What am I doing wrong???

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viceverser
KVRist
283 posts since 13 Nov, 2010

Post Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:08 pm

I have tried for an hour to implement an "external Audio Editor" as explained here https://www.mutools.com/info/docs/common/audiolab.html
I add the application in preferences but the right click menu options do NOT appear... I have tried with OcenAudio and Audacity and neither show in the right click menu as per the manual... I cannot even find the manual way of doing it as described in the OSX section (Tho that may be a result of me not trying on my mac, just trying on my PC ATM. Have I done something wrong? Is there a known issue with the latest Mulab release? Or???

Please help me with this, as I am restricted to using my FL Studio for serious producing editing duties (With their Edison plugin) but as I can't even record MIDI output without virtual cabling I desperately want to get Mulab to succeed as my main production DAW... But the inability to edit audio files thoroughly is a MAJOR issue.

Please please help!!!

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KVRAF
10054 posts since 24 Jun, 2008 from Europe

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:23 am

Currently the "Edit In Audio Editor" is only for audio streams, not (yet) for samples. Maybe you tried to use it on a sample? It was indeed not clear from the Audio Lab doc page that it only works on audio streams atm, that has been made more precise now.

For the difference between audio streams and samples please see https://www.mutools.com/info/docs/commo ... mples.html

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viceverser
KVRist
283 posts since 13 Nov, 2010

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:49 am

Sooooooo, Audio Editing or Mulab functionality, but you can't have both? That's so disheartening :( I feel like every time I ask for help here, the answer is just... no! So many little things make this amazing software so hard to use in a fluid way for me... And I do really admire the things that DO work so much... It's like having the perfect sports arena, but there's no roads leading there... so to play you spend half the game time walking there instead of playing.

Please consider fixing this limitation, as even in the manual it aknowledges that external editors are required (and suggested) for use with this software... If their use is broken in most functional cases, then surely this would be a priority to complete???

Anyway, thanks for the reply, and for all the hard work you've already put in... I hope I don't sound ungrateful, I do appreciate the work you've done, it may just be a bad choice on my part for my production style (I'm more Hip Hop , RnB & Glitch) Which requires a little more Editing Power to experiment properly.

Cheers V.

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Michael L
KVRAF
2809 posts since 25 Jan, 2014 from The End of The World as We Knowit

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:38 am

viceverser wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:49 am
I'm more Hip Hop , RnB & Glitch) Which requires a little more Editing Power to experiment properly.
Just checking -- have you fully explored the audio sequencer, the lanes feature (multi-track inside each sample track), and the looping ability, e.g. for each sample event you "can play and loop any section of any sample in your project, and time stretch it" to create instant stutter, etc effects. "
http://www.mutools.com/info/docs/mulab/ ... ences.html

IMHO, the audio sequencer in combination with the Audio Lab DSP should be perfect for your style, particularly dropping events from the audio sequencer into the other Devices, or rendering each event to create a sample library for each project.

Because MuLab is modular with a lot of drag and drop and centralized editing using Markers, the possibilities can get pretty crazy once you start playing around. For example, this video just uses drum samples, but imagine doing all this with a single vocal sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6Gk_toypxw
He is a letter to everyone
You open it
It says Live

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viceverser
KVRist
283 posts since 13 Nov, 2010

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:35 am

Michael L wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:38 am
viceverser wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:49 am
I'm more Hip Hop , RnB & Glitch) Which requires a little more Editing Power to experiment properly.
Just checking -- have you fully explored the audio sequencer, the lanes feature (multi-track inside each sample track), and the looping ability, e.g. for each sample event you "can play and loop any section of any sample in your project, and time stretch it" to create instant stutter, etc effects. "
http://www.mutools.com/info/docs/mulab/ ... ences.html

IMHO, the audio sequencer in combination with the Audio Lab DSP should be perfect for your style, particularly dropping events from the audio sequencer into the other Devices, or rendering each event to create a sample library for each project.

Because MuLab is modular with a lot of drag and drop and centralized editing using Markers, the possibilities can get pretty crazy once you start playing around. For example, this video just uses drum samples, but imagine doing all this with a single vocal sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6Gk_toypxw
Hey :)
Yeah I have... It's actually the reason I bought the full Mulab (I recently just had Mux Modular, but as it doesn't follow the clock of your DAW a LOT of what I tried to use it for was just so difficult to use it for... That's another wish I have :) ),
One of my main techniques tho is to set up a basic sequence, then record that track live while triggering various effects that glitch, repeat and morph the sound beyond recognition... Then I will go through the newly created output and chop it up into new samples and layer that into new sampler patches and pitch/stretch/reverse/whatever!!! and create my own sample packs to then make the song from... Basically I make a makeshift track to flip samples from... This gives me the creativity I've always had flipping samples, without the "Sample Clearance" issues that have made modern hip hop production all sound the same... 808 cliche beats... That's why my stuff ends up sounding like it's glitch influenced... Because I get very into the editing... For example... In FL Studio, I would do this process, then I would have 2 instances of edison (on the master track)... (Which is a dedicated audio recorder/editor that can be nested as a plugin chain) I do all of the above recording into the first edison... Then I set the second to record, and I randomly scan and select random loops of awkward little riffs, ans even down to single cycle loops to create buzz synth samples... Then I chop loops from the second edison too (Which is as simple as drag on the wav for selection then drag it into the rack. THEN I do all the sample sequencing and flipping... Which is what all these juicy Mulab features you've suggested are for... But all of the back and forth I do before that is severely hampered by not being able to quickly and efficiently power edit, sample and mangle a "sample" file... Which is how most of the files using the sample tracks are.

This process is also how I handle MIDI... But FL Studio not being able to record midi back from a track gives me a headache as well... If I could have the midi and modularity of Mulab, and the Editing/Sampling of FL studio... I would be happy... I used to use ableton, but after it corrupting about 20% of the stuff I made with it, and crashing ALL THE TIME, I just am too jittery to even touch it... I then jumped into Bitwig... Which I LOVE, But they move to a subscription support system, and when it all happened, they were so unspecific about how it would be implemented, and their complete media blackout showed me that all the 1.0 users were not taken seriously and just treated like suckers who payed to be beta testers. I was very upset by their attitude at that time... So here I am... Still searching for a replacement.

Thanks for the heads up... I will of course keep trying to use Mulab... Maybe I can find a better way to work, but the tutorials on it's features are so sparce, and I just don't know half of what it can do... It's a BIG learning curve with such a small pool of information.

Cheers V. :)

P.s... Sorry for the essay... I couldn't explain without detail!!!

User avatar
Michael L
KVRAF
2809 posts since 25 Jan, 2014 from The End of The World as We Knowit

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:06 pm

Thanks for the useful essay. It seems to me that you can slice, pitch, stretch, reverse, EQ a sample in the MuLab Audio Sequencer, Audio Lab/DSP menu, and add further FX/layers in Devices linked to that sample. You can then render and repeat. Am I missing something you need, such as what you mean by "power editing"?
He is a letter to everyone
You open it
It says Live

User avatar
dakkra
KVRian
950 posts since 4 Oct, 2012 from Utah

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:36 pm

Also note you can bounce a sequence, so you can edit the audio with other VST effects, bounce/render it out, and now you have a new sample with the edits done to it. You can then slice and mangle/etc and even repeat the process.
Soft: Bitwig/Mulab, MUX, MXXX/MSoundFactory, Falcon, Synthmaster(One/2), Melodyne 4 Studio
Hard: Scarlett 2i2 V2, Schiit Audio Magni V3, Sennheiser HD6XX, JBL LSR 305(x2)
Comp: Ryzen 2700x, GTX 1080, 32gb ram, 1tb NVME SSD

User avatar
viceverser
KVRist
283 posts since 13 Nov, 2010

Re: What am I doing wrong???

Post Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:56 pm

Michael L wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:06 pm
Thanks for the useful essay. It seems to me that you can slice, pitch, stretch, reverse, EQ a sample in the MuLab Audio Sequencer, Audio Lab/DSP menu, and add further FX/layers in Devices linked to that sample. You can then render and repeat. Am I missing something you need, such as what you mean by "power editing"?
Certain functions like embedding loop markers in a wav file for loops in samplers like omnisphere... Also, I struggle with using the audio editor in Mulab... As I've said, probably my inability to use the tools available! I click drag, make a selection, then click and drag the selected part and it makes a new selection? right click and am totally befuddled... Where I expect basic commands like cut, copy, paste, trim to selection, make loop from selection etc... I find functions of Mulab commands... I'm sure there's ways of doing it... but it's very unintuitive, which is fine, but generally you will find tutorials online that fill the gap between programming and UI.

Also the method I've described above leads to "happy accidents", but prescribing outcomes rather than record cycling plugin chain states and recording output, then editing to loops and back feels less experimental... But it is again possibly my inability to work out the tools at hand... Which I'm sure are just as great... but I have made 32 songs and still feel completely hazy on what I'm doing beyond basics.

If you have any 'in depth' tutorials i can watch/buy that runs the gamut of features and devices you suggest I'd love to get my head around things better... But after 32 songs I still cant cut and paste in the wave editor!!?

Again, thanks for the responses :)
V.

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