Goodbye, dear plugin! Those that won't make the Apple M1 transition

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
KVRAF
5556 posts since 24 May, 2002 from Tutukaka, New Zealand

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:54 pm

I used to really quite like Crystal...many years ago. And I have no idea at all what ARM is - the opposite of LEG?

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KVRian

Topic Starter

1135 posts since 25 Sep, 2014 from Specific Northwest

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:33 pm

Chrisk-K wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:27 pm
pdxindy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:24 pm
chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
Look at this bloody mess Apple created for developers and users.
It's not a mess for me... Today I added a 100 duplicate tracks of a Dune 3 preset each playing 4-6 notes and my new MBP was nowhere near its limit. And that is with the project @ 96khz! Plus it was barely even warm and it was silent. Best freaking laptop ever made! Apple has done a great job IMO.
After hearing PC fan noise for 30 years, I find it a blessing to use my absolutely silent M1 Mini. I will never go back to the Windows realm.
You obviously haven't heard my MacBook Pro... :hihi:

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KVRian

Topic Starter

1135 posts since 25 Sep, 2014 from Specific Northwest

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:38 pm

kritikon wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:54 pm
I used to really quite like Crystal...many years ago. And I have no idea at all what ARM is - the opposite of LEG?
ARM is a non-Intel CPU used in phones, tablets, and now MacBooks and Mac desktops. I'm sure Microsoft will come out with LEG chips soon enough to compete. :lol:

Crystal is a bit long in the tooth--a tad bright and thin for my taste these days, but I used to use it for pretty much everything. I designed whole songs just to showcase a single patch I made.

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GRRRRRRR!
12579 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:14 pm

chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
Microsoft always was about compatibility, although Windows 11 is a bit of a blow for that.
Says who? Can you name even one compatibility issue anyone has had that can't be fixed by installing the latest driver? I've read about performance issues and issues with Windows 11 itself but I am unaware of any compatibility issues from anyone, even after searching for problems on line.
pdxindy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:24 pm
It's not a mess for me... Today I added a 100 duplicate tracks of a Dune 3 preset each playing 4-6 notes and my new MBP was nowhere near its limit. And that is with the project @ 96khz! Plus it was barely even warm and it was silent.
Hardly impressive, DUNE is one of the most CPU efficient plugins around and I don't notice any increase in CPU use running my I/O device at 48kHz or 96kHz anyway. Try doing the same thing with 100 different plugins and see how that goes.
syntonica wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:33 pm
After hearing PC fan noise for 30 years, I find it a blessing to use my absolutely silent M1 Mini.
Really? You never heard of liquid cooling? My last 2-in-1 was liquid cooled, it didn't even have a fan. I bought it more than 3 years ago now so Apple are just catching up. Seems ignorance is a prerequisite for Apple fandom. Or maybe it's just gullibility?
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KVRAF
20442 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:28 pm

syntonica wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:33 pm
Chrisk-K wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:27 pm
pdxindy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:24 pm
chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
Look at this bloody mess Apple created for developers and users.
It's not a mess for me... Today I added a 100 duplicate tracks of a Dune 3 preset each playing 4-6 notes and my new MBP was nowhere near its limit. And that is with the project @ 96khz! Plus it was barely even warm and it was silent. Best freaking laptop ever made! Apple has done a great job IMO.
After hearing PC fan noise for 30 years, I find it a blessing to use my absolutely silent M1 Mini. I will never go back to the Windows realm.
You obviously haven't heard my MacBook Pro... :hihi:
I could cook breakfast on my Intel MBP :lol:

The new Apple Silicon MBP is amazing. Much of the time it is hard to tell if it is warmer than ambient temperature... even under loads that would have my previous one making loud annoying fan noise, it is still silent.

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KVRian

Topic Starter

1135 posts since 25 Sep, 2014 from Specific Northwest

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:29 pm

BONES wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:14 pm
syntonica wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:33 pm
After hearing PC fan noise for 30 years, I find it a blessing to use my absolutely silent M1 Mini.
Really? You never heard of liquid cooling? My last 2-in-1 was liquid cooled, it didn't even have a fan. I bought it more than 3 years ago now so Apple are just catching up. Seems ignorance is a prerequisite for Apple fandom. Or maybe it's just gullibility?
Not my quote, I never said that. :P

KVRist
260 posts since 4 Jun, 2020 from USA

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:54 pm

Liquid cooled PCs are not silent. Pumps make noise and PSU fans make noise.

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KVRAF
6369 posts since 6 Jan, 2017 from Outer Space

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:45 pm

Chrisk-K wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:54 pm
Liquid cooled PCs are not silent. Pumps make noise and PSU fans make noise.
And they are way bigger than a Mac mini and eat about 10 times more power for the same task… Or has BONES a water cooled laptop?
I was very sceptic when I first heard of the move to M1. Now I consider to get one. It will outperform my (very silent) 10-core Mac Pro easily…

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KVRAF
3879 posts since 15 Aug, 2003 from seattle

Post Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:59 pm

Finding this a little strange, M1 compatibility has really started to Ramp up, IK just ported SampleTank, Arturia ported their entire line up of over 30 instruments and dozens of FX.

Glenn Olander is still active, works for Spectrassonics I believe, He occasionally keeps Crystal up to date, wouldn't doubt he ports it at some point.

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KVRian
1232 posts since 2 Sep, 2019

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:54 am

There are a few that I have that are indespensible that I am worried about: Relab LX480, Parallax-Audio Virtual Sound Stage 2, and PG-8X.

I am particularly concerned about these because they don’t even support VST3, which I take as a bad sign.

I have already written off PhoenixVerb because iZotope (the worst audio company since Roger Nichols Digital) has made it clear they have killed it off. I’ve found Acon Digital Verberate is an adequate replacement.
THIS MUSIC HAS BEEN MIXED TO BE PLAYED LOUD SO TURN IT UP

KVRAF
5005 posts since 17 Dec, 2009

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:59 am

chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
That's the best anyway. Look at this bloody mess Apple created for developers and users. Microsoft always was about compatibility, although Windows 11 is a bit of a blow for that. Nonetheless, it probably will never be like with Apple, i.e. that they excercise full control over the user's hardware.
I don't feel mess at all. I'm pretty much 90% running native and i can do more on a 13" laptop than i could do on a desktop 3 years ago. Some like fabfilter were running native before my mbp even shipped a year ago.
Dunno how developers are, seen a few that were disgruntled, seen a few that were impressed by sheer power these chips hold in such package.

i'd much rather have that than drag dependencies from decades ago just so i can open some abandoned piece of code.
Image

KVRAF
30000 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:19 am

BONES wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:14 pm
chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
Microsoft always was about compatibility, although Windows 11 is a bit of a blow for that.
Says who? Can you name even one compatibility issue anyone has had that can't be fixed by installing the latest driver? I've read about performance issues and issues with Windows 11 itself but I am unaware of any compatibility issues from anyone, even after searching for problems on line.
Well, one thing is for sure: Windows 11 is not supported on CPU's which are older than, like, 4 years ago, or mainboards which don't have TPM 2.0, or which can't be outfitted with a soft TPM.

Windows 10 ran on any kind of hardware, if it was fast enough to give you a good experience. Who knows what Microsoft will imprint with the next version of Windows. They seem to want to boost the desktop and laptop market, along with the OEM's. Otherwise such synthetic system requirements are not understandable.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

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KVRian
1074 posts since 2 Jul, 2018

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:14 am

chk071 wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 2:19 am
BONES wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:14 pm
chk071 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:16 pm
Microsoft always was about compatibility, although Windows 11 is a bit of a blow for that.
Says who? Can you name even one compatibility issue anyone has had that can't be fixed by installing the latest driver? I've read about performance issues and issues with Windows 11 itself but I am unaware of any compatibility issues from anyone, even after searching for problems on line.
I can confirm that Windows 11 works extremely well, fast and is very stable. I run it on my gaming PC since the developer-beta was available. Meanwhile all (minor) issues that I experienced were fixed from Microsoft's side. I also did not experience any serious problems with the drivers.
Microsoft takes big attention on keeping everything compatibe. During the last 10 years we did not experience a single compatibility issue with our plugins after a new Windows version was released.

TPM is available on large parts of the more modern mainboards. However, some more exotic CPU seem to be unsupported by Win11. You may have to activate TPM in in the BIOS. There are also ways to bypass the TPM check. But I do not recommend this, since it is not sure that you'll receive Windows upgrades when doing this.
Last edited by Markus Krause on Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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KVRAF
30000 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:18 am

If you have current hardware, then Windows 11 is compatible. If you run a below 8the gen Intel or AMD equivalent, you're out of luck.

Windows 11 itself should be as compatible as ever, of course, if you run it on current hardware. After all, there hasn't been much changed since Windows 10. Apart from the (syntheitcally imposed) system requirements, which require you to buy a new computer, if you bought your current one more than 4 years ago. Tough luck.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

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KVRian
1074 posts since 2 Jul, 2018

Post Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:24 am

chk071 wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:18 am
If you have current hardware, then Windows 11 is compatible. If you run a below 8the gen Intel or AMD equivalent, you're out of luck.

Windows 11 itself should be as compatible as ever, of course, if you run it on current hardware. After all, there hasn't been much changed since Windows 10. Apart from the (syntheitcally imposed) system requirements, which require you to buy a new computer, if you bought your current one more than 4 years ago. Tough luck.
Windows 11 does not require TPM 2.0. TPM 1.2 is sufficient. This one is available on nearly all CPUs/Mainboards, except they are very old.
They enforce TPM because of security reasons. With TPM it is be much more difficult for ransomware to encrypt the harddisc.
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Tone2 Audiosoftware https://www.tone2.com

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