Additive synths?

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
Examigan
KVRAF
6324 posts since 15 Sep, 2005 from East Coast of the USA

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 3:19 am

Loom II is discounted on the VSTBuzz website, but I have seen it for even less here and there. If you wait a while it will probably be on sale again on Plugin Boutique's site.

HunterKiller
KVRAF
2149 posts since 10 Mar, 2006

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:38 am

kevink wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:05 pm
I've been using Cube 2 for many years and it's still in rotation on my DAWs. Experimented with several other additives from the period (Cameleon/Alchemy, Spectra) which were OK but not necessarily better, and they've disappeared from the marketplace since. Picked up Loom II a couple of years ago, but only recently started playing with it seriously. I like it more than most, but it's worth noting that there appears to no longer be any development or support for the AIR products. Seems to be stable on Windows 10 so I'll be able to get a couple more years out of it. Given that computing power of the average DAW should be good enough for a *lot* of additive oscillators these days, I'm surprised that there isn't a proper successor to Cube 2 or Alchemy.
The software plugin industry is in a very different period currently to what it was in during the first years of the new millennium.

The thoughts back then were very as they were in the 90's, 80's, 70's, which is to try to go as far out there in terms of timbre as possible. That was the driving motivation regarding almost all synthesis, with short stint attempts at real world emulation.

Now we've turned towards emulating synthesis and real world as well as possible, and I suspect slowly things will turn towards more adventurous paths again. But it'll be different, because we already have had a lot of that stuff with our current technologies and methods. We've already heard sounds that could not have been imagined to a generation prior to synthesis, and people are tired - unless you give them intimate control over the sound, controls that meaningfully change sound but do not overwhelm the brain. Therein lies future synth development, and part of that will be additive - which has always lied on the outskirts due to its complexity, but it will one day be the primary way to make sounds, and other methods will be seen as primitive, inadequate, or too machine-like. Because the more technological power we have, the more a certain portion of people in the world will start to value the humanity again. Others on the other hand will lose their humanity because of their obsession with technology and a lack of understanding of many things.

Because we're in this period, additive synthesis which requires next-gen control, which meaningfully manipulates sound in real time, awaits that period when such things are possible, cheap, and sought after. All all of the research into what makes a synthetic timbre sound humane and inviting to our ears will be used in making the next-gen additives.
"The educated person is one who knows how to find out what he does not know" - George Simmel
“It's what you learn after you know it all that counts.” - John Wooden

anttimaatteri
KVRian
609 posts since 17 Nov, 2015 from Yuma

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:52 am

EnGee wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:37 am
Dark Synth anyone? Sounds good, needs Ableton Live though^^
Dark Synth
Seems a great synth. I will see if there is a demo to download and give it a go.

Edit: Oops! It seems there is no demo!
yea thats the major letdown. i dont even know if its possible to use that one in ableton intro. that would be, sales actions included, 79+39 bucks. which is in the end a usual pricing for synth plugins at least. given that one have to use ableton live then. ^^

edit: nope its no usable. only ableton suite has the max live unit.

ReleaseCandidate
KVRian
526 posts since 19 Oct, 2020

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 5:01 am

anttimaatteri wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:52 am
EnGee wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:37 am
Dark Synth anyone? Sounds good, needs Ableton Live though^^
Dark Synth
Seems a great synth. I will see if there is a demo to download and give it a go.

Edit: Oops! It seems there is no demo!
yea thats the major letdown. i dont even know if its possible to use that one in ableton intro. that would be, sales actions included, 79+39 bucks. which is in the end a usual pricing for synth plugins at least. given that one have to use ableton live then. ^^

edit: nope its no usable. only ableton suite has the max live unit.
Yes, and you can only buy M4L for Standard, but not for Intro.

User avatar
WasteLand
KVRAF
2218 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 5:32 am

indeed spectral/additive synthesizers are hard to find. yes Cube 2 is pretty good, expensive, but i went down the expensive road, for another type of synthesis (granular), that means cube 2 will be on the long list for now.

i have synclavier V, spectra additive resynthesizer (that is based on the K5000, i believe), some other spectral effects, or manipulators, for VCV rack and M4L.

of course; MSoundFactory.

for me, let's call it FFT, or better spectral (additive and spectral are different..), the things you can do with it, are extensive. i have stuff all over the place, so i succeed what i want to do. and i like it. perhaps i must take a plunge into M4L, fft~ ....

but a spectral/additve synth.. o well... i play with what i have got. Zebra2 gives also the experimental results i want.

EDIT: the 'Frequency Domain' modules for VCV rack, are spectral based, and contains also a granular module. and a spectral-streams module, has i call it for now, i have not had the time to master them, yet. made some first experiments.
worth looking into, VCV rack is free, as the Frequency Domain modules.
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

EnGee
KVRAF
7632 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:09 pm

anttimaatteri wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:52 am
EnGee wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:37 am
Dark Synth anyone? Sounds good, needs Ableton Live though^^
Dark Synth
Seems a great synth. I will see if there is a demo to download and give it a go.

Edit: Oops! It seems there is no demo!
yea thats the major letdown. i dont even know if its possible to use that one in ableton intro. that would be, sales actions included, 79+39 bucks. which is in the end a usual pricing for synth plugins at least. given that one have to use ableton live then. ^^

edit: nope its no usable. only ableton suite has the max live unit.
I have Live Suite but I can't buy it if I don't know the cpu usage. M4L devices are cpu hungry usually and I tend to escape them.

Anyway, can't imagine a sound that I can't find or make in my additive synth collection. I usually use FM synths more, but if I choose to remain with just one additive synth, that would be Razor.

If Intro is your main DAW, I think Operator is a great FM with spectral oscillators of 64 partials. It's a powerful synth and a pleasure to program.

biscuitdough
KVRist
142 posts since 8 Jun, 2019

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:52 pm

EnGee wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:09 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:52 am
EnGee wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:37 am
Dark Synth anyone? Sounds good, needs Ableton Live though^^
Dark Synth
Seems a great synth. I will see if there is a demo to download and give it a go.

Edit: Oops! It seems there is no demo!
yea thats the major letdown. i dont even know if its possible to use that one in ableton intro. that would be, sales actions included, 79+39 bucks. which is in the end a usual pricing for synth plugins at least. given that one have to use ableton live then. ^^

edit: nope its no usable. only ableton suite has the max live unit.
I have Live Suite but I can't buy it if I don't know the cpu usage. M4L devices are cpu hungry usually and I tend to escape them.

Anyway, can't imagine a sound that I can't find or make in my additive synth collection. I usually use FM synths more, but if I choose to remain with just one additive synth, that would be Razor.

If Intro is your main DAW, I think Operator is a great FM with spectral oscillators of 64 partials. It's a powerful synth and a pleasure to program.
I think Operator is now only included with Suite.

EnGee
KVRAF
7632 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Post Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:35 pm

You could buy it separately in the past. Have they changed that?

I think you can buy it for $87 (discounted from $109). I changed my license from Suite 10 to Intro 9 (I have both but not related) and could see it in the shop:
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anttimaatteri
KVRian
609 posts since 17 Nov, 2015 from Yuma

Post Wed Feb 03, 2021 5:07 am

i have ableton 10 suite since its release ;D. but dark synth has still a hard time even with sale. one of the rasons for sure is that one can not demo it^^. all synths i bought i demoed very long time beforehand.

and i guess its cpu hog galore, due to its nature^^.

User avatar
WasteLand
KVRAF
2218 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Wed Feb 03, 2021 5:19 am

anttimaatteri wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 5:07 am
i have ableton 10 suite since its release ;D. but dark synth has still a hard time even with sale. one of the rasons for sure is that one can not demo it^^. all synths i bought i demoed very long time beforehand.

and i guess its cpu hog galore, due to its nature^^.
due to that it is a german/EU country, i believe within 14 days, you can get your money back.
same with steinberg for instance. so you can demo it, by buying it... and ask a refund, yes, ableton provides that, the last order was for live 11 suite update, and there were the same conditions mentioned; 14 days.
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

User avatar
WasteLand
KVRAF
2218 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Wed Feb 03, 2021 5:20 am

EnGee wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:09 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 4:52 am
EnGee wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 12:58 pm
anttimaatteri wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 9:37 am
Dark Synth anyone? Sounds good, needs Ableton Live though^^
Dark Synth
Seems a great synth. I will see if there is a demo to download and give it a go.

Edit: Oops! It seems there is no demo!
yea thats the major letdown. i dont even know if its possible to use that one in ableton intro. that would be, sales actions included, 79+39 bucks. which is in the end a usual pricing for synth plugins at least. given that one have to use ableton live then. ^^

edit: nope its no usable. only ableton suite has the max live unit.
I have Live Suite but I can't buy it if I don't know the cpu usage. M4L devices are cpu hungry usually and I tend to escape them.

Anyway, can't imagine a sound that I can't find or make in my additive synth collection. I usually use FM synths more, but if I choose to remain with just one additive synth, that would be Razor.

If Intro is your main DAW, I think Operator is a great FM with spectral oscillators of 64 partials. It's a powerful synth and a pleasure to program.
indeed operator, quite powerfull, suprisingly powerfull.
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

User avatar
WasteLand
KVRAF
2218 posts since 8 Jun, 2018

Post Sun Nov 28, 2021 2:51 am

the VST version of Harmor is still available...

https://www.jrrshop.com/image-line-harmor

nice price, i did buy it. wasn't planning to buy more synths, but this price..

you get also the version for within FL Studio by the way, didn't know that, don't own FL Studio (would be my 6th DAW, but perhaps someday..).

but; Harmor as VST, not supported anymore, ok, but still...
take me as apple as reed-son as flesh-icon, immediately
shits the wise man. hero and blind. take me as
stick as tongue as dog... Music & Soundscraping

dune_rave
KVRAF
2172 posts since 23 Jun, 2006 from Hungary

Post Sun Nov 28, 2021 4:51 am

i have blade2 for sale. nice synth, but i have many synths and decided blade should go

Dark Lights
Banned
194 posts since 25 Apr, 2021

Post Sun Nov 28, 2021 6:17 am

Pigments 3 additive engine is enough to make those cold alien sounds. Additive should be fun to use and Pigments does this very well. I have Harmor, but it is more complex hence harder to use.

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