Which plugins add unwanted watermarks to audio?
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- Topic Starter
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
I have heard of that method a couple of times, but I am not sure which synths and other plugins do that. Seems that is not necessarily something developers like to mention. So let's mention it for them
I think it is absolutely ok if developers want to protect their software, but adding anything but the sound to the audio seems way too intrusive in my view. The protection should kick in at an earlier stage, i.e. regarding the download and installation of software, not the music I make with that software.
What kind of data do such watermarks include, who "reads" them and how?
I know there are plugins whose purpose it is to add musicians' own watermarks to songs in order to protect them, but that is a completely different story and not what this thread is about.
The more we learn of the NSA etc., the more allergic I become to tracking, spying, and all that secrecy and control crap...
I think it is absolutely ok if developers want to protect their software, but adding anything but the sound to the audio seems way too intrusive in my view. The protection should kick in at an earlier stage, i.e. regarding the download and installation of software, not the music I make with that software.
What kind of data do such watermarks include, who "reads" them and how?
I know there are plugins whose purpose it is to add musicians' own watermarks to songs in order to protect them, but that is a completely different story and not what this thread is about.
The more we learn of the NSA etc., the more allergic I become to tracking, spying, and all that secrecy and control crap...
- KVRAF
- 5813 posts since 17 Aug, 2004 from Berlin, Germany
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- Topic Starter
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Still, once I know it is in there somehow, I feel like they are interfering with my music, where they have absolutely no business at all interfering.chk071 wrote:It makes no difference to the audio. Speak it is not audible.fluffy_little_something wrote: I think it is absolutely ok if developers want to protect their software, but adding anything but the sound to the audio seems way too intrusive in my view.
As mentioned, I have no idea what kind of data such watermarks include, but obviously data on those plugins. I think it is a kind of trade secret which plugins I use, I don't want anyone to know what I use.
-
- KVRAF
- 35436 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
Well, if you listen to that Aphex Twin track, you'll also know that he's interferring with you in a way that is not desired. But seriously, you won't hear or notice a thing anyway. Not sure exactly how it works, but the way i think it works, is that it adds some non-audible frequencies from time to time, which are then visible on a spectogram. Like some hiss on demo versions of plugins, just that it is not audible.
- KVRAF
- 5564 posts since 13 Jan, 2005 from the bottom of my heart
thats wrong.
the watermark in sample libraries can't be identified of course in a track (where you hear the processed audio) finally.
it's only to prevent that an user upload the original library and share it.
so the developers can only identify which buyer share the library not which track was made by using a pirated library.
thats why those criminal pirate groups use stolen credit cards with innocent customer details.
i doubt there are plugins using watermark method but it's possible the dev put an idividual chiffre in the code.
this is not a big problem either like said the bad boys use carding or simply manipulate the code.
the watermark in sample libraries can't be identified of course in a track (where you hear the processed audio) finally.
it's only to prevent that an user upload the original library and share it.
so the developers can only identify which buyer share the library not which track was made by using a pirated library.
thats why those criminal pirate groups use stolen credit cards with innocent customer details.
i doubt there are plugins using watermark method but it's possible the dev put an idividual chiffre in the code.
this is not a big problem either like said the bad boys use carding or simply manipulate the code.
Last edited by murnau on Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Whoever wants music instead of noise, joy instead of pleasure, soul instead of gold, creative work instead of business, passion instead of foolery, finds no home in this trivial world of ours.
- KVRAF
- 5564 posts since 13 Jan, 2005 from the bottom of my heart
i tried to explain that you won't find any watermark in the processed audio (your track) only in the original product (the library itself).chk071 wrote:Hm, no idea how it works then.
Whoever wants music instead of noise, joy instead of pleasure, soul instead of gold, creative work instead of business, passion instead of foolery, finds no home in this trivial world of ours.
-
fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- Topic Starter
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Someone said Tone2 uses such watermarks. But that company does not even make any sample stuff, right?murnau wrote:i tried to explain that you won't find any watermark in the processed audio (your track) only in the original product (the library itself).chk071 wrote:Hm, no idea how it works then.
-
- KVRAF
- 35436 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
Yeah, but how does that work on a plugin. Actually i also lack the info of what a watermark exactly is in this case. I only know what it does, say, in a picture or a video file.
- KVRAF
- 5564 posts since 13 Jan, 2005 from the bottom of my heart
watermarking is common protection in sample world. for tone2: they claim to use watermark, as i wrote above i understand that they maybe have some individual strings (numbers+letters) deep in the code.fluffy_little_something wrote:Someone said Tone2 uses such watermarks. But that company does not even make any sample stuff, right?murnau wrote:i tried to explain that you won't find any watermark in the processed audio (your track) only in the original product (the library itself).chk071 wrote:Hm, no idea how it works then.
if you share your version they can identify you by downloading themself and check, no way then can filter it out in a track.
god knows only, and i dont really care nowdays.
Last edited by murnau on Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Whoever wants music instead of noise, joy instead of pleasure, soul instead of gold, creative work instead of business, passion instead of foolery, finds no home in this trivial world of ours.
- KVRAF
- 9800 posts since 18 Aug, 2007 from NYC
It's simply extra data added to sample files, so to identify the original purchaser of the sample library.fluffy_little_something wrote:Someone said Tone2 uses such watermarks. But that company does not even make any sample stuff, right?murnau wrote:i tried to explain that you won't find any watermark in the processed audio (your track) only in the original product (the library itself).chk071 wrote:Hm, no idea how it works then.
There's no "watermarking" of the output audio signal.
As murnau said.
-
- KVRAF
- 35436 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
I found this: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 28#4463228 Maybe that's it, dunno.
-
- KVRist
- 467 posts since 3 Jun, 2012
when you mean plugins or vst's !
an simple example are jbridge , the developer codes your name and e-mail adress directly in the files , thats just one example
an simple example are jbridge , the developer codes your name and e-mail adress directly in the files , thats just one example
- KVRAF
- 9800 posts since 18 Aug, 2007 from NYC
If there was, it would be rendered useless if processed by *any* external effects.murnau wrote:watermarking is common protection in sample world. for tone2: they claim to use watermark, as i wrote above i understand that they maybe have some individual strings (numbers+letters) deep in the code.fluffy_little_something wrote:Someone said Tone2 uses such watermarks. But that company does not even make any sample stuff, right?murnau wrote:i tried to explain that you won't find any watermark in the processed audio (your track) only in the original product (the library itself).chk071 wrote:Hm, no idea how it works then.
if you share your version they can identify you by downloading themself and check, no way then can filter it out in a track.
god knows only, and i dont really care nowdays.
If concerned use a spectrogram to verify.
Here's a free one: http://spek.cc/