Creating dub delay fx?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV3o622KqwQ

How do you do something like this on Reaper? This clip is in Ableton (with which I'm completely unfamiliar), I couldn't find anything pertaining to Reaper. I'm trying to create dub delay effects myself, but by automating the feedback on the delay itself which isn't easy on a midi controller with limited inputs. :D

He seems to be feeding a send with a delay back into itself so you can control that kind of feedback effect, but I cannot parse how this could be done in Reaper. Could someone help? I like these fx but messing around with automation and not a live mixing setup is a pain the ass.

I'm using cherry audio's stardust tape echo plug in, but I guess any similar delay fx would work.

ThanksHow do you do something like this on Reaper? This clip is in Ableton (with which I'm completely unfamiliar), I couldn't find anything pertaining to Reaper. I'm trying to create dub delay effects myself, but by automating the feedback on the delay itself which isn't easy on a midi controller with limited inputs. :D

He seems to be feeding a send with a delay back into itself so you can control that kind of feedback effect, but I cannot parse how this could be done in Reaper. Could someone help? I like these fx but messing around with automation and not a live mixing setup is a pain the ass.

I'm using cherry audio's stardust tape echo plug in, but I guess any similar delay fx would work.

Thanks

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There's this video on 'frippertronic' effects which could help, basically the same (recycling delay) just the delay length is different. In a nut shell you send your instrument track to a second 'delay' track then route this one straight back. On this second track you'll have a straight delay, no feedback or dry signal and also any effects you want to add character (saturation, tape sounds etc). There's a couple of other settings (allow feedback in the project settings, don't send delay track to master out etc) but fairly simple and works well. You can just tweak the level of the delay track to control the feedback. Obviously going above 0db (or having effects that boost the level) can lead to runaway feedback (which for dub is good :)) so a limiter is recommended.

For long fripp effects I stack a number of readelays (10 sec max) but you could use anything that allows zero feedback and no dry signal (all of them?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQGvtPvF3Xs

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Thanks!

So the key is to enable feedback in the settings (and limit the effect).

I think the problem I'm going to have is that I don't have enough assignable knobs on my controller for all this. I'm not sure this approach is easier than just automating the feedback in the delay setting rather than routing it back into itself. Even at zero volume on the send fader you still hear some delay which means you can never go to zero delay and fade in from there, unless I'm mistaken.

Thank you for the help

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Not sure I get what you mean really, about the automation and midi controls... do you want to play this live? If so then I find just riding the level of the 'delay' track is enough, yank it down if it starts to run away badly. ie. just one control. you don't need to play with the limiter in real time or anything.

I like this approach purely because you can add custom treatments to the feedback, if you're happy with, say, stardusts sound then riding the feedback seems the way to go, classic dub.

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i'm talking about modulting the parameters of the delay: feedback, volume, etc. Not just fading it in and out

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If you're setting up a desk to employ delay effects based on routing in the console then the return channel level is the feedback control. The first channel (feeding the one with your delay unit) is your input gain. Channels to which you want to apply delay will be routed to that first channel, unless you want for the signal chain of the instrument channel to also process the delay sound.

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I'm using Reaper. I don't have a desk nor a mixer, just a MIDI controller. I am trying to find easier ways to manipulate delay effects as I don't have enough controllers on my device to accomodate all the parameters like feedback etc.

however i have learned that the stardust echo is not suitable for these kinds of feedback loops because all it produces is a harsh tone, not just delays. I get better results from other plug ins, which is unfortunate. Maybe that's what the original hardware the plug in is based on were like, I don't know.

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And that's because I had the direct signal on.

Well, you live and learn!

One of the two at least!

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ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:50 am I'm using Reaper. I don't have a desk nor a mixer, just a MIDI controller. I am trying to find easier ways to manipulate delay effects as I don't have enough controllers on my device to accomodate all the parameters like feedback etc.

however i have learned that the stardust echo is not suitable for these kinds of feedback loops because all it produces is a harsh tone, not just delays. I get better results from other plug ins, which is unfortunate. Maybe that's what the original hardware the plug in is based on were like, I don't know.
You do have a mixing desk, in Reaper. Exactly the same principals apply.

Indeed, you might be best going for a completely clean digital delay and then adding processing plugins after it - as this will colour only the feedback signal.

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Unaspected wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:49 pm
ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:50 am I'm using Reaper. I don't have a desk nor a mixer, just a MIDI controller. I am trying to find easier ways to manipulate delay effects as I don't have enough controllers on my device to accomodate all the parameters like feedback etc.

however i have learned that the stardust echo is not suitable for these kinds of feedback loops because all it produces is a harsh tone, not just delays. I get better results from other plug ins, which is unfortunate. Maybe that's what the original hardware the plug in is based on were like, I don't know.
You do have a mixing desk, in Reaper. Exactly the same principals apply.
Correct, but my issue is how to manage those inputs with a limited controller.

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ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:13 pm
Unaspected wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:49 pm
ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:50 am I'm using Reaper. I don't have a desk nor a mixer, just a MIDI controller. I am trying to find easier ways to manipulate delay effects as I don't have enough controllers on my device to accomodate all the parameters like feedback etc.

however i have learned that the stardust echo is not suitable for these kinds of feedback loops because all it produces is a harsh tone, not just delays. I get better results from other plug ins, which is unfortunate. Maybe that's what the original hardware the plug in is based on were like, I don't know.
You do have a mixing desk, in Reaper. Exactly the same principals apply.
Correct, but my issue is how to manage those inputs with a limited controller.
How many controls do you have spare?

One thing you could consider is creating group busses just for this task. Then you can reduce the number of sends going to the delay effect.

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Unaspected wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 6:13 pm
ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 4:13 pm
Unaspected wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 2:49 pm
ghostwhistler wrote: Sat Jan 29, 2022 9:50 am I'm using Reaper. I don't have a desk nor a mixer, just a MIDI controller. I am trying to find easier ways to manipulate delay effects as I don't have enough controllers on my device to accomodate all the parameters like feedback etc.

however i have learned that the stardust echo is not suitable for these kinds of feedback loops because all it produces is a harsh tone, not just delays. I get better results from other plug ins, which is unfortunate. Maybe that's what the original hardware the plug in is based on were like, I don't know.
You do have a mixing desk, in Reaper. Exactly the same principals apply.
Correct, but my issue is how to manage those inputs with a limited controller.
How many controls do you have spare?

One thing you could consider is creating group busses just for this task. Then you can reduce the number of sends going to the delay effect.
mod wheel and pitch bend.

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So realistically, just the mod wheel then. I guess the most logical thing to ride would be the first channel fader (input gain) and have everything pre-routed.

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to be clear, you are saying have all the tracks i want to feature a delay be routed into the single delay?

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