KVR Audio

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 4:57 am

Architeuthis wrote:So... yeah. I just have one question. Is it possible to control the pitch of the noise wave? The only thing that seems to control it is the octave setting. The pitch LFO nor an LFO destined to the osc pitch can control it. Importing the noise wave from "Load User Wavetable" doesn't work either since the noise sounds like a saw wave in the program.

Try using a normal waveform and modulating the hell out of it's pitch with an LFO that has Noise as it's waveform. That way you get pitched noise.

bmanic wrote:The sound. It's probably a combination of the, IMHO!!, very weak filter and the sub-par oscillators. I don't know. I simply think it sounds extremely sterile and un-musical.

I'm no fan of the filters either but it is capable of some seriously beefy sounds. I just wouldn't use it for squelchy basslines.

Killvehicle wrote:One of my best ways to use it is to have my 6 year old daughter sit next to me and she controls the mouse and we just mangle things until it sounds good.

Surely the ultimate testament to the quality of a softsynth!?! Idiot!

Overall I quite like the sound, despite the limitations of the filter, but its completely over-the-top approach to the number of oscillators, LFO, envelopes and everything else makes its all but unusable for me, despite several attempts to get comfortable with it. As I've pointed out in the past, 75% of the presets use around 25% of the available features which makes me wonder why I have to wade through all the krap to do what I want to do.

shamann · Post by **shamann** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:04 am

ew wrote:?

The last time I looked, the definition of noise was an equal mixture of all possible frequencies- by that definition, unpitched...

That'd only be white noise.

See here for the many colours of noise.

kuniklo · Post by **kuniklo** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:17 am

BONES wrote: I'm no fan of the filters either but it is capable of some seriously beefy sounds. I just wouldn't use it for squelchy basslines.

The filters aren't anything special but adding a little distortion with the shaper does help quite a bit (as it does with most synths).

The weird thing for me about z3ta is that although the individual components are kind of vanilla I somehow get sounds out of it that I really like. It has this weird, clean metallic timbre that inexplicably has a lot of presence. I hardly use it at all these days though now that Surge has just about completely displaced it.

Architeuthis · Post by **Architeuthis** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:56 am

ew wrote:The last time I looked, the definition of noise was an equal mixture of all possible frequencies- by that definition, unpitched...

tell that to NES music and C64 emulators.

And wait, I hear a few people disliking the sound of this synth? That totally ruins it for me. I want to get away from crappy oscillators and filters, but damn Z3ta+ has so many features I love... gah!

kuniklo wrote:I hardly use it at all these days though now that Surge has just about completely displaced it.

SURGE? Dam, better go check it out.

BONES wrote:As I've pointed out in the past, 75% of the presets use around 25% of the available features which makes me wonder why I have to wade through all the krap to do what I want to do.

Ah, so it's your kind that prevents synths like z3ta+ from coming out... no wonder there are so few synths that have all the features I want.

Architeuthis · Post by **Architeuthis** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 6:40 am

10 FRIKKIN SECONDS WITH SURGE AND IM BLOWN AWAY COMPLETELY!!!

Surge is like..... omg... im crying inside. It's even cheaper than Z3TA+ and has possibly EVERY DAM FEATURE I've been looking for.

kuniklo · Post by **kuniklo** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 6:55 am

Architeuthis wrote: Surge is like..... omg... im crying inside. It's even cheaper than Z3TA+ and has possibly EVERY DAM FEATURE I've been looking for.

Surge is the bomb.

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:08 am

wait 'til you get round to trying VB-1...

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:09 am

See.. now Surge's sound I like very much. It's got exactly what Z3ta is missing. Personality.

Cheers!
bManic

Architeuthis · Post by **Architeuthis** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:26 am

Ok ok, could someone please sketch me out a quick tutorial for Surge stating how you route LFOs and how you get the noise working? Like... you konw the noise color knob? I can't seem to get it to output actual noise. Of course I can select noise for the osc. Can't find a manual, that would help a lot. And surge has pitched noise!!!! I could so make chiptunes with this baby.

Edit: Arrite, I figured out the LFO routing. So how do I get the noise color thing to do something?

ew · Post by ew » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:46 am

Architeuthis wrote:
shamann wrote:The last time I looked, the definition of noise was an equal mixture of all possible frequencies- by that definition, unpitched...
tell that to NES music and C64 emulators.

And wait, I hear a few people disliking the sound of this synth? That totally ruins it for me. I want to get away from crappy oscillators and filters, but damn Z3ta+ has so many features I love... gah!

Ah... Steve didn't say that- it was me... if you're going to attempt to rip on somebody, choose the right target. And, weren't NES and C64 FM based instead of using noise oscillators? There's a difference, you know.

BONES wrote:As I've pointed out in the past, 75% of the presets use around 25% of the available features which makes me wonder why I have to wade through all the krap to do what I want to do.
Ah, so it's your kind that prevents synths like z3ta+ from coming out... no wonder there are so few synths that have all the features I want.

BONES knows exactly what he wants and how to get it, which is a lot more than I can say for what you've shown us with your posting...

ew

Architeuthis · Post by **Architeuthis** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:53 am

I meant to make you the quoter. post is now fixed.

ew wrote:And, weren't NES and C64 FM based instead of using noise oscillators?

It's based on pusle width. NES has like 3 different pulse widths you can select from. I can't recall the exact setup of the NES.

pitchdrifter · Post by **pitchdrifter** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 8:00 am

z3ta's filters aren't too hot for warm sounds. When putting a seperate filter plugin after z3ta, though, solves the problem in most cases. And what's that about substandard oscillators in z3ta? If you mean the absence of aliasing in the oscillators which is sometimes used in a creative way.. then yes. But for several applications having surgically clean oscillators without aliasing is very helpful, you get a pristine sound all the way if you need that, then you use an external filter to smooth over z3ta's own.

And yea surge is the bomb, still using both for different sounds here though.

kurasu · Post by **kurasu** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 8:21 am

Architeuthis wrote:Can't find a manual, that would help a lot. And surge has pitched noise!!!! I could so make chiptunes with this baby.

Edit: Arrite, I figured out the LFO routing. So how do I get the noise color thing to do something?

You can download the manual here: http://www.vemberaudio.se/surge/surge.pdf
It is also included in the plug-in folder you installed it in.

The noise color parameter controls the color of the fixed noise generator (the N column in the oscillator mixer).

It has no effect on the "SH noise" oscillator type. For those, just use the pitch parameter to control the color/pitch as your doing. You can extend it's range by using the context menu of the slider. If you want more coloration you'll have to use the filters.

- claes

Architeuthis · Post by **Architeuthis** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 9:13 am

ah thanks. I'm just wondering though, why was LFO routing left out for the effects?

kurasu · Post by **kurasu** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 9:17 am

You have to use the Scene LFO (SLFO1-6) for that. LFO1-6 is calculated per-voice so routing them to FX parameters doesn't make sense internally.

[EDIT] SURGE is possibly the best synth I've ever used.