ValhallaVintageVerb 1.7.1. Two new reverb modes (Chaotic Hall, Chaotic Chamber)

[djanthonyw]

Is there a way to keep the 1970s GUI as default regardless of changing the color setting?

Sorry if I missed it, but could anyone please tell me if there was any response to this?

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Is there a way to keep the 1970s GUI as default regardless of changing the color setting?

Sorry if I missed it, but could anyone please tell me if there was any response to this?

I'm pretty sure Sean popped in to say the answer is no and that the GUI will always change based on the mode.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Question for Sean: from a design perspective, would it be accurate to say that the 70's mode is more 224-like (in terms of sampling rate/brightness/modulation), with the 80's mode being more 480-like and Now mode just being a much cleaner than the former two?

Also, from what boxes would you say each reverb algorithm was inspired by? Was the goal to shoot for an 80's Lexicon sound on all of these algo's, or is there more of a "bit of 224 here, some 480 here, with some PCM there" kind of thing going on? Example: can you point to say the Room algo and say, "oh that one's similar to the 224" whereas "the plate is close to the 480 Plate" or is it not that simple?

[valhallasound]

Is there a way to keep the 1970s GUI as default regardless of changing the color setting?

Sorry if I missed it, but could anyone please tell me if there was any response to this?

I'm pretty sure Sean popped in to say the answer is no and that the GUI will always changed based on the mode.

This is correct.

Sean Costello

[ChiTown24]

Is there a way to keep the 1970s GUI as default regardless of changing the color setting?

Sorry if I missed it, but could anyone please tell me if there was any response to this?

he discussed it briefly with aMUSEd on page 20, at the end of the exchange he was asked if it was possible to set a default GUI colour scheme and he gave a pretty flat out "No." as a response, and hasn't discussed it any further since. edit;; I see he just replied to you

Yeah but is it possible to set the GUI just to that colour?

No.

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... &start=285

I guess the best we can do is +1 the idea, and perhaps it will be taken as a feature request and added in a future update if there's enough interest. My personal opinion is that it would be pretty vain to insist your customers simply get accustomed to pretty crass changes in GUI contrast & colour depending on the presets you happen to be using. The colour schemes... it's a cute idea, but come on, we should be able to at least choose one as a default.

Sure I get that but I really don't need any visual cue other than the setting I can read, plus my ears.

plus one

[djanthonyw]

Ok, disappointing, but thanks for clarifying.

[rasmusklump]

-1

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Ok, disappointing, but thanks for clarifying.

Remember though, the different GUI's are there to tell you instantly, which mode you're in. It's actually quite handy. Why read if you don't have to (says the former English Literature major)?

[olikana]

Question for Sean: from a design perspective, would it be accurate to say that the 70's mode is more 224-like (in terms of sampling rate/brightness/modulation), with the 80's mode being more 480-like and Now mode just being a much cleaner than the former two?

Also, from what boxes would you say each reverb algorithm was inspired by? Was the goal to shoot for an 80's Lexicon sound on all of these algo's, or is there more of a "bit of 224 here, some 480 here, with some PCM there" kind of thing going on? Example: can you point to say the Room algo and say, "oh that one's similar to the 224" whereas "the plate is close to the 480 Plate" or is it not that simple?

i bet the 70s one is based on some EMT reverb. those were the most popular in the 70s.
the 224 i consider it an 80s reverb, the most important one imo (was released in 78 and made it's way into studios in early 80s and till 86 was pretty much on every big release)
and then the 480 came out in 1986 and suddenly 80s music started not to sound so 80s anymore (but in fairness it was more down to analog synths being dropped than the change in reverb but...).

anyway i don't see any 80s examples in this thread. here's a quick 80s italo composition with valhallaVV for reverb(just one instance with everything sent to it in various amounts)
not had much time to try it out so...i'm sure it can deliver even a more authentic 80s sound....although on first try i think it's more 480 sounding than 224....although there's a bit of that 224 chorusing goin on.
http://soundcloud.com/olikana/olikana-h ... 84-testing

[djanthonyw]

Ok, disappointing, but thanks for clarifying.

Remember though, the different GUI's are there to tell you instantly, which mode you're in. It's actually quite handy. Why read if you don't have to (says the former English Literature major)?

"Why read if you don't have to?" I agree with, but not for something as easy as looking at a few words to see which "color" is selected. We have to read the rest of the GUI to see what those parameters are set as anyway. I like the 70's GUI best, and it would be nice to keep it as that. Anyway, that's just my preference.

[trance_lucent]

It is interesting thing olikana started to discuss. I want to ask similar things to people who knows Lexicons very well.
I want to set VVV to sound more like 480L than other Lexicons. How to do it?
For example, one of questions is what mode I have to use? Random space with pitchless modulation, if I understand correctly, is characterful mode of 480L. And what about other modes? Can 480L use pitch modulation like other VVV modes?
And besides modes and color what are characterful settings differentiating 480L from other Lexicons?

P. S. Yes, I undstand that it is strange questions, and it is better just to set the sound to that I like, but it is also interest for me.

[Caine123]

how much different is vintage to room ?

can you say something like, room is better for leads, piano and vintage better for percussions etc.? or how can you maybe compare and explaing to someone who is no pro in reverbs . how do you find the differences?

[Bronto Scorpio]

how much different is vintage to room ?

can you say something like, room is better for leads, piano and vintage better for percussions etc.? or how can you maybe compare and explaing to someone who is no pro in reverbs . how do you find the differences?

VRoom is more room-y while VVV is more vintage-y

In my opinion VRoom is "better" to put something into a physical space while VVV is "better" for classic reverb effects.

I hope that makes any sense.

Many classic reverb units were not really that good at simulating realistic spaces, but the sound that resulted out of that shortcoming has become something desirable itself over the past few decades. If you're after that kind of sound, use VVV.

If you want to take your 808 cowbell sample and place it in an abandoned dog house in south india, use VRoom.

Cheers
Dennis

[hibidy]

how much different is vintage to room ?

can you say something like, room is better for leads, piano and vintage better for percussions etc.? or how can you maybe compare and explaing to someone who is no pro in reverbs . how do you find the differences?

Here's what I did. I set up VVV in many situations. I used VR and refektor as reference. I did things like using on a snare track, full drums on a buss, guitar (lots of guitar) panning, and piano. The idea was if I got a certain feeling when using it.

What I noticed in particular was how much more natural it sounds to my ears. Nothing wrong with room, but there was something more tamed on things like the plates. Would I just be a total idiot if I said it was more focused in the tests? VR is.........ROOMY This can be as huge as you want, or as tame as you want....the presets are mostly very very good here just like VR.

Hopefully, that helps. I tried to hate BTW, I tried very hard to say "meh, I already have enough verbs" it was epic fail.

[valhallasound]

Question for Sean: from a design perspective, would it be accurate to say that the 70's mode is more 224-like (in terms of sampling rate/brightness/modulation), with the 80's mode being more 480-like and Now mode just being a much cleaner than the former two?

The 1970s mode is definitely 224-esque, but it is more "generically" inspired by 1970s reverbs such as the 224 and EMT250. The lower sampling rate is typical of digital processors from that era, and will put certain signal processing artifacts into a more pronounced audible range versus running at the full sampling rate.

The 1980s mode is full bandwidth, but has artifacts reminiscent of the older Lexicon stuff. When I was running test signals through the Concert Hall algorithm in my PCM70 and the "Reverberation" algorithm in my Lex 300 (which seems similar to the Random Hall algorithm in later Lex 300 ROM revisions), I was struck by how darned noisy the modulation was. It pretty much swamps any of the more subtle bit depth effects in the Lexicons that I worked with.

NOW mode is full bandwidth and clean. I turn off the modulation noise in the NOW mode, and use a "cleaner" delay interpolation.

Also, from what boxes would you say each reverb algorithm was inspired by? Was the goal to shoot for an 80's Lexicon sound on all of these algo's, or is there more of a "bit of 224 here, some 480 here, with some PCM there" kind of thing going on? Example: can you point to say the Room algo and say, "oh that one's similar to the 224" whereas "the plate is close to the 480 Plate" or is it not that simple?

None of the ValhallaVintageVerb algorithms are 1:1 reproductions of any specific algorithms. Some are closer to a specific hardware implementation than others, but I added extra filtering, diffusion and modulation as I saw fit.

The Concert Hall and Bright Hall are closest to the various Hall algorithms found in the 224, 224XL, PCM70, and other units I haven't heard. I dialed in the sound of those algorithms using my PCM70 Concert Hall as reference.

The other algorithms occupy a zone somewhere between the 224XL and 480L. I was influenced by the post-224 Lexicon topologies, i.e. the Rich Chamber and Rich Plate algorithms which were introduced in the 224XL, and were used as the basis of most of the Lexicon algorithms to follow. The Shape & Spread parameters were introduced in the 480L, and I incorporated this into the Attack settings of most of the algorithms - but I also incorporated the "Attack" techniques used in my PCM70, which is closer to what is found in the Position slider in some Eventide reverbs. I used the random modulation of the 480L Random Hall in Random Space, but the other algorithms use chorusing modulation closer to the 224 and 224XL. My guess is that my modulation is more widely distributed than in these older boxes, as they were limited in the amount of cycles that could be applied to interpolation.

The Ambience algorithm is the one that I based the most closely on a specific hardware implementation. I really worked hard at dialing in the randomized early reflections of the Lexicon 300. I don't think the results exactly duplicate the 300 algorithm, but it is impossible to do any sort of null test with this sort of randomization.

The late reverb in the VeeThree Ambience is totally different than the late reverb in my Lex 300, as the Lex 300 Ambience late reverb totally sucks. It's not even a reverb: IT'S AN ECHO. Just a simple stereo delay line, which has the randomized early reflections sent into it. My guess is that this is due to the amount of cycles available in the Lex 300, and that the decision was made to spend the cycles on the early reflections. Which is a good choice, as it is a great sound. Fortunately, cycles aren't as big a deal in native code, so I was able to put a more complex Chamber late reverb in my Ambience algorithm.

Sean Costello