[Tutorial] polyphonic MSEG Modulator inside Bitwig

[nbyte]

Hi there,
here a tutorial how to create a polyphonic MSEG modulator inside Bitwig Studio.

https://youtu.be/KnjqojVTGLk

[j wazza]

thank you this is a great idea!

[Tj Shredder]

Sorry, but a MSEG needs to be modulate-able in all its properties. I would be happy with three segments already. A static modulation loop isn’t a MSEG.
No sustain or sustain loop, no independent attack-sustain-release areas…

[j wazza]

i thought of a possible other way to do it
Note on (1 from gate) triggers a lfo that goes into a slope? Or use phase distortion for curves?
Then when that lfo reaches full value it triggers a hold/sample and hold
Needs some sort of way to control how long the sustain is, then after that time it triggers an lfo going down with a slope
And note off (0 from gate) also triggers an lfo going down with a slope

this would just make an adsr but if it works this way you could add extra stages in for msegs

or maybe you could just use adsrs and make it trigger new adsrs after certain times or when it reaches a certain value etc

[Tj Shredder]

Oh yes, I have (imperfect) workarounds needing about 10 or more objects eating valuable real estate and make a patch unreadable… Instead of simply enhancing the ADSR with one more parameter.
I wouldn’t mind if that is only accessible from the inspector as long as I can modulate the peak value…

[nbyte]

Sorry, but a MSEG needs to be modulate-able in all its properties. I would be happy with three segments already. A static modulation loop isn’t a MSEG.
No sustain or sustain loop, no independent attack-sustain-release areas…

I have to disagree with you there. You already have a certain influence on the playback of the curve with this method.
You can chase the output through an ADSR and so have an attack and release phase. Furthermore you can change the readout speed in realtime, readout the curve non-linear (using sample and hold, step sequencer etc...) and modulate the intensity. What you cannot do is manipulate individual segments in real time.

[Tj Shredder]

I can only control the attack time of the attack phase of an ADSR, not the peak. If you can tell me how I should control the peak of an ADSR independently of its sustain phase I am all ears… Lets say with max 3 objects, as if you throw 10 or more objects at the problem you can solve it at too high costs for an extremely simple problem…

[nbyte]

I hear you. Such a perfect solution can only be offered by Bitwig itself. We can only try to work out some workaround within our possibilities.

I am working on a third way to enable polyphonic MSEG using Gatekeeper. It's also just a workaround, but you have the possibility to modulate/manipulate single segments of the curve in peak as well as in temporal position.

I think in a good hour I have it online!

[j wazza]

I can only control the attack time of the attack phase of an ADSR, not the peak. If you can tell me how I should control the peak of an ADSR independently of its sustain phase I am all ears… Lets say with max 3 objects, as if you throw 10 or more objects at the problem you can solve it at too high costs for an extremely simple problem…

do you mean the peak level or something else? if peak level then couldnt it just be controlled with an attenuator?

and then use a sample and hold for the sustain, and/or a seperate level control for the sustain

could you share your workarounds please?

[tremor206]

could you share your workarounds please?

Just use LFOtool? its cheap as chips & i have found it to be much more functional in Bitwig than it ever was for me in Cubase, due to Bitwig's ability to use it via audio rate modulation.

Here's how I set up my MSEG device, if youre interested.

1. add an instrument layer container with whatever instrument you want to modulate on layer 1.

2. add an additional layer and insert the following plugins in this order:
Chain containing the following FX Note Filter > Channel Filter > DC Offset > LFOtool
Rename chain as MSEG1

3. Set a modulation curve in LFOtool to use as default for this MSEG, with Env shape 1 assigned to modulate volume (default routing). Set DC Offset device to maximum value (1). Set Note Filter to only allow C0 to C0. This is to keep LFOtool from changing to different envelope shapes via MIDI trigger (C0 triggers env 1 on volume). Set channel filter to only send MIDI channel 2.

4. add an audio rate modulator to the instrument layer container, with it's input set to the output of LFOtool.

5. Duplicate the MSEG chain as many times as you want with different default env shapes & add an audio rate mod source to the instrument layer for each one, with the input set to each LFOtool instance.

6. Map remote controls to whatever parameters you would want to modulate (rate, depth, PWM, point X/Y positions & curve positions etc)

6. IMPORTANT: mute ALL layers with MSEG chains on them. We don't want the audio produced by the DC offset devices to feed to the output. Just need it to feed a signal into the LFOtool instances to give them a signal to shape. Think of it like an etch a sketch for audio.

6. Thats basically it. Delete the instrument from Layer 1 & save the device as "MSEG container" or something. use the Audio rate modulators to assign the mod curve to whatever you want on that particular channel. And when you load the device, you just need to dump whatever synth you like on layer 1 & go to town.

The note filter is there in case you want LFOtool in standard (not retrigger) mode, as it will prevent any notes but C0 from changing the modulation curve. My default preset has this disabled & i enable it only if i want LFOtool to work without midi retriggering

The channel filter is there & set to MIDI channel 2 only, so I can use any note in an existing clip to trigger LFOtool simply by changing the note to MIDI channel 2. This is only when using LFOtool in retrigger or Envelope mode. Again my default preset has this disabled until I need to use retriggering from MIDI.

If you want LFOtool in retrigger or env mode, you want channel filter active & note filter disabled. You want the opposite (channel filter active & note filter disabled), when using LFOtool in standard (not retrigger or envelope) mode. retrigger will keep looping the MSEG until a new MIDI trigger resets it. ENV mode will only play the MSEG once when triggered (like a standard envelope).

Now you have a device with as many MSEG curves as you want to add, that can be used to modulate anything in the project via audio rate (which provides much smoother modulations at slow rates than MIDI CC), with the ability to modulate the points & curves of the envelope, as well as rate, depth & other more usual mod targets.