GSI VB3-II

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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KVRAF
21908 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Post Sat Sep 29, 2018 5:07 pm

Actually IRs aren't that big honestly, especially when capturing cabinet responses... It'd perhaps be a few MB more...

KVRian
1333 posts since 8 Jan, 2003 from Edinburgh

Post Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:17 am

but can't put their finger on
pun intended? :wink:
John Braner
http://www.soundclick.com/johnbraner
and all the major streaming/download sites.

KVRAF
3094 posts since 18 May, 2003 from Sweden

Post Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:39 am

Many thanks for the 1.1.0 update, with the lovely GSiRotary as a separate bonus! :love:

In a hopefully forthcoming 1.1.1 update, it would be great if the Mac VST version could have the same consistent naming convention as the AU, namely 'GSi VB3 II' instead of the current 'New VB3'. :?:

I was tearing my hair out, re-installing for the third time, when I couldn't find VB3 II in the Live VST list – especially as it was present in the Finder VST listing as – VB3-II.vst!

In Live, the new rotary is called 'GSiRotary' and I not unreasonably expected GSi VB3 II next to it. I found 'New VB3' just by accident…

Also, the settings windows system is a complete mess, unworthy of a 2018 $100 instrument. When called up, the windows appear behind the main window in the center of the screen and then just stack on top of each other, so that you have to manually drag them out in order to see and interact with them. A smarter solution should be possible. ;-)

/Joachim
If it were easy, anybody could do it!

KVRer
25 posts since 13 Jun, 2014 from JP

Post Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:05 am

jbraner wrote:
Sun Sep 30, 2018 1:17 am
but can't put their finger on
pun intended? :wink:
I wish!!
Just play....
……………………………………………………………
RD-700sx, Montage 7, Hammond Xk-3c, Receptor Quattro, Lenovo 720-13, SS v.3, Rokit 6, Neo Vent 2, Komplete, SampleTank, etc, etc, etc

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SMH
KVRist
235 posts since 22 Feb, 2017

Post Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:30 am

ZioKiller wrote:
Sat Sep 29, 2018 2:21 pm
If there's some difference it's between the tall models (122, 147) and their low counterparts (142, 145), but it's only because the horn is at a lower level, more distant from the ears when you sit at a B3, but if you put microphones in front of them, they all sound the same. Since a Leslie simulator reproduces the sound of a well recorded Leslie (because the final result is a stereo signal that goes to two distinct channels), it can be either a 147, a 122 or a low boy there's really little to no difference.
The taller cabinet enhances the bass frequencies more. That's the whole point. How do you not know this? :?

And you should try Blue3-- it's key click is velocity controlled.

KVRer
25 posts since 13 Jun, 2014 from JP

Post Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:56 pm

I tried Blue 3. It's good, too, but with a different feel. I tweaked vb3 II and was able to get it close to the same--except the solid state amp. However, it crashed my host for some reason (maybe drivers - it's a Roland interface SMH).

Hasn't vb3 click been velocity controlled since v1.something?
Just play....
……………………………………………………………
RD-700sx, Montage 7, Hammond Xk-3c, Receptor Quattro, Lenovo 720-13, SS v.3, Rokit 6, Neo Vent 2, Komplete, SampleTank, etc, etc, etc

KVRian
1296 posts since 17 Aug, 2003 from Italy

Post Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:36 am

SMH wrote:
Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:30 am
The taller cabinet enhances the bass frequencies more. That's the whole point. How do you not know this?
I've been making hundreds of recordings out of a couple dozens of different Leslie models, using all possible mikes, preamps and miking positions I could use... and my conclusion is that when a good working Leslie is put in a nice room in front of three well positioned microphones, it can be either a 122, a 142, a 147, a 145, a 251, they all give the same lovely results.

Acoustically speaking, I mean when you're listening to the Leslie with bare ears, and when you're sitting at the organ with the Leslie on a side, or behind you, then you can perceive some differences between the talls and the lows, but it's only because your ears are at different distances from the horn. Also, you normally move, as long as you breathe and your heart pulses, you move continuously, so your ears are not like a microphone that stays motionless on the stand until someone stumbles in its cord :D
SMH wrote:
Sun Sep 30, 2018 10:30 am
And you should try Blue3-- it's key click is velocity controlled.
Oh well, VB3 has been using velocity for scaling the keyclick since its first beta version back in 2005... And I must also say that I have probably been the first to introduce certain concepts in a Hammond simulator that have later been used (or copied) by many other manufacturers in the years to come. But I don't want to take any merit, I'd rather explain why I have decided not to use the velocity any more.

The new VB3-II uses only key-off velocity to scale the key-off (release) click, but does not use key-on velocity at all. I made this choice since I started programming VB3 for the hardware clones (Hamichord, Crumar Mojo, Mojo61, GSi DMC-122) because with a Fatar TP-8o if you want a "snappier" attack that triggers the note when the key is pushed by about 2 millimeters, like on a real Hammond, you have to use only the first of the two bubble contacts (that are underneath each key and are scanned by a microcontroller to calculate the velocity and produce the note events). Using only the first contact, you can't calculate the velocity. So I had to try other means to give the keyclick that scratchy feeling that you have only when you play a real vintage Hammond.

Anyway, I could write thousands words but we're talking about feelings, human perceptions that are really hard to explain in words, so I stop here. I can only invite you to try a Mojo61 (with its latest firmware installed) and a vintage Hammond side to side. Of course this also requires that you have some confidence with a real Hammond, cause you should know what you're looking for (the details...).

KVRian
1296 posts since 17 Aug, 2003 from Italy

Post Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:44 am

This is my trinity.
I also have another A100 at my mother's home (that I'm trying to sell...)

Image

And HERE you see them spinning in sync thanks to my MIDI-controlled relay boards.

User avatar
SMH
KVRist
235 posts since 22 Feb, 2017

Post Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:46 am

ZioKiller wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 12:36 am
The new VB3-II uses only key-off velocity to scale the key-off (release) click, but does not use key-on velocity at all. I made this choice since I started programming VB3 for the hardware clones (Hamichord, Crumar Mojo, Mojo61, GSi DMC-122) because with a Fatar TP-8o if you want a "snappier" attack that triggers the note when the key is pushed by about 2 millimeters, like on a real Hammond, you have to use only the first of the two bubble contacts (that are underneath each key and are scanned by a microcontroller to calculate the velocity and produce the note events). Using only the first contact, you can't calculate the velocity. So I had to try other means to give the keyclick that scratchy feeling that you have only when you play a real vintage Hammond.
The Korg CX-3 had shallow triggering in 2001 and can disable it when used as a controller so it will still send velocity if you want. :)

KVRian
1296 posts since 17 Aug, 2003 from Italy

Post Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:44 am

Yes... I started working with hardware in 2008, at the time almost all existing clonewheels applied that 1st contact thing, it was and still is the way to go if you want that kind of feel. I said that I implemented the 9-contact in VB3 3 years erlier, and VB3 was initially intended to be controlled with traditional MIDI keyboards. I still have an old video where I was showing how the software reacted to velocity, it was cool... but playing it on a waterfall Fatar keyboard is way cooler.

Banned
121 posts since 9 Mar, 2018

Post Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:27 pm

Guido, how would you rate Blue3 V2, personally? Given you've played it and given you can express an unbiased opinion on your only competition, as far as physically modeled Hammonds go, at least.

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KVRAF
4313 posts since 15 Nov, 2006 from Hell

Post Tue Oct 02, 2018 1:06 am

Dullee wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:27 pm
unbiased opinion... on your competition
ummm... yeah :D
From Russia with love
Our online jams (if you speak Russian - you're welcome to join!)

Banned
121 posts since 9 Mar, 2018

Post Tue Oct 02, 2018 2:09 am

yeah, why not, Guido is an adult person and a professional, he knows what I mean.

he's not an infantile retard to engage in primitive shitfest activities. Admiral Quality may be that, but not Guido.

besides, if you have serious competition, whatever it is you are doing, you have to respect it and take it into consideration. to stay competitive, to improve. there's plenty of reasons.

KVRian
1296 posts since 17 Aug, 2003 from Italy

Post Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:20 am

Dullee wrote:
Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:27 pm
Guido, how would you rate Blue3 V2, personally? Given you've played it and given you can express an unbiased opinion on your only competition, as far as physically modeled Hammonds go, at least.
I'm sorry to disappoint you but I don't feel like rating or expressing any opinion on a competitor's product, I find it unfair and unprofessional, and such an opinion couldn't be seen as unbiased.

Rather, I can talk about my product, about what I do, why I do it that way and what are my goals.
Honestly, I'm glad there's some competition around, but since a Hammond simulator pretends to be a digital copy of a highly evaluated existing instrument, let's not forget that our true and only competitor is the Hammond organ. And I mean those real electro-mechanical beasties from the past, not the digital clones made in who-knows-where-in-Asia.

A very wise man (a french software developer) once told me: the sun shines for everybody.

KVRAF
3094 posts since 18 May, 2003 from Sweden

Post Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:34 am

Answer from a gentleman.

/Joachim
If it were easy, anybody could do it!

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