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Will Bitwig ever "finish" the clip launcher?
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- KVRist
- 233 posts since 16 May, 2012 from Sverige
I'm no user of clip launcher, for more than backup and storing clips in. But I recorded a clip of what I believe is the sync issue people have:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgu5ot77C1M
Description has timemarks. When moving cue point back to "1.1" the clip should sync to metronome once again, which it does until changing clip and it stops working. In the timeline it seems to sync when moving cue points, so the clip launcher should be able to do the same.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgu5ot77C1M
Description has timemarks. When moving cue point back to "1.1" the clip should sync to metronome once again, which it does until changing clip and it stops working. In the timeline it seems to sync when moving cue points, so the clip launcher should be able to do the same.
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- Banned
- 20 posts since 21 Dec, 2021
Yes, you correctly.backtomusic wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 6:14 am I'm no user of clip launcher, for more than backup and storing clips in. But I recorded a clip of what I believe is the sync issue people have:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgu5ot77C1M
Description has timemarks. When moving cue point back to "1.1" the clip should sync to metronome once again, which it does until changing clip and it stops working. In the timeline it seems to sync when moving cue points, so the clip launcher should be able to do the same.
And Yes, it's supposed to stay in Sync to BPM no matter the Loop bracket length or Position or Cue position.
Another Note,
Strictly talking Sync to BPM
Not talking about sounding "Out of Groove/Pocket"
Last edited by vladovachIII on Wed Dec 22, 2021 6:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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- Banned
- 20 posts since 21 Dec, 2021
antic604 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 3:47 am For the love of God, why can't anyone just record a short video showing the problem?
It's obvious that when you edit the clip or set loop to some weird length the clip will go out of sync. Perhaps Live avoids this because you can't do much with the audio in Session View, contrary to Bitwig? Or perhaps there's indeed a bug I simply haven't encountered (I rarely use audio and even then I'll just chop it up to Sampler or Drum Machine).
Why anyone does not understand basic fundamentals of how loops, brackets, cue markers and warping on a daw that copied the idea from Ableton who did it for 20 years. and Final Scratch/Traktor does same
Serato does same, serato sample does same.
Lock loop to BPM while moving loop brackets
THIS IS BASIC function of Session view for 20 years
YES BASIC CORE FUNCTIONING.
One would think it would be much wiser to keep Silent then to Speak Loudly and end up being a Fool because Yet again that person Failed to understand the basic Concept
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1323 posts since 17 Oct, 2018
Audio clips on my end. Like I've said I don't use the clip launcher heavily enough to tell you the specific steps but it has happened to me before across many sessions. I never really mentioned it before because I just thought of it as a quirk of Bitwig vs a bug like the previously mentioned bar recording issue. I will keep an eye out for the issue and report back how to reproduce or take a video as suggested. I do know that for me it happens often enough to be noticeable.pdxindy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 21, 2021 9:28 pmAudio clips? Midi clips? or both?
I just tried for about 30 minutes with a few audio clips, cutting and editing audio events inside the clip. I could not get it to go off sync. Of course if I change the clip length to an odd amount it will loop out of sync. Otherwise, so far I could not get it out of sync.
Studio One // Bitwig // Logic Pro // Ableton // Reason // FLStudio // MPC // Force // Maschine
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1323 posts since 17 Oct, 2018
Yes!! This is the issue. You can hear the clip not sync back when moving the start point back to the beginning of the loop unless you restart the scene.backtomusic wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 6:14 am I'm no user of clip launcher, for more than backup and storing clips in. But I recorded a clip of what I believe is the sync issue people have:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgu5ot77C1M
Description has timemarks. When moving cue point back to "1.1" the clip should sync to metronome once again, which it does until changing clip and it stops working. In the timeline it seems to sync when moving cue points, so the clip launcher should be able to do the same.
Studio One // Bitwig // Logic Pro // Ableton // Reason // FLStudio // MPC // Force // Maschine
- KVRAF
- 25704 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
In case it got lost in the previous page and lots of text...
In Bitwig, Cmd+Shift+I creates a new scene from playing clips.
- KVRAF
- 25704 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
I've only watched videos of Live's new Scene Follow Actions (I have Live 11 but not installed)... but they seem pretty limited unless there is more to it than was shown.
I often have 2-3 scenes in Bitwig Clip Launcher that contain clips and the whole thing plays as one section because there are individual clips with Next Actions that go to the following clip.
So Track 1 has 3 clips (Scenes 1-3) and Track 2 has 2 clips (Scenes 1-2) so as it plays it is moving between Scenes 1, 2 and 3. Then after a time period of Tracks 1 and 2 looping independently, I want to go to Scene 5. Scene Next Actions as implemented in Live wouldn't deal with that.
And Next Actions (Follow Actions in Live) have no branching Logic. That is the ultimate limitation cause you cannot do stuff like go from Clip 1 to Clip 2 4 times then go to Clip 3
What I have thought about as a further development would be an arrange 'track' like the cue markers. You would put in Scene markers that said Play Scene 1, then next Marker says Play Scene 3 and so on. Then you can do the equivalent of a Song Mode like in an Elektron Box. That would allow stuff like play Scenes 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 3, 1, 2... the kind of stuff not possible even if Scene Next Actions were implemented.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1323 posts since 17 Oct, 2018
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1323 posts since 17 Oct, 2018
That would be cool. I know Ableton's Scene Actions are limited but its better than nothing. I would definitely like something more robust and more importantly for me easily accessible via hardware scripts.pdxindy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:46 amI've only watched videos of Live's new Scene Follow Actions (I have Live 11 but not installed)... but they seem pretty limited unless there is more to it than was shown.
I often have 2-3 scenes in Bitwig Clip Launcher that contain clips and the whole thing plays as one section because there are individual clips with Next Actions that go to the following clip.
So Track 1 has 3 clips (Scenes 1-3) and Track 2 has 2 clips (Scenes 1-2) so as it plays it is moving between Scenes 1, 2 and 3. Then after a time period of Tracks 1 and 2 looping independently, I want to go to Scene 5. Scene Next Actions as implemented in Live wouldn't deal with that.
And Next Actions (Follow Actions in Live) have no branching Logic. That is the ultimate limitation cause you cannot do stuff like go from Clip 1 to Clip 2 4 times then go to Clip 3
What I have thought about as a further development would be an arrange 'track' like the cue markers. You would put in Scene markers that said Play Scene 1, then next Marker says Play Scene 3 and so on. Then you can do the equivalent of a Song Mode like in an Elektron Box. That would allow stuff like play Scenes 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 3, 1, 2... the kind of stuff not possible even if Scene Next Actions were implemented.
Studio One // Bitwig // Logic Pro // Ableton // Reason // FLStudio // MPC // Force // Maschine
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- Banned
- 20 posts since 21 Dec, 2021
I like and use clip actions. can be creativeapoclypse wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:56 amThat would be cool. I know Ableton's Scene Actions are limited but its better than nothing. I would definitely like something more robust and more importantly for me easily accessible via hardware scripts.pdxindy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:46 amI've only watched videos of Live's new Scene Follow Actions (I have Live 11 but not installed)... but they seem pretty limited unless there is more to it than was shown.
I often have 2-3 scenes in Bitwig Clip Launcher that contain clips and the whole thing plays as one section because there are individual clips with Next Actions that go to the following clip.
So Track 1 has 3 clips (Scenes 1-3) and Track 2 has 2 clips (Scenes 1-2) so as it plays it is moving between Scenes 1, 2 and 3. Then after a time period of Tracks 1 and 2 looping independently, I want to go to Scene 5. Scene Next Actions as implemented in Live wouldn't deal with that.
And Next Actions (Follow Actions in Live) have no branching Logic. That is the ultimate limitation cause you cannot do stuff like go from Clip 1 to Clip 2 4 times then go to Clip 3
What I have thought about as a further development would be an arrange 'track' like the cue markers. You would put in Scene markers that said Play Scene 1, then next Marker says Play Scene 3 and so on. Then you can do the equivalent of a Song Mode like in an Elektron Box. That would allow stuff like play Scenes 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 3, 1, 2... the kind of stuff not possible even if Scene Next Actions were implemented.
Now, Scene follow actions are not really needed.
i don't care either way.
The reason why is because the Session view allows you(The user) to be the Sequencer to make your own sequences and patterns. You are the "Logic"
And, It gives the "live" feel to a track or a Liveset.
So, you
1)create loops or midi in Session view
2)copy/paste/duplicate clips to scene and into variations of scenes.
3)use whatever Scene Launch trigger quant(1bar)
(1/4 beat works great)
4) Record button active
5)8 Bars , Trigger a new scene in any order, repeat until full song.
6)Automation added in realtime
Or both
Automation added in Arrangement view
7)Once Full Track/Song recorded, switch to Arrangement view
8)Arrangement view automation/minor timing adjustments, mixing
9)Export to Audio
Bitwig make this easier with both Session and Arrangment on same view.
You don't have to Trigger a new scene at 8bars.
1 bar or 100bars or even 1beat it is up to you to use the Feeling, Groove and Logic to make your sound.
Scenes generally should be Triggered somewhat musically though.
This gives a "real" or "live" feel to your arrangements.
much more than "next actions"
- Banned
- 11467 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland
Thanks, that makes it a lot clearer! I compared the behaviour with Live and indeed Bitwig seems to lose sync sometimes, but not always. It's weird.backtomusic wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 6:14 am I'm no user of clip launcher, for more than backup and storing clips in. But I recorded a clip of what I believe is the sync issue people have:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgu5ot77C1M
Description has timemarks. When moving cue point back to "1.1" the clip should sync to metronome once again, which it does until changing clip and it stops working. In the timeline it seems to sync when moving cue points, so the clip launcher should be able to do the same.
It works in Arranger because there it visibly shifts the waveform against the timeline, whereas in Clip Launcher it only does some calculations behind the scenes and probably - depending at which moment you do the edits - it either gets the correct result and syncs or fails. Send that to support.
- KVRAF
- 25704 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
I like the Groups in Bitwig better than Scenes... cause I can have space between which is visually helpful.
There are also key commands for the first 40 Scenes in Bitwig... I assume those could be accessed via script.