Phase Plant , OK Now what ?

[rj0]

Imagine you would have to by Dune without access to the effects, arp and unison settings then buy these separately in order to be able to modify the factory presets, kind of absurd IMO.

That's a feature, not a bug, it could be considered "accurate hardware acquisition modeling" . I mean not all OTB synths have effects or an arpeggiator, so you need to buy different boxes to get that functionality. j/k

It's clearly a "feature", for them.

[Dirtgrain]

Phase Plant has two unison settings, global and oscillator--that can be adjusted--requires no snap-ins. Am I missing something there?

[BONES]

Yes, you're missing the fact that people make absurd assumptions, based on zero evidence, in order to support their preconceived notions about certain things.

I would go in on that, but all the buzz seems to be that the minimal version is effectively crippled. It's not clear to me what the truth is. Someone here was saying there's no control over the filter?

That's just perception, the reality is that the base package is completely usable out of the box. That said, the one Snap-In I would get up-front is the Non-Linear Filter because the standard filter in PP is pretty generic. Which is to say that of course it comes with a filter and of course you have lots of control over it. As you surmise, the rest are just effects, you don't need them at all. In fact, it's amazing what you can do with just one Analog Osc and a Filter. e.g. Try playing around with the different unison modes.

I completely agree with you. There are way better options out there and for much less.

Really, like what? What other VSTi out there can have [absurd fencepost stuff removed] ... How about the three lane bus into the master output? That's pretty much unique, too, I think.

*cough* Zebra *cough* Falcon *cough* BitWig *cough*

Kind of proves my point when you have to name the biggest, most expensive and well regarded VSTi, and then a whole f**king DAW, doesn't it? It puts PP in rare and esteemed company, where it belongs.

Imagine you would have to by Dune without access to the effects, arp and unison settings then buy these separately in order to be able to modify the factory presets, kind of absurd IMO.

I'd buy DUNE without effects or ARP in a heartbeat if, like PP, it was half the price. (You get one of the best unison implementations ever in PP, it's not something you have to pay extra for.) In fact, I begged Rich for ages to do a cut-down DUNE without that shit or the layers but he wasn't interested. I wouldn't give a shit about modifying factory presets if it was a lot easier to make your own.

[zerocrossing]

When I log in, it shows me that I own 43 effect plugins that I got for free. I have no memory of this. When I look though my email, the only email I have from them that I opened was confirming my email. Does this mean that if I buy the cheapest version of Phase Plant I can use the plugins that I somehow got? If that’s true, I’d maybe go for it, but it’s unclear because their site still shows me the ability to buy versions with extra bundles.

So when you login on their website, go to profile and scroll all the way down, it will tell you which licenses you own. I assume that's where you are seeing the 43 effects, right? If you click of any of the fx you own, it will show you what type of license, where you got it and when. It's possible that the licenses are expired trial licenses for example. Somehow doesn't seem very likely to me to have picked up that many of them for free... But if you do have valid licenses, then yes, you can use them in Phase Plant, MultiPass, SnapHeap or individually...

Also FYI OP and others, there are a few good ones that can be picked up through Computer Magazin, incl. Slice EQ if you didn't know. Also brings down the upgrade price.

Ah, you’re right. Most of them are expired licenses that I must have signed up for when I tried out Phase Plant. Why the hell would they be listed there? Stupid.

I’m sure people get a lot out of Phase Plant, but for me, they’re too close to duplicating what I have, and when Zebra 3 hits the scene, I’m sure it’ll be de bomb, as the kids say. I can also modulate the hell out of anything I need in Bitwig, so having effects in the synth engine is less important. I can’t see the point of dealing with their nonsense, but wake me if they ever come to their senses and want to behave like most other developers.

[BONES]

What nonsense? Their sales model is perfectly reasonable and the way it ties in with their installation and upgrade manager is second to none. Kilohearts is definitely one of my favourite devs to deal with, it's all so effortless and friendly with those guys. You need to be a little less rigid in your thinking.

[dune_rave]

this plugin is brilliant. no other developer could embed space invader game in a plugin.

SugerBytes Cyclops has a better built in space invaders type game along time before PP

no, that is not space invaders just a cheap copy, not even a copy!

Much more fun that the one in PP as the aliens don't drop missiles- kinda pointless! I was always more of a Robotron fan anyway

Okay, no missiles, I also miss that. But phase plant has the best game in plugins. And Multipass includes 'Snake'.

[Super Piano Hater 64]

If Phase Plant 2 runs Doom, I’ll buy it on the spot.

[rj0]

I remember occasionally buying Lite versions of plugins (or other applications) wherein the Lite version would have the complete menus, controls, and presets of the Full version, but some options would have locks showing, or disabled controls, or popups when selected, as constant reminders that you can't use those particular features unless you upgrade to the Full version. Depending on how annoying this experience was, one could either tolerate it or uninstall the app/plugin/whatever. That kind of thing can be a tolerable or really frustrating experience, depending on how blatant it is, as well as the mindset and approach that one comes into it with.

Phase Plant's main engine is fortunately unencumbered, but as one gets into FX and factory (or expansion) presets one can start having that Lite experience (unless one goes the full and expensive Monty). I chose to enjoy the extremely capable engine and modest usable FX, and just ignore the factory presets and roll my own. Not the most pleasant choice, but works for me.

[LeVzi]

What nonsense? Their sales model is perfectly reasonable and the way it ties in with their installation and upgrade manager is second to none. Kilohearts is definitely one of my favourite devs to deal with, it's all so effortless and friendly with those guys. You need to be a little less rigid in your thinking.

So you'd buy a synth, with few effects basic or advanced, use external effects to sound design and think that's alright ?

So swapping GUI's for the effects, go back, change parameters, all that HASSLE and you'd be cool with it ?

If you can work that way, more power to you, but I certainly can't and I doubt anyone else would want to.

[SLiC]

Just a reminder that a lot of the more interesting FX in pre-sets are often mapped to the macros (so you have some control even if you don't own the fx) and 'from memory' (I own ultimate now) you can use these mapped, unowned fx if you save the pre-sets as your own and use it as a basis for a new sound. I also got a free $30 voucher from KH so pretty much ended up with a decent bag of stuff (and the free stuff from mag ware) for less than $99 on the sale...no complaints, great value even after eventually going up to toolbox ultimate which cost no more than Falcon in the end (and at least has a demo!)

[SLiC]

So you'd buy a synth, with few effects basic or advanced, use external effects to sound design and think that's alright ?

It's more than alright, it often gives better results.

Built in FX are 'convenient' but rarely if ever as good as dedicated hardware or software FX. With almost any DAW the 3rd party FX can be modulated along with the system (this is very easy if you make a rack in Bitwig or Live)

There isn't much point owning high quality FX Plugins like Eventide, Vallhalla or Soundtoys if you don't do this. I very rarely use a synths built in reverb or delay, prefer busses. I normally use external compressors and distortions as well...

[LeVzi]

So you'd buy a synth, with few effects basic or advanced, use external effects to sound design and think that's alright ?

It's more than alright, it often gives better results.

Built in FX are 'convenient' but rarely if ever as good as dedicated hardware or software FX. With almost any DAW the 3rd party FX can be modulated along with the system (this is very easy if you make a rack in Bitwig or Live)

There isn't much point owning high quality FX Plugins like Eventide, Vallhalla or Soundtoys if you don't do this. I very rarely use a synths built in reverb or delay, prefer busses. I normally use external compressors and distortions as well...

Everyone works differently, I like to get the basic sound out of the synth I am looking for, if I cannot do that, (Which is extremely rare) I have to use external, that mainly happens on reverbs tbh.

THEN I would add things like soundtoys etc. So clicking back and forth from external effects to the synth GUI would really cripple workflow.

And if people are doing that with PP, kinda says a lot for the quality of PP effects really doesn't it.

[SLiC]

And if people are doing that with PP, kinda says a lot for the quality of PP effects really doesn't it.

I suspect people are doing that with all software synths, PP has more 'interesting' FX possibilities than most VST synths but you can do the same with TRIAD or others externally.

I have toolkit ultimate, I don't think the 'bread and butter fx' are very good (although there are a few unique and interesting ones) - the reverb and delay for example are quite basic....but, there are some fun fx in there and it's the 'holistic' way they are used in parallel and with frequency splitting etc that makes them 'fun' and creative....

Personally I didn't buy PP for the FX, more the audio rate modulation and modular workflow (worth 99 bucks to me) but now I have all of the FX the 3 lanes and modulation make it fun and interesting and that's enough for me...it is what it is and there are lots of good alternatives now that were not as good back when PP was launched (such as Pigments 3.5 which would be a good alternative)

[BONES]

So you'd buy a synth, with few effects basic or advanced, use external effects to sound design and think that's alright ?

I've been doing exactly that for 80% of the time I've been making music.

So swapping GUI's for the effects, go back, change parameters, all that HASSLE and you'd be cool with it ?

Why would I have to do that? I use Studio One, my effect GUIs are visible in the mixer and most of the synths I use are small enough that they don't get in the way of the rest of what I'm doing. Like this -

S1_Motion.jpg

If you can work that way, more power to you, but I certainly can't and I doubt anyone else would want to.

Every mixer channel visible, with effects parameters visible, even with an instrument GUI open. OTOH, pretty much every synth I can think of with on-board effects hides them away on a different tab or panel, which makes my way more efficient and more flexible. So, yeah, I can work this way much better than you can work your way.

And if people are doing that with PP, kinda says a lot for the quality of PP effects really doesn't it.

No, really it just says a lot about how little most people really know about what they are doing, how little thought they put into it.

[LeVzi]

And if people are doing that with PP, kinda says a lot for the quality of PP effects really doesn't it.

I suspect people are doing that with all software synths, PP has more 'interesting' FX possibilities than most VST synths but you can do the same with TRIAD or others externally.

I have toolkit ultimate, I don't think the 'bread and butter fx' are very good (although there are a few unique and interesting ones) - the reverb and delay for example are quite basic....but, there are some fun fx in there and it's the 'holistic' way they are used in parallel and with frequency splitting etc that makes them 'fun' and creative....

Personally I didn't buy PP for the FX, more the audio rate modulation and modular workflow (worth 99 bucks to me) but now I have all of the FX the 3 lanes and modulation make it fun and interesting and that's enough for me...it is what it is and there are lots of good alternatives now that were not as good back when PP was launched (such as Pigments 3.5 which would be a good alternative)

Yeah but it's nice to have a choice, I use a lot of the onboard effects because they work well. If I want more or something else works better, yeah i'll load it into the insert slot. So far the FX I have in PP are pretty decent, and I am using them , although still learning the synth atm, so early days yet to get the most out of it.