KVR Audio

thebaggytrouseredone · Fri Nov 18, 2011 1:20 pm

Jono-60 wrote:Akai could at least update it to include CoreMIDI support (like the upcoming iPad 49 version) and that would be a huge improvement in itself.

I was thinking that myself. It can be used as a DAW midi controller so it has midi messages, not sure but would that be core midi on a Mac?

Alesis released a firmware update for the IO Dock, so I don't see why Akai won't release a Core Midi firmware update for the SynthStation 25 when the 49 comes out.

Numark, Alesis, Akai, Ion, more or less the same company, all owned by Numark as far as I know.

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 1:40 pm

thebaggytrouseredone wrote: Alesis released a firmware update for the IO Dock, so I don't see why Akai won't release a Core Midi firmware update for the SynthStation 25 when the 49 comes out.

Maybe the Synthstation isn't capable of firmware updates...

- Sascha

thebaggytrouseredone · Fri Nov 18, 2011 1:50 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:
thebaggytrouseredone wrote: Alesis released a firmware update for the IO Dock, so I don't see why Akai won't release a Core Midi firmware update for the SynthStation 25 when the 49 comes out.
Maybe the Synthstation isn't capable of firmware updates...

- Sascha

You could be right, but I'm trying to think positive

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Sat Nov 19, 2011 6:46 am

AFAIK, class-compliant audio and MIDI USB devices use USB-based protocols set up by the USB consortium as communication standards. This insures that a USB device will be recognized by an OS and work properly and this is also what makes these devices both Mac and PC compatible. It's also what allows many audio and midi devices to work on the iPad through the CCK, as the CCK offers USB connectivity to the outside world.

I don't know how the Synthstation 25 connects to the iPod but I doubt that it's by USB; it's more likely a serial connection which would be a lot cheaper and easier to develop. MIDI is a very slow protocol and can be handled with very simple circuitry.

Core Audio and Core MIDI are standards that Apple has developed for their OSes, no doubt derived from the IP they acquired from their Emagic acquisition in the last decade. These standards know and communicate with class-compliant USB audio and MIDI devices.

So if you can use the CCK, class-compliant devices will work. In the iOS 5 beta, the CCK was working on the iPhone 4 and the iPod Touch 4G and class-compliant were found to be working as a result, but Apple pulled that compatibility, closing that door. It's unknown outside of Apple's closely guarded hardware developer network if class-compliant USB audio and MIDI would work if connected directly to the USB pins of the these 4G devices, but it's likely that even if they did, Apple would still be able to control whether they work or not, as they can with the CCK.

The only hope I could see for the Synthstation 25 to offer Core Midi support would be if someone wrote software that might be able to bridge the AKAI driver to Core MIDI in the iOS as a background task. I have no idea how feasible this is. And then there's the firmware question... who knows!

In the meantime, I'm quite happy with the little "25": it's really great with nanostudio and does class-compliant USB when connected to my laptop. Sure it's limited, velocity isn't that great, but then it was only $65!

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:14 pm

I doubt USB connectivity has to do anything with things being Core Audio/MIDI compatible.
I mean, those iRig things seem to work in just about any sequencer and they're either connected to the headphone or dock jacks. The same goes for the Line 6 stuff, I think.
In other words: I think that AKAI originally tried tailor the Synthstation to only work with their app. Then they realized that there were quite a few other apps that they couldn't beat (not even by 1000 miles...), so they released their Synthstation SDK, hoping they'd sell a few more of their hardware units.

- Sascha

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:11 pm

I just looked at the "about" on Synthstation 25 in my iPod's General Settings, and it actually says "Firmware 1.0.4". So it looks like a firmware update may be a possibility in the future.

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 7:18 pm

Out of curiosity, I managed to play Sunrizer from rtp-MIDI today using the SS25 plugged into my Mac as a MIDI keyboard and wirelessly communicating to the iPod's Core MIDI stack through Saitara's AC-7's Core Mini App Controller ($4.99). It actually works, but it isn't really usable because the latency on fast notes is atrocious. But it's totally going round the block to get next door, anyway...

Cicatrix · Post by **Cicatrix** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 9:22 pm

Is it too much to ask for a usb/midi controller that works with the iphone other than the synth station? I have an lpk25, and an iphone. Is there any way to get them to talk to eachother? No, of course not. What a crazy idea. The only way right now to get a usb/midi controller to work with the iphone is to use something like a usb/midi host. Like the Kenton one, but for almost $150.00 I think I'll take a pass. The cck should just friggin work with the iphone. I guess wanting a usb/midi controller IS to much to ask.

Cicatrix · Post by **Cicatrix** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:38 am

Whuups, I stand corrected, here is another controller for the iphone/ipad from Bed Bath And Beyond.
www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?SKU=18684080

Just... wow.

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:38 am

Cicatrix wrote:Whuups, I stand corrected, here is another controller for the iphone/ipad from Bed Bath And Beyond.
www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?SKU=18684080

Just... wow.

OMG - that looks pretty sturdy and professional...
However, at least it's Core MIDI compatible.

It's really making me wonder more and more that there doesn't seem to be a larger market for such things - or better, that very little companies seem to believe in the sucess of such a thing. Rather weird. I mean, the world is all about smartphone here, tablet there, and especially among musicians the iPhone seems to hold quite some marketshare. Yet there's no decent MIDI controllers out there, let alone a combination of audio and MIDI.

- Sascha

Cicatrix · Post by **Cicatrix** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 4:07 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:
Cicatrix wrote:Whuups, I stand corrected, here is another controller for the iphone/ipad from Bed Bath And Beyond.
www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?SKU=18684080

Just... wow.
OMG - that looks pretty sturdy and professional...
However, at least it's Core MIDI compatible.

It's really making me wonder more and more that there doesn't seem to be a larger market for such things - or better, that very little companies seem to believe in the sucess of such a thing. Rather weird. I mean, the world is all about smartphone here, tablet there, and especially among musicians the iPhone seems to hold quite some marketshare. Yet there's no decent MIDI controllers out there, let alone a combination of audio and MIDI.

- Sascha

F'n aay cotton, f'n aaaay! took the words right out of my mouth. Developers really need to get with the program. Look on the bright side though, this is the bleeding edge right here, and at least your keeping current. I think the time right now is sort of the calm before the storm. I believe within the next year smartphone device peripherals will really start to ramp up.

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:11 am

Some news: audeonic.com's MIDI Bridge app is about to be released with Synthstation 25 support. This will bridge the SS25 to Core MIDI.

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:38 am

Breeze wrote:Some news: audeonic.com's MIDI Bridge app is about to be released with Synthstation 25 support. This will bridge the SS25 to Core MIDI.

Thanks for the info ... that is very good news for SS25 users. Will quote in Alchemy Mobile thread!

Peace,
Andy.

Jono-60 · Post by **Jono-60** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:40 am

Breeze wrote:Some news: audeonic.com's MIDI Bridge app is about to be released with Synthstation 25 support. This will bridge the SS25 to Core MIDI.

So can you route MIDI from SS25 to any other iOS app which supports CoreMIDI?

audeonic · Post by **audeonic** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:16 pm

Jono-60 wrote:
Breeze wrote:Some news: audeonic.com's MIDI Bridge app is about to be released with Synthstation 25 support. This will bridge the SS25 to Core MIDI.
So can you route MIDI from SS25 to any other iOS app which supports CoreMIDI?

Yes, and also to CoreMIDI Network so you can go completely wireless.

Should I get a Akai Synthstation 25?