One-Synth-Challenge: General discussion thread

[idfpower]

I agree, the effects play a huge role, but what does this have to do with commercial vs. free plugins? And why should I learn some freeware when I have a paid product that I selected from the sea of plugins available?

Because it's about having an even playing field - anyone can get a freebie plugin; obviously, it's not the same for commercial VSTs.

I'd like to be able to use a chorus plugin for ex, but I do understand and respect the rules of the competition. OSC is about giving your best within certain limitations, and that should (in theory) push you to come up with creative ways to achieve your desired result by using a different way/approach

[z.prime]

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You're the lucky winner - 100 pages!

[bjporter]

We agree that the difference in quality between commercial and free plugins is small, so why they shouldn't be allowed? I still don't see any reason.

Some good points here thanks

[satYatunes]

I agree, the effects play a huge role, but what does this have to do with commercial vs. free plugins? And why should I learn some freeware when I have a paid product that I selected from the sea of plugins available?

Because it's about having an even playing field - anyone can get a freebie plugin; obviously, it's not the same for commercial VSTs.

That's correct but the playing field becomes broader when DAW effects are allowed. For example, Sonar has some excellent third party effects but Reaper doesn't offer much. I do understand the need to allow DAW effects. Plus all the rules are voted and selected by us anyway.
Look at the brighter side though:
1. It really helps in fighting GAS. At least in my case. Now that I have spent some time learning a few good freewares, I am thinking why do I need their equivalent commercial plugins. For example, there are some really good freeware Reverbs, EQ, Compressors available in the market. There is no point in spending money on those anymore.
2. You learn more cause the free ones don't come with lots of presets.

I understand some commercial plugins are really unique. One example is Pro-Q. I paid a lot to get that one but believe me it's a joy to use Pro-Q. It's the workflow that wins the day. I can get the same results using ReaEQ but.. (see there's a but, don't know how to explain it)

One gripe that I have with freewares is they are abandoned after certain period of time without any further support. From developer's point of view it makes sense but from user point of view big difference. I know some are stable and works out of the box but they fall short with the current technology platform, sometime don't play well with the DAW. I had some problem with mgTempoDelay. It crashes my host (Sonar), I sent a bug report to the developer but never received a response. I had to delete that plugin even though I really loved it. Look at TAL plugins, the Reverbs, Delays are so good but god forbid if you have any problem then you are on your own. I have same problem with CM plugins, they are not updated at all but the big brother commercial one gets updated all the time. Classic example is KR-DelayCM or KR-ReverbCM. They don't remember the presets and loads the default preset every time you load the plugin. No updates or bug fixes. I know it's a marketing thing and they want the readers to buy the full version .

[e@rs]

We agree that the difference in quality between commercial and free plugins is small, so why they shouldn't be allowed? I still don't see any reason.

Some good points here thanks

My points were in the upper lines. V'ger said something like freeware is close to commercial these days, so go freeware. I turned his idea backwards. If freeware is so close to the paid options, why not allow the paid effects in?

[z.prime]

We agree that the difference in quality between commercial and free plugins is small, so why they shouldn't be allowed? I still don't see any reason.

Some good points here thanks

I'd have to agree with e@rs on this one. I spent some time searching for the ultimate reverb plugin just recently. Granted, nothing is quite the same as owning a plugin and getting acclimated to it, but I auditioned a bunch of commercial plugins, and a lot of them sounded really good. But I ended up settling on a freeware plug (a different one than I had been using). I certainly wouldn't care if anyone used a commercial reverb plugin. There are a few options in the free space that do sound really, really good.

But the same is true for just about all the other allowed type of effects, I believe. Sure, there may be an easier workflow with a FabFilter plugin (I do love them, too). But really, at the end of the day, you can achieve the same sound with something like ReaFIR or other dynamics processors, etc..

Since DAW effects are allowed, I think allowing the use of commercial plugs would end up evening the playing field even more. Being a REAPER user (for now), I do feel as though there's a bit of a disadvantage. Don't get me wrong - the plugins included are good and sound great. But there are a few things I think other DAW plugins probably do better, especially when it comes to workflow or less irritation.

Of course, I'm all for having a free-for-all with plugins including things like glitch effects.

[satYatunes]

Not sure if you guys are aware of it or not. AxisPlugins have released MotoQ for free.

Download link: http://axisplugins.com/download/Moto_Q_Free

http://axisplugins.net/themes/axis/imag ... /MotoQ.png

32 and 64 bit installer and dll file available for download. It has FFT and spectrum view. 11 bands. I cannot find a way to change filter types for band. Big UI. Only catch is you will get a nag screen pop-up window with valentine message flashing (they love you so much , clicking it will get you back to the plugin screen not a major issue considering all the features it provides. Doesn't seem like a CPU hog either I have used it briefly in Reaper though.

[satYatunes]

Being a REAPER user (for now), I do feel as though there's a bit of a disadvantage. Don't get me wrong - the plugins included are good and sound great. But there are a few things I think other DAW plugins probably do better, especially when it comes to workflow or less irritation.

I hear ya and agree 100% being a Reaper user myself. I do have Sonar X3 and can use all it's excellent effects but Reaper's efficient CPU and Memory management always draws me to it. I have bought some commercial plugins like Valhalla Reverbs, Pro-Q, FF Delay, etc. so that I can use them in Reaper. I am not making any commercial albums, can't use them in OSC so what I am doing with those. Nothing.. Nada.. except using in a demo tracks that I write for others, no other use whatsoever.

[e@rs]

I have bought some commercial plugins like Valhalla Reverbs, Pro-Q, FF Delay, etc. so that I can use them in Reaper. I am not making any commercial albums, can't use them in OSC so what I am doing with those. Nothing.. Nada.. except using in a demo tracks that I write for others, no other use whatsoever.

Yummy! Would love to hear those puppies in an OSC. So when the voting form appears, you know what to do.

[bjporter]

We agree that the difference in quality between commercial and free plugins is small, so why they shouldn't be allowed? I still don't see any reason.

Some good points here thanks

My points were in the upper lines. V'ger said something like freeware is close to commercial these days, so go freeware. I turned his idea backwards. If freeware is so close to the paid options, why not allow the paid effects in?

Yeah I know... I just wanted to say that you convinced me more on your side.

[e@rs]

Sweet. Would be nice to know more people's opinion about it.

I remember that at some point the voting included this subject and I voted 'No' to commercial plugins. Since then I reconsidered the subject and thought: why not? I'm sure everyone has bought a plug or two that they really love and it's a real shame they can't use it here.

[idfpower]

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You're the lucky winner - 100 pages!

Damn it, z, you gave me a heart attack And I'm still looking for my 100 pages ribbon - where the heck is it?


As for the subject: in addition to what I've said earlier, think about this - it's not fair to the participants of earlier OSC to dramatically change the rules now. 60 OSCs...I think there's more than enough proof that you can make a good job with freebies

[e@rs]

Of course, I'm all for having a free-for-all with plugins including things like glitch effects.

Glitch effects... Hmm... Maybe a step too far?

[e@rs]

...it's not fair to the participants of earlier OSC to dramatically change the rules now.

How's that?

60 OSCs...I think there's more than enough proof that you can make a good job with freebies

Totally agree, but did you read what I posted before? My reasons?

[idfpower]

Yup, I did.

Regarding the previous OSCs: ppl had to comply to certain rules - such as using only freeware or DAW plugins. Some won only by a few points. Being allowed to use commercial plugins they were very familiar with would have increased the chances for a better placement in the top - especially considering how picky some voters are when it comes to production. Limiter 6 is cool and all, I love Terrry's MHorse P3, but they're not Ozone, if you know what I mean

In the end it's down to this: anyone can grab a freebie. Commercial plugins...not.

I for ex keep a few freebie plugins that I don't normally use just for OSC (or rely on DAW's native effects). Maybe not everyone's ideal setup, but it is what it is.