Normalization with limiting - is that possible in Acoustica?

[Gades]

Hi,
I've searched the forum for the answer, but I'm still confused. If I try to normalize my audio for e.g. -19LUFS (mono for podcast), Normalization allows to distort the signal with peaks louder than 0dB. Is there any possibility to normalize with limiting to the target loudness in Acoustica? Now I have to do it in WaveLab 11 or Audio Editor from RX, but I would like to use only Acoustica

[stian]

I would just normalize to -19 LUFS and use Limit afterwards. The impact on the level in LUFS from the limiter should be neglectable.

Best,
Stian

[jorgensen]

If you want to have a -19LUFS level and get peaks above 0dB, you need to compress the sound.
Remember that inside Acoustica you can have peaks far beyond 0dB without any problems, as the audio is in the FP format - it is first when you save the sound to one of the standard sound formats you have trouble when peaks in Acoustica are above 0dB.

[stian]

If you want to have a -19LUFS level and get peaks above 0dB, you need to compress the sound.
Remember that inside Acoustica you can have peaks far beyond 0dB without any problems, as the audio is in the FP format - it is first when you save the sound to one of the standard sound formats you have trouble when peaks in Acoustica are above 0dB.

Yes, but Limit will handle those (Tools > Limit) and keep them below 0 dB (or another true peak level if you prefer). So I would recommend to normalize and then limit.

Best,
Stian

[jorgensen]

Don't be afraid of using limit!
Have just checked the Beatles Revolver 2022 Remix album, and was very disappointed seeing the waveform of e.g. the Taxman track.
Interesting enough it has been limited at -1dB instead of 0dB, and restoring the peaks has very little audible effect.

2022-10-29_20-06-50.png

[Gades]

Yes, I know about all of this, guys. But it's handy to have a tool like "Loudness control" in RX Audio Editor or "Loudness" function in WaveLab. Normalization + limiter in one tool to quick work By the way, limiting peaks after normalization reduces final loudness, so you have to experiment, how to set normalization to get target loudness after limiting

[jorgensen]

Quoting TBPro:
FinalLoud3 is a plugin that helps you to solve quickly a very common challenge in audio
engineering: reaching a certain target loudness level for any audio material while
maintaining given True Peak ceiling.
The gain control pushes the loudness level to the target level and in parallel the limiter
ensures the True Peak ceiling.

[Gades]

Thanks, @jorgensen you know, plugin is not to able to correctly measure Integrated LUFS for the entire file But I got the point

[stian]

Yes, I know about all of this, guys. But it's handy to have a tool like "Loudness control" in RX Audio Editor or "Loudness" function in WaveLab. Normalization + limiter in one tool to quick work By the way, limiting peaks after normalization reduces final loudness, so you have to experiment, how to set normalization to get target loudness after limiting

The intended workflow is to use Normalize first and the use Limit. Limiting peaks should have a neglectable effect on the loudness as far as I can understand, but please correct me if I'm wrong? You can create a processor chain for this if you need to do this very frequently, so I'm not to fond of the idea of merging these two tools into one.

Best,
Stian

[Gades]

The intended workflow is to use Normalize first and the use Limit. Limiting peaks should have a neglectable effect on the loudness as far as I can understand, but please correct me if I'm wrong? You can create a processor chain for this if you need to do this very frequently, so I'm not to fond of the idea of merging these two tools into one.

Yes, I understand your point of view. And yes, I can prepare the processor chain for this, but - you know - people are lazy If I got loudness normalization with built-in limiting in other applications, I would like to have the same in Acoustica, ha, ha One small field in normalization window - limit peaks level to -1dB

[jorgensen]

You can create a processor chain for this if you need to do this very frequently, so I'm not to fond of the idea of merging these two tools into one.

Tried to add the "Normalize" to the "Processing Chain" and it didn't worked.

Agree with Gades that it would be great if Acoustica has the option to include LUFS in the Processing Chain for a LUFS setting of the hole track, which then can be adjusted up and down - requires the hole track has been preprocced for a LUFS setting!

[stian]

Tried to add the "Normalize" to the "Processing Chain" and it didn't worked.

What happened? I tried it here, and it seems to work fine.

Best,
Stian

[jorgensen]

What happened? I tried it here, and it seems to work fine.

Ok, here it goes:
Added following to the Processing Chain
>Acon Digital Equalize 2
>Normalize
Made sure all 3 "powerbutton" are yellow, which I have missed many times.
Start playing a loaded track.
Opened the Equalizer from the Processing Chain and made some adjustment which can be heard realtime.
Closed the Equalizer window.
Now opened the Normalize window from the Processing Chain and made some adjustments, but absolutely no change in the realtime sound!
I know this is not the intended behavior of the Normalize, but it would be great if it did work realtime!

[stian]

Ok, here it goes:
Added following to the Processing Chain
>Acon Digital Equalize 2
>Normalize
Made sure all 3 "powerbutton" are yellow, which I have missed many times.
Start playing a loaded track.
Opened the Equalizer from the Processing Chain and made some adjustment which can be heard realtime.
Closed the Equalizer window.
Now opened the Normalize window from the Processing Chain and made some adjustments, but absolutely no change in the realtime sound!
I know this is not the intended behavior of the Normalize, but it would be great if it did work realtime!

Thanks for elaborating. Unfortunately, it is physically impossible to implement normalization in real-time since it requires two passes -- one to detect the levels and one for correction.

Best,
Stian

[jorgensen]

Thanks for elaborating. Unfortunately, it is physically impossible to implement normalization in real-time since it requires two passes -- one to detect the levels and one for correction.

I know - but if there was a special button in Normalize that very fast scans the track and makes a snapshot of the sound, then it should be possible to use Normalize in realtime