Rhythm box / groovebox

Anything about hardware musical instruments.
Trancer
KVRist
Topic Starter
333 posts since 7 Aug, 2018

Post Mon May 09, 2022 5:43 am

Despite my fears, I'm still considering taking Arturia's Polybrute.

I expect to try the Sequential tomorrow, but most certainly the Polybrute.

Here, I'm looking more to do dawless, so I need a rhythm box / groovebox but just like for polyphonic analog, only one machine places it.

If I had to just take one machine which one?

Need for reliability, durability over time, ntuitive, no submenu menu that breaks productivity and spontaneity.

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KVRian
1238 posts since 29 Oct, 2015 from Jupiter 8

Post Mon May 09, 2022 6:12 am

spontaneity with no menu diving: Yamaha Tenori-on. it can only do (polyrhythmic) melodic blips and no CC message modulation or whatsoever. it's expensive for what little it does. but what it does, it does well.
many will swear by the elektron boxes, but they are a bit more complex to learn

the big daddy of course is the Cirklon (if you can manage to get one) but my honest best answer is either stick to a DAW, or use an iPad to sequence your stuff. it supposedly has great step sequencers (the Tenori-on app being one among them)
There's no Logic to Windows

Trancer
KVRist
Topic Starter
333 posts since 7 Aug, 2018

Post Mon May 09, 2022 6:36 am

Thank you for your reply.

The Yamaha is no longer available new.

Yes Elektron very clearly, but we can not say that very intuitive as a machine.

Very powerful, but a lot of manipulations.

The Cirklon is an almost perfect machine, but the delivery time is really too long.

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cryophonik
KVRAF
8021 posts since 7 Sep, 2006 from Roseville, CA

Post Mon May 09, 2022 4:37 pm

Elektron Digitakt or Syntakt seem like good choices for your needs. They have MIDI tracks for sequencing your external gear. Yeah, they are a little unintuitive at first because they’re very deep, but that doesn’t stop people from learning them.

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zerocrossing
KVRAF
11980 posts since 26 Jun, 2006 from San Francisco Bay Area

Post Mon May 09, 2022 7:03 pm

I use a combination of an Analog RYTM, Analog Four (both mk1) and an iPad. To be honest, the iPad apps are often the most fun to work with. I think if I were gigging live again, I’d probably go with an iPad as my groovebox. I love apps like Patterning.
Zerocrossing Media

4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~

Trancer
KVRist
Topic Starter
333 posts since 7 Aug, 2018

Post Fri May 13, 2022 9:28 pm

Thank you for your feedback and reviews.

Of course Elektron, a must.

I would like something more direct, more usable in the moment, without going through menus and submenus.

The MC 707 partly met my expectations, but just like Elektron, too many menus that aren't direct enough and that spoils spontaneity, intuitiveness and creativity.

Not a fan of tablets, even if used very often by a lot of people.

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cryophonik
KVRAF
8021 posts since 7 Sep, 2006 from Roseville, CA

Post Sat May 14, 2022 5:52 am

You must be new to grooveboxes :lol:

By their nature, grooveboxes are very deep and have a lot of functionality, so your options are to have one the size of a dining room table with knob per function, or one that is designed to fit on your lap or desktop and has menus. That doesn’t mean that they aren’t immediate. The options that you need to lay down your basic idea are there and ready to start creating as soon as you turn it on, the rest comes down to learning your instrument. Go to YouTube and watch some vids of guys/gals pounding out a complete track in 25 minutes on a good groovebox and tell me that it isn’t immediate.

Trancer
KVRist
Topic Starter
333 posts since 7 Aug, 2018

Post Sat May 14, 2022 9:15 am

Thank you for your reply.

Yes indeed new in the field.

Of course you have to know your machines the basics.

Precisely I do not know the use of groovebox and drum machines.

The why of my questions on the use and my search for an efficient machine that is quite instantaneous and intuitive.

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vurt
addled muppet weed
93520 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass

Post Sat May 14, 2022 9:18 am

simple is as simple does ..
electribe?
malleus melificarum.

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elxsound
KVRAF
8072 posts since 18 Aug, 2007 from NYC

Post Sat May 14, 2022 12:25 pm

If it’s Syntakt you’re considering there’s not much menu diving. It’s worse on Digitakt and Model:Samples due to RAM memory limitations (so sample management is an issue).
On Syntakt it’s a breeze as they’re all designed for live use but again on Syntakt, no deep diving. It’s just a matter of learning the workflow

But… Polybrute looks like a f**king beast. I can’t imagine not having greater flexibility with sound design and variations. I don’t have the space for one so I’ll stick with my current choices.

But groove boxes in general are all about working in a self contained system with real estate limitations that require menu dives vs combination button pressing for getting around. It’s no different than learning a new DAW because each one has its own workflow. You might get on with some betters than others and once you do, f**k what others might say (about what’s best) and let the creativity do it’s thing.

The limitations are actually a bonus because sometimes it requires creativity to get results, often pushing you to do new and better (my opinion of course). Technically I have 5 groove boxes now with OP-Z, BlackBox, Digitakt, Syntakt and model:samples. The Elektron stuff is all relatively new but I believe I’m nearing the end of my honeymoon phase and still happy with this route.

Trancer
KVRist
Topic Starter
333 posts since 7 Aug, 2018

Post Sat May 14, 2022 2:16 pm

Thanks for your feedback.

Indeed the Polybrute a splendid machine.

I'll take a closer look at Syntakt, maybe a solution.

I had also watched Akai Force and the One.

Glad to know that Syntakt easier to access and less manipulation in menus.

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cryophonik
KVRAF
8021 posts since 7 Sep, 2006 from Roseville, CA

Post Sat May 14, 2022 2:32 pm

elxsound wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 12:25 pm If it’s Syntakt you’re considering there’s not much menu diving. It’s worse on Digitakt and Model:Samples due to RAM memory limitations (so sample management is an issue).
On Syntakt it’s a breeze as they’re all designed for live use but again on Syntakt, no deep diving. It’s just a matter of learning the workflow.
Same with the Analog RYTM mk2. Very little menu diving needed. With the Digitakt, the only time I feel like I’m doing much menu diving is when I’m pulling samples into a project. Aside from that, it’s mostly just learning all the button combinations, which are all clearly labeled.
elxsound wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 12:25 pm But groove boxes in general are all about working in a self contained system with real estate limitations that require menu dives vs combination button pressing for getting around.
Yeah, with most of them, it’s more about button combinations than menu diving. I can see that FUNCTION button being the first thing to wear out on the Elektrons. :lol:

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elxsound
KVRAF
8072 posts since 18 Aug, 2007 from NYC

Post Sat May 14, 2022 3:30 pm

cryophonik wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 2:32 pm
elxsound wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 12:25 pm If it’s Syntakt you’re considering there’s not much menu diving. It’s worse on Digitakt and Model:Samples due to RAM memory limitations (so sample management is an issue).
On Syntakt it’s a breeze as they’re all designed for live use but again on Syntakt, no deep diving. It’s just a matter of learning the workflow.
Same with the Analog RYTM mk2. Very little menu diving needed. With the Digitakt, the only time I feel like I’m doing much menu diving is when I’m pulling samples into a project. Aside from that, it’s mostly just learning all the button combinations, which are all clearly labeled.
elxsound wrote: Sat May 14, 2022 12:25 pm But groove boxes in general are all about working in a self contained system with real estate limitations that require menu dives vs combination button pressing for getting around.
Yeah, with most of them, it’s more about button combinations than menu diving. I can see that FUNCTION button being the first thing to wear out on the Elektrons. :lol:
That FUNCTION button... I always feel like that with both of these boxes when going into mute mode, especially when trying to switch from global to pattern mutes. I feel like it's gonna break because I'm pressing too hard. It probably won't, but I can't help but think it's gonna eventually fail.

kontophoros
KVRer
2 posts since 1 Dec, 2021

Post Sun May 15, 2022 12:51 pm

The Digitakt taught me so much that I've been able to apply ITB (this seems to be the case with most hardware). It's one of the few pieces of hardware I never contemplated selling.

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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
32631 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Post Sun May 15, 2022 5:06 pm

Trancer wrote: Mon May 09, 2022 5:43 am I need a rhythm box / groovebox but just like for polyphonic analog, only one machine places it.

If I had to just take one machine which one?

Need for reliability, durability over time, ntuitive, no submenu menu that breaks productivity and spontaneity.

If you can solder ... analog groovebox for 200 Euros
Desktop or Eurorack

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https://www.dreadbox-fx.com/dysmetria/? ... IA+Diy+Kit



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The new Polyend Play looks "the business" too ... https://polyend.com/play/
so long as you don't mind using samples (no sample import afaik)

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