modes this is a plus in a live gig :
Trigger: down starts the clip; up is ignored.
Gate: down starts the clip; up stops the clip.
Toggle: down starts the clip; up is ignored. The clip will stop on the next down.
Repeat: As long as the mouse switch/key is held, the clip is triggered repeatedly at the clip quantization rate.
Yeah, Live is more sophisticated that way.
You’re talking about sophistication with a guy who doesn’t want to use Ableton because their promos have women in them.

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Fleer
KVRAF
5068 posts since 23 Aug, 2014 from Boston/Cambridge

Post Sun Oct 24, 2021 7:12 pm

Sophisticated ones.

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dupont
KVRian
1174 posts since 23 Jun, 2007

Post Sun Oct 24, 2021 11:00 pm

ihearanewworld wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:31 pm
pdxindy wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 6:42 am
dupont wrote:
Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:08 am
In bitwig only one clip launch mode : trigger
In live, 4 modes this is a plus in a live gig :
Trigger: down starts the clip; up is ignored.
Gate: down starts the clip; up stops the clip.
Toggle: down starts the clip; up is ignored. The clip will stop on the next down.
Repeat: As long as the mouse switch/key is held, the clip is triggered repeatedly at the clip quantization rate.
Yeah, Live is more sophisticated that way.
You’re talking about sophistication with a guy who doesn’t want to use Ableton because their promos have women in them.
I've never told I don't use ableton but yes, there are sexy girls on most of this vids, not only in Ableton but in the elctronic music scene. Note that I saw a bitwig vid yesterday with a cute girl too !
Some girls came out of nowhere at the age of 20 and are projected in front of the techno scene everywhere in europe. They must have very good connections, rich familly, (talent is not mandatory as having a big ass is not a skill). :D

That's marketing for influenceable people

squeaky
KVRer
3 posts since 2 Oct, 2021

Post Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:02 am

I'll bet you'll be surprised how many men in the techno scene also have good connections and/or rich parents.

You sound disgruntled in your last post..

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dupont
KVRian
1174 posts since 23 Jun, 2007

Post Mon Oct 25, 2021 4:29 am

squeaky wrote:
Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:02 am
I'll bet you'll be surprised how many men in the techno scene also have good connections and/or rich parents.

You sound disgruntled in your last post..
yes for sure. but I learned something, I'm french and had to translate disgruntled :D
But yes, i am, such a fake world ....

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takaperry
KVRist
62 posts since 6 Sep, 2021

Post Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:46 pm

I absolutely love Bitwig, but where the hell is audio quantise? Just a simple shortcut to snap onsets to gridline would be an absolute game changer,

Such a basic feature to omit in an otherwise near-perfect DAW environment.
multi-platinum music producer / songwriter
https://www.takaperry.com

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20856 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Mon Oct 25, 2021 4:01 pm

takaperry wrote:
Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:46 pm
I absolutely love Bitwig, but where the hell is audio quantise? Just a simple shortcut to snap onsets to gridline would be an absolute game changer,

Such a basic feature to omit in an otherwise near-perfect DAW environment.
Yeah... that would be faster for sure. Bitwig could also use better onset detection with a slider.

Currently I use Slice in Place (set to onsets) and then select the individual slices and quantize.

killmaster
KVRAF
1955 posts since 5 Oct, 2003

Post Wed Oct 27, 2021 4:21 am

Randall P. McMurphy wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:07 am
...they are specific to Bitwig.
I’ve summarized them here in the hope that it will lead to some changes.
I really hope they do listen to what you've outlined here. These things accumulate over time to add to the tedium and I really appreciate you taking the time to spell them out. I wonder if Ableton refined these type of workflow aspects over time and Bitwig just needs to focus now on refining things in terms of workflow. All these small things add up and I think Bitwig would be more solid. I actually think Bitwig is pretty good about their implementations being intuitive. Some features are brilliantly implemented so I figure they would be open to this, though they may also have their reasons for some of these approaches.

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pdxindy
KVRAF
20856 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Wed Oct 27, 2021 5:53 am

Randall P. McMurphy wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:07 am
- Clicking on the actual loop brace does not select everything inside of it. The annoying use case here is the inability to quickly copy / duplicate entire sections of the arrangement. You are forced into dragging (the mouse again) over each track you want to include in the selection. Not only does this use the mouse when it shouldn’t, but it’s really tedious on a massive project.
Hold down 2 and select the time range you want up in the ruler area and it selects all tracks. No need to swipe the mouse across all tracks.

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