This 52ms doesn't apply to notes.
It applies only to Pitch Bend and CCs. In this case it shouldn't bother you so much (I think you don't even notice it unless you know it's there). And you can also configure the value. And it doesn't delay the tone. It delays the change of the tone due to the CC.
Samplers using large sample libraries sometimes do this for 250 ms.
And it only uses the full 52ms if you make big jumps.
I've studied other synths and they seem to behave the same way.
If you move your mod wheel very fast, the hardware controller doesn't send all the points, it sends maybe 3 or 4 intermediate positions, so it can sound like it's not continuous.
CCs are meant to be continuous controllers, so I'm trying to avoid a digital "staircase" change instead of a continuous smooth one.
The result is still not completely smooth because midi is limited to 128 distinct values, and some of zyn's architecture uses only 7 bits internally for some parameters... And fixing that is too much of a hassle.
Classic ZynAddSubFX VST download
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
== VDX == One Man can make a difference!
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
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- KVRAF
- 10360 posts since 3 Feb, 2003 from Finland, Espoo
I'm having some crashes with the Pad Synth part of ZASFX. Anybody else had the host crash when editing the partials and hitting "apply"?
EDIT: I think I may have found the bug. If I have long release tails on it and notes are still ringing when I hit any "apply" button in the detailed partial editor, then it has chance of crashing. So you need to design the sounds with the default super fast release and then add it later once you are happy with the basic sound.
EDIT: I think I may have found the bug. If I have long release tails on it and notes are still ringing when I hit any "apply" button in the detailed partial editor, then it has chance of crashing. So you need to design the sounds with the default super fast release and then add it later once you are happy with the basic sound.
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
sounds like threading racing conditions, similar to those which used to crash when changing presets...
no more vacation days for me, though...
looking for a more relaxed weekend
no more vacation days for me, though...
looking for a more relaxed weekend
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
Can you try if this helps?bmanic wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 4:42 pm I'm having some crashes with the Pad Synth part of ZASFX. Anybody else had the host crash when editing the partials and hitting "apply"?
EDIT: I think I may have found the bug. If I have long release tails on it and notes are still ringing when I hit any "apply" button in the detailed partial editor, then it has chance of crashing. So you need to design the sounds with the default super fast release and then add it later once you are happy with the basic sound.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5t1vjs8ozdgbi ... a.zip?dl=1
== VDX == One Man can make a difference!
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
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- KVRAF
- 10360 posts since 3 Feb, 2003 from Finland, Espoo
Can confirm! Bug is fixed!
Noticed another oddity. There doesn't seem to be any built in voice stealing in ZynAddSub. You can really quickly run out of voices.. and once you do, you can't hit any new ones before the old ones have faded to ridiculous levels. This means that any sounds with even a slightly long release are a no-go unless you put the voice count up to crazy amounts.
Noticed another oddity. There doesn't seem to be any built in voice stealing in ZynAddSub. You can really quickly run out of voices.. and once you do, you can't hit any new ones before the old ones have faded to ridiculous levels. This means that any sounds with even a slightly long release are a no-go unless you put the voice count up to crazy amounts.
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
That's weird.
I implemented just that a few months ago.
But there is a limit in "polyphony". There is a .cfg file where you can modify the "max_voices" or something like that.
When this limit is reached, there is voice stealing looking for the oldest note to kill and make more room.
How many notes did you have at once and noticed a problem?
How exactly did you put the voice count and what is your interpretation of "crazy amounts"?
If I can't replicate, a midi file causing issues would help.
BTW: can you see this in the previous (more official) version, or just in the small update I sent? Maybe I broke something
EDIT: in order to make things easier, could you please share your zynaddsubfx.cfg?
EDIT2: Nevermind, I think I see what you mean. I'll try to have a look at it.
I implemented just that a few months ago.
But there is a limit in "polyphony". There is a .cfg file where you can modify the "max_voices" or something like that.
When this limit is reached, there is voice stealing looking for the oldest note to kill and make more room.
How many notes did you have at once and noticed a problem?
How exactly did you put the voice count and what is your interpretation of "crazy amounts"?
If I can't replicate, a midi file causing issues would help.
BTW: can you see this in the previous (more official) version, or just in the small update I sent? Maybe I broke something
EDIT: in order to make things easier, could you please share your zynaddsubfx.cfg?
EDIT2: Nevermind, I think I see what you mean. I'll try to have a look at it.
== VDX == One Man can make a difference!
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
Well... untested code is s**t code...
This better?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ggyykw2tl0jx ... a.zip?dl=1
This better?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ggyykw2tl0jx ... a.zip?dl=1
== VDX == One Man can make a difference!
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
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- KVRist
- 236 posts since 5 Oct, 2017 from Närförort söder
Hi, folks,jackoo wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:21 pm Well... untested code is s**t code...
This better?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ggyykw2tl0jx ... a.zip?dl=1
has anyone tested this version? I haven't, because I don't fully understand what the issue is.
Cheers!
To be is to do — Socrates.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
The issue is "note stealing".
Limit the max_voices to 25 or less, and load or make an instrument with long release time (via amp env).
Play the keyboard with let's say one chord made out of 4 notes repeatedly, and repeat fast and like crazy.
At some point some of the old notes don't die because they have long release time and due to the max_voices (polyphony limit) you can't play new notes and have to wait for the old notes to die completely.
When you're reaching the polyphony limit, and you create new notes, they should have priority over old notes and the old notes should die immediately irrespective of their release time (this is called note "stealing").
The older version (read as previous version) was not doing this properly. New candidate version should be a little better. The older older version didn't have "max_voices" at all and was hardcoded to polyphony = 128 voices.
This "max_voices" option was introduced rather recently to save some CPU (if someone wants to restrict it to less than 128 voices). I actually still use it with the upper 128 limit. That's also a little bit why I didn't test it properly, I guess.
Limit the max_voices to 25 or less, and load or make an instrument with long release time (via amp env).
Play the keyboard with let's say one chord made out of 4 notes repeatedly, and repeat fast and like crazy.
At some point some of the old notes don't die because they have long release time and due to the max_voices (polyphony limit) you can't play new notes and have to wait for the old notes to die completely.
When you're reaching the polyphony limit, and you create new notes, they should have priority over old notes and the old notes should die immediately irrespective of their release time (this is called note "stealing").
The older version (read as previous version) was not doing this properly. New candidate version should be a little better. The older older version didn't have "max_voices" at all and was hardcoded to polyphony = 128 voices.
This "max_voices" option was introduced rather recently to save some CPU (if someone wants to restrict it to less than 128 voices). I actually still use it with the upper 128 limit. That's also a little bit why I didn't test it properly, I guess.
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- KVRist
- 236 posts since 5 Oct, 2017 from Närförort söder
Hi, jackoo! A few things: the quote is from version .117, I guess. When I, only an hour ago, checked which versions are still possible to download, it turned out that only the last version is (trial 519_beta). Why?
When I swapped my old zyn .dll-file for the latest one, I noticed that there was no .cfg file in the .519 zipped folder. So I once again used the one from the .515 version, since I still had that one on my hard drive (but I don't have the .cfg file from the .517 folder).
I noticed that the settings window still doesn't show 48.000 Hz, although that's what the host uses (digits being "greyd out" (screenshot), I tried to close project and reopen). This is probably a minor problem (or no problem at all). But I wonder how this can be? I guess that the .519 version should be equivalent to the .517 version in this regard? And the digits corresponding to the frequency used are probably determined by the .dll file - not the .cfg file? Right? I could manually edit the .cfg file, but this would be meaningless, and as I understood what you wrote a couple of months ago, this should be taken care of automatically?
Cheers, Per P.S. I really never understood what the -x16.dll is for?
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To be is to do — Socrates.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
It seems that either the nice person who was hosting my files lost his server, or I just lost the hosting account. Whole server / domain is down. Have no idea what happened there.
The "official" links are all dead
.519 is on my private (free) dropbox (which can handle very limited amount of traffic). I can't afford a paid service for hosting this.
Maybe it's a temporary blackout? (i hope)
Those were meant only to be tested if the fix are working. They are just a 'test' compilation.per99 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:03 pm When I swapped my old zyn .dll-file for the latest one, I noticed that there was no .cfg file in the .519 zipped folder. So I once again used the one from the .515 version, since I still had that one on my hard drive (but I don't have the .cfg file from the .517 folder).
There is no specific cfg for the .519. They're all compatible. If there are new entries they will be filled with default values.
Strange indeed. When I tested, the sample rate was correctly reported.per99 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:03 pm I noticed that the settings window still doesn't show 48.000 Hz, although that's what the host uses (digits being "greyd out" (screenshot), I tried to close project and reopen). This is probably a minor problem (or no problem at all). But I wonder how this can be?
What host are you using? I think I've tried this in Reaper... maybe I can check again...
Do you have any other vst that reports the sample-rate so you could compare the results?
Are you absolutely sure your sound engine is at 48000 Hz???
If you don't see that Zyn is out of tune compared to your other VST instruments, than the sample rate is handled correctly internally.
yes
Right. Dll file asks hosts and obeys. Cfg file value is not used.
Yes, it would be meaningless. Yes it should be taken care of automatically.
16 separate outputs in the DAW as opposed to 1 output reported to the DAW (all 16 parts mixed using the panel window).
I used to share only the 16x version (because you can activate or deactivate the mixing of the outputs). But since I work with eXT i don't like to see all outputs when I'm not using them so... I made 2 versions. Otherwise they're identical.
== VDX == One Man can make a difference!
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
My music is on https://soundcloud.com/vdxi | Info | More Info
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- KVRist
- 236 posts since 5 Oct, 2017 from Närförort söder
That was a very detailed reply. Thanks a lot! And let's hope that all previous versions are not gone for ever!
Yes, I use REAPER. I have loaded a number of other VST:s, but I can't see the sample rate used anywhere. Never thougt about it before. But in ZASFX it is so visible.
Another thing: it seems that the timing accuracy is fairly high with the internal buffers set to 128. It isn't just a question of playing notes with short note values. It's almost necessary to humanize/use the random function (Cubase) if you have written all the notes in the midi tracks using the grid. When I humanize the Kick drum, for example, I usually do the settings in such a way that the maximum deviation is 0.01 seconds (the drummer has to be more precise than other musicians). Which means that there are hits that deviates 0.003, 0.0057 seconds, or whatever. This is where high accuracy is required, but as far as I understand, ZASFX is now able to do this. And by the way: I found a way to control the fuzz/buzz/rattle in my zyn electric bass (if you remember), so maybe I will finnish this instrument now. It's about time.
Yes, I use REAPER. I have loaded a number of other VST:s, but I can't see the sample rate used anywhere. Never thougt about it before. But in ZASFX it is so visible.
Another thing: it seems that the timing accuracy is fairly high with the internal buffers set to 128. It isn't just a question of playing notes with short note values. It's almost necessary to humanize/use the random function (Cubase) if you have written all the notes in the midi tracks using the grid. When I humanize the Kick drum, for example, I usually do the settings in such a way that the maximum deviation is 0.01 seconds (the drummer has to be more precise than other musicians). Which means that there are hits that deviates 0.003, 0.0057 seconds, or whatever. This is where high accuracy is required, but as far as I understand, ZASFX is now able to do this.
And by the way: I found a way to control the fuzz/buzz/rattle in my zyn electric bass (if you remember), so maybe I will finnish this instrument now. It's about time.To be is to do — Socrates.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
To do is to be — Jean-Paul Sartre.
Do be do be do — Frank Sinatra.
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
at least this one is stored for eternity (in the internet archive):
https://web.archive.org/web/20160331195 ... 96beta.zip
https://web.archive.org/web/20160331195 ... 96beta.zip
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1045 posts since 3 Jul, 2006
published .519beta and changed hosting.
