Disadvantages of DAWs in comparison to others

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
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KVRist
241 posts since 4 Dec, 2019

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:05 pm

This thread is only about the commercial DAWs. With free DAWs you won't have any problems at all and you won't have to think twice. I can recommend them all, especially if you're a beginner. Get some free DAWs and test them out before you think you need to buy anything at all!!!

NOW 8) I can start:
********************************

I'd like to know only about the points that disappointed you with DAWs and give good reasons for it so that people may not make the wrong decisions that you may have made in the past when you bought a DAW that you were or still are incontent with:
Cubase, Ableton Live, Logic Pro, FL Studio...
In which cases or situations would you NOT recommend to choose the DAW?

I am convinced that there is no perfect DAW without its downsides but what exactly can you report from your experience?

I'll start with Cubase and reveal some disadvantages that you usually don't hear people talk much of. They only praise the products and so you won't know what you get in the end.
Cubase causes endlessly many routing or acceptance problems concerning plugins that make it virtually impossible to use many free and otherwise very useful plugins.
In FL you can just load anything as your insert effect, even VSTs that you just want to use for some cool effects while routing another plugin to it. Cubase will cause you a lot of trouble with that! Cubase often only accepts VST3s that have the sidechaining function already built in. Cubase does not support the 32 bit plugins any more so you'd have to bridge almost everything with jbridge and then your DAW will often just crash down.
I couldn't get my favorite plugins to run in Cubase even though I bridged them. Cubase won't route to "older" vsts that can be used as effects. Maybe they want you to buy the newest stuff and throw everything away that you have...
Hence if you like free plugins and making music with your computer I cannot recommend Cubase at all.

Ableton Live and FL:
I've heard that you shouldn't use them if you want to use external devices because of many latency problems which Cubase or Logic can handle much better because of a certain "ping" function. So I cannot recommend Ableton or FL for people who use external devices (bands, musicians) as opposed to people who mostly or only make music on a computer (EDM).

Now it's your turn to inform people about the disadvantages of certain DAWs so they can make better and more informed decisions in the future.
Nothing can be better than liberty and free time to spend as you choose. Let's give those modern slaveholders the bum's rush!

User avatar
KVRist
100 posts since 2 Jul, 2014 from Finland

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:49 pm

Studio One doesn't do surround, the colours menu is random, no track icons, ripple edit behaves unusually, no video timeline, no middle mouse button drag/pan, no MPE support for VST3, autoscroll doesn't have a centered playhead.

User avatar
KVRAF
21237 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from not here

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 4:05 pm

anything that confounds MIDI volume with the volume of the instrument channel receiving the MIDI data is crippled afaic
(Logic unless they redesigned it. There are others but I don't memorize negatives, I'm not shopping at all.)

No or half-assed MPE support I consider deficient

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KVRAF
8215 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:55 pm

juno987654321 wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:05 pm
Ableton Live and FL:
I've heard that you shouldn't use them if you want to use external devices because of many latency problems which Cubase or Logic can handle much better because of a certain "ping" function. So I cannot recommend Ableton or FL for people who use external devices (bands, musicians) as opposed to people who mostly or only make music on a computer (EDM).
You seem to feel quite strongly about things you have no idea about :)
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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KVRian
1068 posts since 23 Jun, 2007

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:07 pm

that's a never ending debate...No DAW is perfect bla bla bla
you can make great music with any of them.
Some are more conventionnal linear DAWs : Logic, Reaper, Cubase, Studio one and other are more live oriented : Ableton, Bitwig
When I perform a techno live I use Bitwig, I don't like Ableton
When I make a track, I use any DAW

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KVRAF
8215 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland

Post Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:22 pm

dupont wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:07 pm
that's a never ending debate...No DAW is perfect bla bla bla
you can make great music with any of them.
Exactly. My take is always "pick the DAW that does the best the thing(s) you do the most of, and that pisses you the least for everything else" :)
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

User avatar
KVRist

Topic Starter

241 posts since 4 Dec, 2019

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:11 am

So far only a few remarks that added something of value to the question why specific DAWs fail in specific situations and how exactly - based on your experience. I'm interested in reasons why you should rather stay away from specific DAWs if you have certain aims in music. This is about knowing things in advance before you buy them and get disappointed because salespeople definately won't tell you that.

Just because someone posted some typical "hater statement" here that doesn't add anything interesting I shouldn't bother but anyways:
"I've heard about..." was an understatement. It was actally based on some rather reliable information from professionals who've been doing music productions professionally for ages. But since it was broadcast in Berlin and most people won't understand German I didn't give any reference in the first place. Here it is and the latency issues are being discussed towards the end. It was a video contribution that had some CONTENT to it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27Y805i-8Xc

However, recommendations like "just pick whatever DAW is best and that pisses you off least" unfortunaltely won't lead anyone anywhere. Save your typing in that case. It won't be appreciated.
Nothing can be better than liberty and free time to spend as you choose. Let's give those modern slaveholders the bum's rush!

KVRAF
1616 posts since 26 Aug, 2012

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:15 am

Protool midi editor sucks.

Ableton is close to perfect with the exception of 2 things:
1.
the sends are not illustrated by name on the track, yes there's no room but it could be displayed if you hover over the send.

2. The solo buttons dont work independently. This is annoying when mixing. Personally I think things like automation is streets ahead of protools, if only they'd fix the solo thing

User avatar
KVRist
178 posts since 4 Feb, 2021

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:46 am

Back in the very old days: Chrashes!

10 years after: Abandoning darlings, Orion Platinum.

Now a days: That no DAW is ever going to fit me as well as Reason, but that is hardly a minus for me nor reason for others to diss all other DAWs.

I have no warnings, but just an advice to any newcomer: Read, learn and try the demo.
Tribe Of Hǫfuð https://soundcloud.com/user-228690154 Karma, MC909, Microkorg, MU100R/VL70 w. BC1, Nord Lead 2, Polivoks, Prophecy, WSA-1, Mac Pro w. Reason 11 Suite + Nektar P4 + Nektar Impact LX25+.

KVRAF
2164 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:49 am

We all have different expectations, people tend to nitpick over variety of things and spend their time obsessing about perfect DAW's and workflow without making much music, just go read "Why you left..." DAW threads, ditched Live because it doesn't have FL piano roll and stuff like that, but over the years people made amazing music in Live that had automation PDC issue, other guy ditched it because he can't erase a note with right click or whatever.

KVRian
808 posts since 8 May, 2018 from Sweden

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:04 am

I find that the longer you use a certain DAW, the less you notice its flaws. Your workflow is formed by the strengths and weaknesses of the DAW, until doing it any other way would feel awkward and frustrating. If you switch DAWs, your first few weeks are going to be constant frustration because something doesn't work the way you expect it to, based on your experience in the previous DAW.

Of course some DAWs are objectively better or worse at certain things, but 99% of the time (keeping in mind 80% of all statistics are made up on the spot), you can work around those limitations. All the major commercial DAWs on the market are more than capable enough unless you have extremely specialized needs and requirements, making it more a matter of personal preference.

KVRAF
28064 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:17 am

I think you should rather concentrate on the things a DAW can do well. I don't choose my DAW thinking "It has the least shortcoming". I choose my DAW for the most advantageous features and workflow.

I know, totally antiquated thinking. I should really think more about all the negative things.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

KVRAF
28064 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:18 am

juno987654321 wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:05 pm
This thread is only about the commercial DAWs. With free DAWs you won't have any problems at all and you won't have to think twice.
Care to explain that? Because, I don't understand that at all.
Plugins and a DAW. On an operating system. Which runs on a computer.

User avatar
KVRist

Topic Starter

241 posts since 4 Dec, 2019

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:24 am

chk071 wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:18 am
juno987654321 wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:05 pm
This thread is only about the commercial DAWs. With free DAWs you won't have any problems at all and you won't have to think twice.
Care to explain that? Because, I don't understand that at all.
...in financial terms that is. You cannot be tricked.
Nothing can be better than liberty and free time to spend as you choose. Let's give those modern slaveholders the bum's rush!

KVRAF
2164 posts since 5 Nov, 2014

Post Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:27 am

juno987654321 wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:24 am
chk071 wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:18 am
juno987654321 wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:05 pm
This thread is only about the commercial DAWs. With free DAWs you won't have any problems at all and you won't have to think twice.
Care to explain that? Because, I don't understand that at all.
...in financial terms that is. You cannot be tricked.
But if time=money and you spent time with free DAW to save money that turns out full of the even bigger shortcomings than the commercial ones, than who is tricked?

Most DAW's have generous trials, some for 60-90 days, some without save or export, some have cheaper versions that can be bough for peanuts or come with some gear, if anything if one have time for demo-ing, they can test drive most of them and see does it fit him or not.

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