Bliss 2 sampler

[george]

I don't think reverb is using that much CPU. That's why I'm asking for the CPU model.

[Uncle E]

I don't think reverb is using that much CPU. That's why I'm asking for the CPU model.

Even still, effects usually default to being off, no?

[george]

I don't think reverb is using that much CPU. That's why I'm asking for the CPU model.

Even still, effects usually default to being off, no?

Yes, reverb could be turned off automatically when set to -Inf. dB to save a bit of CPU. But still, I don't think it's that much!

[pc2000]

CPU: When Bliss is loaded and idle... the CPU meter in my (DAW's) registers what I consider kinda high. Using Tracktion 5 for example, Bliss idles around 7-9% on Tracktion's cpu meter. Turning off the reverb which is on by default, the meter drops to 2. The reverb being HQ is CPU heavy. That's fine if you only use 1 or 2 instances of bliss, but I believe 4 or more will tax the CPU...pure speculation since I haven't tried it.

We could disable reverb when it's set to -inf. By the way, what's your CPU model?

I have a number of drum kits recorded as single files that I slice with bliss. This makes it easy to re-create kits I like. Speaking of slicing... there seems to be a definite bug. When inserting a sample, like a kit to slice... I use the slice at transients. When the_ stop playback when slice ends is engaged_ the sample will not play beyond the first slice. The sample plays to the end when it's off like intended. The bug is that the sample will only play the other slices when_ put on white keys only is chosen. It would be nice to have a threshold adjustment, because_ a lot of markers get added to the smallest of transients in the same sample. Been getting like 15 markers in just a kick drum.

Will check that.

As for the dbl clicking to delete cues feature I mentioned earlier... a modifier could be used like: alt+shift instead of dbl click.

Shift+click should be enough I think.

My CPU is a- AMD A6-3600 APU. I would like to highlight that my computer isn't maxing out using bliss or anything. This is about what the host is reporting on cpu usage. This is why I used battery as a comparison since it seems more CPU friendly with all it's onboard FX enabled. Kinda hard to ignore the difference really.

As for the delete markers feature, that's what I meant... alt+click or shift+click. typo!

[pc2000]

I don't think reverb is using that much CPU. That's why I'm asking for the CPU model.

Even still, effects usually default to being off, no?

Yes, reverb could be turned off automatically when set to -Inf. dB to save a bit of CPU. But still, I don't think it's that much!

There's a very noticeable difference between bliss being idle where nothing is playing VS actually playing something with the reverb on. When you're playing sounds with the reverb on, the cpu hit becomes substantial, especially if you planing to use multiple instances of bliss.

[pdxindy]

Can Bliss re-sample itself?

Yes Bliss inside Bliss below

Ha! Not quite what I meant... but that does work.

[pc2000]

Me again... I really have to throw this out there_ for maybe a future development. I said this before, but Bliss really has the best slicing IMO. It has the cleanest I've heard. What makes it stand out- is most slicers have nasty pops and clicks at the end that always seems to need editing of the end points. I find it's better to use regions rather than slice points, since it's easier to edit regions. This is what I started doing in FL studio's Edison since I discovered there's a script that converts slices to regions. I use the slice feature, then convert to regions, then edit the ends, then export the samples. This is extra work because Edison and other slicers rarely have clean end points.

This brings me to the feature request that would be absolutely AMAZING! Bliss having the ability to export slices to separate samples. This combined with the ability to easily delete cue points with shift+click= WOW! I think sample heads would buy bliss for that feature alone! BTW: Don't forget a scroll bar so you can easily maneuver to different sections of a long sample faster.

[george]

This brings me to the feature request that would be absolutely AMAZING! Bliss having the ability to export slices to separate samples. This combined with the ability to easily delete cue points with shift+click= WOW! I think sample heads would buy bliss for that feature alone! BTW: Don't forget a scroll bar so you can easily maneuver to different sections of a long sample faster.

No need to request that, we are already working on it

Now regarding reverb CPU: we would like to please everyone, however checking AMD A6 3600 processing power compares to a intel i3, which is slightly more powerful http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i3-3 ... MD-A6-3600

Our average systems are i5 / i7 CPUs, and that may explain why we don't notice as much CPU usage as the described problem. This means that we will see if we can optimise situations where reverb is not being used, but we will not add a low-quality mode anytime soon.

[pc2000]

This brings me to the feature request that would be absolutely AMAZING! Bliss having the ability to export slices to separate samples. This combined with the ability to easily delete cue points with shift+click= WOW! I think sample heads would buy bliss for that feature alone! BTW: Don't forget a scroll bar so you can easily maneuver to different sections of a long sample faster.

No need to request that, we are already working on it

Now regarding reverb CPU: we would like to please everyone, however checking AMD A6 3600 processing power compares to a intel i3, which is slightly more powerful http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i3-3 ... MD-A6-3600

Our average systems are i5 / i7 CPUs, and that may explain why we don't notice as much CPU usage as the described problem. This means that we will see if we can optimise situations where reverb is not being used, but we will not add a low-quality mode anytime soon.

Good to hear about the sample slice export.

About the CPU: I keep getting the feeling you're missing my point about that. I also notice that you never mention my points about battery-4 and how it greatly varies in CPU performance compared to bliss. Battery has far more FX than bliss, and each drum button has 5 different fx, plus 7 for the master out. If I create 16 drum cells with all 5 fx turned on for each cell... that's 80 fx that's on at the same time. The cpu meter in Tracktion or any other DAW remains at 2% cpu at idle. If I turn on all the master FX which is 7, that's a total of 87 fx enabled at the same time! Battery again remains at 2% cpu at idle in Tracktion's cpu meter. When I actually play a performance, the CPU goes to maybe 5-8%. Just having the reverb on in bliss playing nothing is higher than all those fx being on in battery is. What does my CPU have to do with this obvious difference between-what 2 different programs are doing in the same host? If you don't want to answer that's fine, but some thoughts on it would be welcome.

When I mention turning off the reverb in bliss, I actually turn off the power button in the FX edit tab. You instantly see the cpu drop. Like I stated, my computer isn't stumbling or choking. I just noticed a major difference between 2 samplers and decided to report my observations. Some plugins and programs are just more demanding than others. Has nothing to do with my CPU. I've seen plenty of people with i7's or 5's complain how some plugins where taxing their system. I'm sure there are some users here that can give their own accounts about that. We're not talking about editing 4k video or nothing. I remember earlier in a bliss thread, that someone mentioned how they sampled a plugin and that bliss was more CPU hungry than the synth they sampled. I'm surely not the only one who has the observation.

Anyway... GO BLISS!

[george]

About the CPU: I keep getting the feeling you're missing my point about that. I also notice that you never mention my points about battery-4 and how it greatly varies in CPU performance compared to bliss. Battery has far more FX than bliss, and each drum button has 5 different fx, plus 7 for the master out. If I create 16 drum cells with all 5 fx turned on for each cell... that's 80 fx that's on at the same time. The cpu meter in Tracktion or any other DAW remains at 2% cpu at idle. If I turn on all the master FX which is 7, that's a total of 87 fx enabled at the same time! Battery again remains at 2% cpu at idle in Tracktion's cpu meter. When I actually play a performance, the CPU goes to maybe 5-8%. Just having the reverb on in bliss playing nothing is higher than all those fx being on in battery is. What does my CPU have to do with this obvious difference between-what 2 different programs are doing in the same host? If you don't want to answer that's fine, but some thoughts on it would be welcome.

We have to consider Battery is probably using some low-quality sample interpolation algorithm plus some old DSP, which can impact deeply on CPU usage, so a comparison with Bliss is not precisely fair.

When I mention turning off the reverb in bliss, I actually turn off the power button in the FX edit tab. You instantly see the cpu drop. Like I stated, my computer isn't stumbling or choking. I just noticed a major difference between 2 samplers and decided to report my observations. Some plugins and programs are just more demanding than others. Has nothing to do with my CPU. I've seen plenty of people with i7's or 5's complain how some plugins where taxing their system. I'm sure there are some users here that can give their own accounts about that. We're not talking about editing 4k video or nothing. I remember earlier in a bliss thread, that someone mentioned how they sampled a plugin and that bliss was more CPU hungry than the synth they sampled. I'm surely not the only one who has the observation.

The high CPU consumption was reported on very early betas and has been greatly reduced now. On this main system Bliss resources are fairly low for a single core. I'm talking about Intel Mobile Core i7 "Haswell" (4771) processor with quad cores from 2013:

4 voices with all fx on including Daft and Rock: 3.8% average CPU.
4 voices without fx: 2.4% average CPU.

I don't think those are worrisome results

Anyway... GO BLISS!

[ras.s]

Hello, a new customer right here.


I have to say Bliss is quite impressive. I haven't used much loops in my music before but I think I will now.. Few hours with the demo, loading hip hop beats and churning out jungle music convinced me. :) The synth-resampling thing is simply just great, it cuts the process dramatically --- like by half an hour compared to doing it by exporting samples from a host and creating a patch from them in some other sampler. I think the interface/workflow is also good, it's quick but can go deep when necessary. With the added bonus that it complements my other software by exporting sfz and that you actually made it multi-platform instead of just dual -- all in all I think it's a great piece of kit.


A few irritations though:

- the demo version didn't have it, but the full version .. The interface is laggy. I mean, I click on a menu and it takes a few seconds to bring it up, same thing with trying to open the editor window or the plugin sampling window. I don't know what's the difference between the versions but the demo certainly didn't lag like that. (both on 32bit Vista and 64bit Windows 7)

- the external edit window opens up in the background. I prefer having an external window, but it's irritating that when I want to see it, I open it and then I have to look for it in the taskbar.

- I noticed that loading single cycle samples (like the ones from Adventure Kid), I can't set the loop end point at the very end, leading to a clicking loop.



As for feature requests/things to consider:

- I'd like to create presets for the macro editor. It would be quicker to set it up the way I want when I load or create a new patch. Setting it up every time is a tedious thing. Also the macro editor's parameter list, perhaps it could be shown as columns like the listbox for programs on the main screen? As it is now, it takes a bit of scrolling to reach the bottom.

- I'd like having more LFO targets, particularly stereo rotation and the various envelope stages. For instance, it's different to modulate just the sustain or release stage than the whole amp envelope. Also a knob to delay the start of the LFO would be great.

- I'd find it useful if I could alternatively set the second filter to be at the very last stage, that is, so that it effects also the effected signal (filtering the bit reduced, chorused, reverberated sound). It's a different sound and while I can do that by inserting a external filter in the host mixer, doing that loses the ability to modulate the filter within Bliss. Customising the order of the effects would be nice as well.

- Tempo-synced duration for the plugin sampling function would be good for resampling drum sequencers. (Though trying to resample Image-Line's Drumaxx or Elektrostudio's Rhythmus both crash Studio One 2.6.)

- The sample view could use a horizontal scrollbar when zoomed in.



Anyways, looking forward to seeing Bliss mature further, even though it's already very good and usable -- musical. Thanks. :)

[george]

Hello, a new customer right here.


I have to say Bliss is quite impressive. I haven't used much loops in my music before but I think I will now.. Few hours with the demo, loading hip hop beats and churning out jungle music convinced me. The synth-resampling thing is simply just great, it cuts the process dramatically --- like by half an hour compared to doing it by exporting samples from a host and creating a patch from them in some other sampler. I think the interface/workflow is also good, it's quick but can go deep when necessary. With the added bonus that it complements my other software by exporting sfz and that you actually made it multi-platform instead of just dual -- all in all I think it's a great piece of kit.

Thanks for your support and feedback! Really appreciated.

- the demo version didn't have it, but the full version .. The interface is laggy. I mean, I click on a menu and it takes a few seconds to bring it up, same thing with trying to open the editor window or the plugin sampling window. I don't know what's the difference between the versions but the demo certainly didn't lag like that. (both on 32bit Vista and 64bit Windows 7)

Will investigate.

- the external edit window opens up in the background. I prefer having an external window, but it's irritating that when I want to see it, I open it and then I have to look for it in the taskbar.

I'd recommend enabling ☰ > Interface… > Options > Open Sample Editor in Window in the meanwhile.

- I noticed that loading single cycle samples (like the ones from Adventure Kid), I can't set the loop end point at the very end, leading to a clicking loop.

Will check.

- I'd like to create presets for the macro editor. It would be quicker to set it up the way I want when I load or create a new patch. Setting it up every time is a tedious thing. Also the macro editor's parameter list, perhaps it could be shown as columns like the listbox for programs on the main screen? As it is now, it takes a bit of scrolling to reach the bottom.

Zone Presets are pending, including macros.

- I'd like having more LFO targets, particularly stereo rotation and the various envelope stages. For instance, it's different to modulate just the sustain or release stage than the whole amp envelope. Also a knob to delay the start of the LFO would be great.

Very nice ideas! WiIll add to to-do.

- I'd find it useful if I could alternatively set the second filter to be at the very last stage, that is, so that it effects also the effected signal (filtering the bit reduced, chorused, reverberated sound). It's a different sound and while I can do that by inserting a external filter in the host mixer, doing that loses the ability to modulate the filter within Bliss. Customising the order of the effects would be nice as well.

Will study that.

- Tempo-synced duration for the plugin sampling function would be good for resampling drum sequencers. (Though trying to resample Image-Line's Drumaxx or Elektrostudio's Rhythmus both crash Studio One 2.6.)

Could you detail that?

- The sample view could use a horizontal scrollbar when zoomed in.

Already on our to-do.

Cheers,
George.

[pc2000]

Hello, a new customer right here.


I have to say Bliss is quite impressive. I haven't used much loops in my music before but I think I will now.. Few hours with the demo, loading hip hop beats and churning out jungle music convinced me. The synth-resampling thing is simply just great, it cuts the process dramatically --- like by half an hour compared to doing it by exporting samples from a host and creating a patch from them in some other sampler. I think the interface/workflow is also good, it's quick but can go deep when necessary. With the added bonus that it complements my other software by exporting sfz and that you actually made it multi-platform instead of just dual -- all in all I think it's a great piece of kit.


A few irritations though:

- the demo version didn't have it, but the full version .. The interface is laggy. I mean, I click on a menu and it takes a few seconds to bring it up, same thing with trying to open the editor window or the plugin sampling window. I don't know what's the difference between the versions but the demo certainly didn't lag like that. (both on 32bit Vista and 64bit Windows 7)

- the external edit window opens up in the background. I prefer having an external window, but it's irritating that when I want to see it, I open it and then I have to look for it in the taskbar.

- I noticed that loading single cycle samples (like the ones from Adventure Kid), I can't set the loop end point at the very end, leading to a clicking loop.



As for feature requests/things to consider:

- I'd like to create presets for the macro editor. It would be quicker to set it up the way I want when I load or create a new patch. Setting it up every time is a tedious thing. Also the macro editor's parameter list, perhaps it could be shown as columns like the listbox for programs on the main screen? As it is now, it takes a bit of scrolling to reach the bottom.

- I'd like having more LFO targets, particularly stereo rotation and the various envelope stages. For instance, it's different to modulate just the sustain or release stage than the whole amp envelope. Also a knob to delay the start of the LFO would be great.

- I'd find it useful if I could alternatively set the second filter to be at the very last stage, that is, so that it effects also the effected signal (filtering the bit reduced, chorused, reverberated sound). It's a different sound and while I can do that by inserting a external filter in the host mixer, doing that loses the ability to modulate the filter within Bliss. Customising the order of the effects would be nice as well.

- Tempo-synced duration for the plugin sampling function would be good for resampling drum sequencers. (Though trying to resample Image-Line's Drumaxx or Elektrostudio's Rhythmus both crash Studio One 2.6.)

- The sample view could use a horizontal scrollbar when zoomed in.



Anyways, looking forward to seeing Bliss mature further, even though it's already very good and usable -- musical. Thanks.

I can confirm a graphic type issue in Maschine-2 when it's in play or record mode. I never tried recording with bliss before now,only been playing samples live with the keyboard. Bliss itself isn't having any lag and I can move it freely. The issue is when the sample editor is open, Maschine's play cursor stops moving and there's a lag with trying to stop Maschine until the editor is closed. It also freezes the buttons on the hardware controller where you can't easily change modes or use the stop/play button to stop it until the sample editor window is closed.

There's no issue with bliss main interface being visible, and this has nothing to do with any CPU specs either since the meter isn't doing anything wonky. WAIT... actually, looking at task manager, just opening the sample editor window, the CPU jumps an additional 35-40% from where it was before opening the editor. Closing the editor, the CPU drops a significant amount. Mind you... I may often have my web browser open with a crap load of tabs, I can also have A DAW, photo editor and a video editor all open at once and not have graphical issues or my computer choking.

I know you tried to make this all about CPU specs, but there is simply some wonky things going on with bliss depending on the system I guess. I opened Kontakt 5 and Tal-sampler with no graphical stoppage of the play cursor. I have a sh*t load of plugins to use as references for how my system or DAW's performs with all sorts of plugins. There may be something going on with the graphics engine in certain ways. Decided to see if the issue happens in Tracktion 5....YEP it does! The difference in T5 is the play cursor slows down, while Maschine's stops nearly altogether. Will test in Sonar, Cubase-8, Samplitude, Fl studio12, Mixbus and maybe some others and see what happens.

[ras.s]

Thanks for hearing me out.

- Tempo-synced duration for the plugin sampling function would be good for resampling drum sequencers. (Though trying to resample Image-Line's Drumaxx or Elektrostudio's Rhythmus both crash Studio One 2.6.)

Could you detail that?

What I meant with syncing the duration was that right now it's based on seconds; I'd like it to optionally be based on bars and beats (synced to host tempo). Like choosing values ranging down from a 128th note to 2 beats to 32 bars. Perhaps not that wide of a range, but something like that. If I'm sampling something that has an internal sequencer and with the duration based on seconds, I have to either calculate the desired duration or sample longer than I actually need in order to ensure the sample isn't too short.

The former I can of course do by just checking the desired duration from my host (how many seconds is X bars in the current tempo), the latter leads to longer sampling time, larger files and more time spent setting up loop points. I can already work around to do what I want, but I'd find it useful to just set the duration for example to four bars and start resampling. I'm thinking of drum machines and old EnergyXT projects but it might have some creative uses with arperggiated or delayed sounds as well.



If it's the crashes you wished me to detail further, well, I can't replicate them right now. Sampling Drumaxx works on 64bit Windows 7 and Rhythmus is 32bit plugin -- I'm in the process of migrating from one system to another and the old 32bit computer is gutted right now (so I'm unable to check it again at the moment) .. Though it might as well had been something related to that particular system, it's a trainwreck of a music computer.

[Chandlerhimself]

Has anyone gotten this to work in Sonar 2015. About 80% of my attempts to sample a VST has caused a crash. It a shame because I'd really like to sample Chromaphone, but it crashes every time I try.