New Pianoteq v.6.1 update!

[Ingonator]

This is a video about the new Petrof model posted by Petrof pianos and where Mr. Philippe Guillaume from Modartt is talking about doing the sampling and measurements in an anechoic chamber which that way they did for the first time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... m2-WPUr6P8

2 other videos about the new model:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIS3OnTwpHg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaDeKIg_dvA

This video seemed to be done with a release candidate version before the official release version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2u1KC4xLehY

[Ingonator]

After extensive testing of the Pianoteq 6.3.0 demo with the new Ant. Petrof model (and after having tested Pianoteq countless times in the past...) today i finally purchased Pianoteq 6 Stage with the Steinway Model D + K2 package and the new Ant. Petrof and Blüthner Model One models.

Currently there is a 50% off offer for for a second model if you buy the new Ant. Petrof one so i got the Bluethner for half price.

Both the Ant. Petrof and Blüthner models are graet IMO and those models did finally lead to the decison for buying Pianoteq now.
The Steinberg Model D and K2 models seemed to have improved too compared to earlier Pianoteq versions.

Pianoteq 6 with the new models should now become my "go to" piano besides the VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 and Arturia Piano V2 (with my own custom presets).
The Ravenscroft is quite unique sounding and could be only fully replaced if there would be a proper model for Pianoteq in the future.

[bmanic]

This got me to download the Pianoteq demo once again. Unfortunately I still can't seem to enjoy it. There is something inherently "wrong" with the sound of Pianoteq to my ears. I just can't put my finger on it but something is off.

I suspect it may be in their microphone modeling or something.. there's something just "not right" with how it all sums together. This is especially noticeable if you sum the output to mono. Even a bad recording of a real piano sounds somehow more coherent and more "real" than this does. Oh, and make sure you disable the horrible stereo width enhancement they have going on by default.. and the effects.

There's also still something wonky about the harder attacks when playing large unison/octave chords. I've tweaked the tuning, the damping.. well everything for hours and I just can't get it sounding like my brain wants a piano to sound. And it's not about "good" or "bad" in terms of a piano.. heck I have played my fair share of pianos in my life, from the supreme established names to crappy old finnish and russian upright pianos. Some of them may sound "bad" but they are of course sounding "real" and logical, even when broken and buzzing.

Anyhow, it frustrates me as obviously a lot of people I respect swear by it and it just doesn't click with my brain.

There are tons of downsides with the various sampled pianos around but to my brain they all ultimately "sound real" whereas Pianoteq somehow sounds "unreal" but not in a pleasant way. It's sort of the uncanny valley happening here for my ears. Very similar to how your brain just knows something is CGI if it's a bit off, especially human faces.

Sigh.. I'll keep testing though as the technology is just awesome and the potential is amazing.

[BBFG#]

A predisposition of not wanting to like it will do that.

[EvilDragon]

Yep, expectation and confirmation biases are a bitch.

[Dullee]

A predisposition of not wanting to like it will do that.

Seems like Ingonator and bmanic are the opposite of that. Trying hard to like it, almost forcing themselves, but not succeeding

In the end, Ingo kinda forced himself into buying one

Strangely enough, it took Petrof piano for him to do that (really??), even though there's been a few higher class grand pianos in Pianoteq for years.

I remember trying Pianoteq years ago and finding it to be thin and plasticky sounding. Can't comment on the latest revisions, though. I take it they've improved significantly since.

[EvilDragon]

Ant. Petrof pianos are high class as well. Don't mix up Ant. Petrof with regular Petrof. It's a similar situation to Kawai vs Shigeru Kawai. Huge difference.

[Dullee]

I don't mix up anything. I'm just saying Czechs don't know their pianos like Germans do

And for someone to sort of wait for Petrof model in order to buy a piano software, when there's already Steinway and Bluthner models, the logic behind such decision escapes me.

I didn't say Petrof wasn't high class, I said there's been higher class pianos in PQ available for years and that is true.

Unless you want to argue Petrof is better sounding than Steinway, but I won't go there with you. Go there alone, if you want

[EvilDragon]

Well, anyone can make their own opinions of how Pianoteq's Ant. Petrof model sounds vs Staingräber or Steinway or Blüthner... it's all in the demo.

I don't mix up anything. I'm just saying Czechs don't know their pianos like Germans do

I guess the "proper" know-how went into their beers, amirite?

[Artie Fichelle]

I have Pianoteq since the beginning. But this time, I think they nailed it. The Petrof is marvellous.

[Ingonator]

I don't mix up anything. I'm just saying Czechs don't know their pianos like Germans do

And for someone to sort of wait for Petrof model in order to buy a piano software, when there's already Steinway and Bluthner models, the logic behind such decision escapes me.

I didn't say Petrof wasn't high class, I said there's been higher class pianos in PQ available for years and that is true.

Unless you want to argue Petrof is better sounding than Steinway, but I won't go there with you. Go there alone, if you want

FWIW i still do not think that Pianoteq 6 is 100% perfect but also with the latest models and engine updates IMO it is good enough now to finally buy it after having tested it ountless times in the past. I am quite sure that with the next major version it will be even closer to what i would call "perfect".

It does not matter if there are "higher class" pianos or not and FWIW i also have the Steinway Model D included with the Pianoteq Stage package which was improved too with the latest Pianoteq version
Either you like how a certain piano sounds or not no matter from which brand that piano is.
One of my favorite virtual pianos is VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 and this has a quite unique sound that in this way is not found in any other piano and also not in any current model in Pianoteq.
Pianoteq in no way is a replacement for the Ravenscroft but it adds some additional different sounding pianos to what i alraedy own plus another version of the Steinway Model D.

When i finally decided to buy Pianoteq I did choose the Ant. Petrof and Blüetner models mostly due to their sound while the Ant. Petrof also is their newest moddel. The newer models seem to be a bit better in terms of modelling while also the older pianos have been re-worked for Pianoteq 6 and sound better than in the previous versions.

[Captain]

I think I already wrote about this earlier, but mother is the repetition of invention... no, wait? Anyway: for a long time, I also had a problem with the PianoTeq sound, something I really couldn’t define, but it just bothered me big time. IIRC, there was some muddiness/plastic-ness in the low mids, and a lack of ”klang”, ”oomph” and ”sizzle”... hard to describe in words. But in any case, every time I compared it to sampled pianos, I had to go with the samples.

A while ago, I again demoed PT (version 6), and this time I came to the conclusion that whatever bothered me earlier is now more or less gone. I still ended up using a sampled piano in a recent project, but not because PT was inherently worse, the sampled one (Keyscape) just worked better in that particular case. Anyway, now PT is just one more great option (or a bunch of options) among all the sampled pianos I have. And what _really_ excites me is the ability to adjust all the different parameters to make the models sound slightly or a lot different from a real piano. Some of the more otherwordly PT sounds are just unbelievable. Something you can’t really do with sampled pianos.

But yeah, all in all, it’s amazing how far we have come with 100% modelled instruments, and I’m sure it’s only getting better from here!

[Spitfire31]

Quite apart from the sound discussion, what I also appreciate in Pianoteq is the invisible MIDI recorder. If i come up with a motif or riff while noodling, I know it's stored and can be retrieved as a MIDI file. Very handy.

/Joachim

[Ingonator]

Now that i finally got Pianoteq 6 those currently are my favorite pianos (in no specific order):
- Pianoteq 6 Ant. Petrof 275 model
- Pianoteq 6 Ant. Blüthner Model One model
- VI Labs Ravenscroft 275 (so far this was my "go-to " piano...)
- Arturia Piano V2 "American Grand" model (mostly using my own custom presets)
- NI The Grandeur (offers a lot of tweaking options and i got my own custom presets for that too)
- Ni Alicia's Keys

Mostly those are mostly really different sounding pianos. FWIW i also got the Steinway Model D and K2 package for Pianoteq 6.

Both Pianoteq 6 and Arturia Piano V2 are fully modelled and include models of multiple different pianos (where the "American Grand" model in Piano V2 might be inspired by the Steinway). Piano V2 overall includes 12 different piano models.
The Arturia piano really has improved a lot since the first version the same way Pianoteq improved a lot since v3 which was the first i had tested back then.

[martinjuenke]

Well, anyone can make their own opinions of how Pianoteq's Ant. Petrof model sounds vs Staingräber or Steinway or Blüthner... it's all in the demo.

I don't mix up anything. I'm just saying Czechs don't know their pianos like Germans do

I guess the "proper" know-how went into their beers, amirite?

And the wursts...