KVR Audio

ParadoxMachine · Post by **ParadoxMachine** » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:00 pm

I was thinking about doing that XD So now I'll stop thinking and just do. Sylenth's demo is pretty tame, disabling very little, and the "Thank you for trying this demo" is a great deal LESS annoying then the sound cutting out, ear-piercing woosh coming in, etc.

I gotta ask, what do you think of D16 Phosycon, both for bass and for use in psytrance?

Zexila · Post by **Zexila** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 12:08 am

ParadoxMachine wrote:I gotta ask, what do you think of D16 Phosycon, both for bass and for use in psytrance?

Personally wouldn't use it for a bass, for what it does, 303, I'm totally into doing it with something like 101 or in this case TAL's 101, I don't know, there's something about it, try Charlatan also, same appeal to me, crank resonance and just go nuts

Nord Lead is kinda cool obviously, so Synth1 will do it for sure there, also Virus is obviously there too, so kinda don't miss out on Spire either, but I have feeling you know all this all too well.

MUX from MuTools could be fun if you have any desires towards modular on long run, it sounds great and it's more than a synth, that's solid investment really, don't miss out on that either

But as basslines goes, if I were into psytrance these days, today, Spire, you can really get envelopes right and filters are really great, for sure, Trilian is great also and that's what many pro's use, but it's kinda pricey in 2016 for doing "only" basslines, sure it's more than just a bass for psy, but on a tight budget, you don't have that luxury, so killing many flies as possible is the way to go, so Spire definitely.

I know, I know, there's Zebra, sure, not my cup of tea, but don't miss out, that's another budget all rounder winner, if you dig what you see, don't think twice, get it, that thing is really rewarding if you can get into it, I see the potential, but not myself using it

ParadoxMachine · Post by **ParadoxMachine** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 2:08 am

I've actually just discovered that the LFO on Charlatan could get those wacky, rubbery sounds. I've developed a liking to that one, especially since it forces me to start from scratch. I know, not necessarily, but it's been an experience.

I've considered Spire, in fact it'd help my production IMMENSELY (it's not just psytrance) but $189 is just a bit too much. Reason why I'm stuck on Phosycon, or looking at the V-Station: I think I can afford those. Or FAW Circle2. You get what I mean, it's a real tight budget I've got. Hence Zebra, at $199 is simply out of the question just because of the price tag.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 8:03 am

Phoscyon is superb, and if it's good enough for the 303 king Richie Hawtin it's good enough for me.

It's comes up very cheap here in the marketplace too.

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 8:10 am

If I had to restrict myself to only one synth, it would be Spire, definitely, especially for psy. It's pricey but they often do sales, or you may watch out the market place.

Phoscyon, afaik, does only one thing: emulates the 303. If you don't want maximum possible authencity, you probably don't need Phoscyon, 303-like acid lines may be made by other synths. Check out this http://antonsavov.net/cms/projects/venom-vb-303.html - it's free does the same thing, or these cheap ones http://www.muon-software.com/html/shop.html

Dunno about V-Station, it's an old synth, i guess Dune CM may be a better choice and it is much cheaper to get.

I'd stick to freeware synths if you can't afford Spire now, you just have to choose the good ones. When you install Zebra demo, it also installs free Zebralette synth, which is basically Zebra restrcited to one oscillator. One oscillator should be enough for psy bass and many other psytrance sounds. Zebra's sound character is kinda "love or hate" thing but at least it is commercial quality sound engine, people use it for psytrance bass. Also check out another free synth by U-He - Tyrell N6 (the download links are here https://www.amazona.de/amazona-de-freew ... -n6-synth/).

Tone2 Firebird is also a fine freeware synth from the company making commercial stuff, can be used for more "trancier" sounds.

Dune CM is probably the best freeware synth out there for trance/psy, you have to buy an issue of Computer Music magazine to get it but it is still very cheap (and you get access to some other interesting stuff like Enzyme CM). It has good subtractive engine (should be fine for psy basses and other things), and also has andvanced unison (supersaws and the like).

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 8:13 am

^ Yes indeed, I should clarify. I suggested Phoscyon only for the 303 sound.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 8:28 am

BTW, awesome thread

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:56 am

Nice tutroial by Daniel Lesden

http://daniellesden.com/blog/all/psytra ... synthesis/

Again, Sylenth, just a saw osicllator, the envelope set right,

some equalization (to enhance the lower harmonics).

He also resamples his basses (this is what I never do myself)

Further processing, like distortion or compressor, is mentioned as optional

And an offtopic video to show the awesomeness of Spire

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKrEBBc ... e=youtu.be

ParadoxMachine · Post by **ParadoxMachine** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 3:51 pm

recursive one wrote:If I had to restrict myself to only one synth, it would be Spire, definitely, especially for psy. It's pricey but they often do sales, or you may watch out the market place.

Phoscyon, afaik, does only one thing: emulates the 303. If you don't want maximum possible authencity, you probably don't need Phoscyon, 303-like acid lines may be made by other synths. Check out this http://antonsavov.net/cms/projects/venom-vb-303.html - it's free does the same thing, or these cheap ones http://www.muon-software.com/html/shop.html

Dunno about V-Station, it's an old synth, i guess Dune CM may be a better choice and it is much cheaper to get.

I'd stick to freeware synths if you can't afford Spire now, you just have to choose the good ones. When you install Zebra demo, it also installs free Zebralette synth, which is basically Zebra restrcited to one oscillator. One oscillator should be enough for psy bass and many other psytrance sounds. Zebra's sound character is kinda "love or hate" thing but at least it is commercial quality sound engine, people use it for psytrance bass. Also check out another free synth by U-He - Tyrell N6 (the download links are here https://www.amazona.de/amazona-de-freew ... -n6-synth/).

Tone2 Firebird is also a fine freeware synth from the company making commercial stuff, can be used for more "trancier" sounds.

Dune CM is probably the best freeware synth out there for trance/psy, you have to buy an issue of Computer Music magazine to get it but it is still very cheap (and you get access to some other interesting stuff like Enzyme CM). It has good subtractive engine (should be fine for psy basses and other things), and also has andvanced unison (supersaws and the like).

Phosycon is an idea that got stuck in my head, I tried the demo and it's fun to program, much easier than the Venom TB. Muon TAU or Pro, never tried. Maybe I oughtta, save myself fifty bucks

Tyrell N6 is a bastard. Back when I had a four-year-old Sony VAIO, it was impossible to use. Then I doubled my processing power, and it's still impossible to use. Like Mausynth, I ain't never seen such a CPU hog. The laptop that can handle seven instances of Kairatune simultaneously, on top of other stuff, can't deal with a single solitary instance of Tyrell N6 in isolation.

I love the FireBird. It's got the potential for some insane stuff, especially those FM FX.

Now, question. Yesterday I made a not-so-bad psy bass with Dune BE. Is there a difference between the CM and BE versions of Dune? On that note, I've been thinking about getting a CM issue and thus the synths in their database, which includes a CM version of Zebra... among other, yummy things.

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Tue Mar 01, 2016 4:18 pm

Dune CM and BE are almost the same thing, one of them has more modulation slots, don't remember which one (more likely BE off the top of my head). You don't need both.

Zexila · Post by **Zexila** » Wed Mar 02, 2016 5:52 pm

ParadoxMachine wrote:I've considered Spire, in fact it'd help my production IMMENSELY (it's not just psytrance) but $189 is just a bit too much.

Watch for sales and Market Place here

Reason why I'm stuck on Phosycon, or looking at the V-Station: I think I can afford those. Or FAW Circle2. You get what I mean, it's a real tight budget I've got. Hence Zebra, at $199 is simply out of the question just because of the price tag.

I understand, money is tight, but they aren't that much cheaper retail than second hand Spire for example.

ACE from u-he is another gem if you see yourself patching semi-modular, I'm talking here mostly about synths that can do great psy bass among other things

But I'm staying with my opinion that Spire would be enough for me to make most EDM genres even, not just psy bass, it's one great synth.

ParadoxMachine · Post by **ParadoxMachine** » Fri Mar 04, 2016 4:35 am

Well, thanks to the marketplace, I now have a V-Station, which I've heard is notorious for its trance and psytrance inclinations. Well, one of the first things I did was attempt a bassline. This little beastie came a lot closer, and I mean a LOT closer. In fact, I now have a neat little bass!

Phormula: Single oscillator saw-wave, amp decay and release adjusted (no sustain), filter adjusted. Now two things that liven it up a bit are a modest amount of distortion, and since the VST has no oscillator phase, a healthy dose of the phaser. I EQ'd the mids, cut down around 700Hz a bit, (debating whether or not to highpass the sub, perhaps not, sounds meaner with it), and used Soundgoodizer to boost the bass portion. I sidechained it to the kick, then adjusted note velocities to get the groove rolling. Done.

Fiddling with the resonance creates interesting sounds until it's cranked up too high.

Loving this one so far.

Zexila · Post by **Zexila** » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:45 am

ParadoxMachine wrote:Well, thanks to the marketplace, I now have a V-Station, which I've heard is notorious for its trance and psytrance inclinations. Well, one of the first things I did was attempt a bassline. This little beastie came a lot closer, and I mean a LOT closer. In fact, I now have a neat little bass!

Glad to hear that

(debating whether or not to highpass the sub, perhaps not, sounds meaner with it)

That's tricky stuff right there, try at least HP-ing ultra low around 35-ish hz, I know, sometimes bass sounded better without it, I know, try at least a demo of Acon Digital Equalize on mixed phase mode, go steep freely, that thing is "it" for that tasks, when you don't want to change overall sound and don't want that ultra low energy taking up headroom.

Loving this one so far.

Awesome

ParadoxMachine · Post by **ParadoxMachine** » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:59 am

Thanks!

The one thing I've been unable to get rid of is sort of a "whirring" sound in every note, but it looks to be an ADSR issue, with decay not setting in fast enough. Man, I rig it every which way, but this puppy slays me every time. XD

I'm gonna try HPing the ultra low as well. Let's see what happens.

recursive one · Post by **recursive one** » Fri Mar 04, 2016 7:28 am

ParadoxMachine wrote:
Phormula: Single oscillator saw-wave, amp decay and release adjusted (no sustain), filter adjusted. Now two things that liven it up a bit are a modest amount of distortion, and since the VST has no oscillator phase, a healthy dose of the phaser.

Curious to hear how your bass sounds with a phaser and without osc phase retriggering. One of the things that make classic "machine gun" psy bass is dead-accurate retrigger. But it doesn't mean that you cannot make a good bass in some other way, psy is about experimentation.

Psytrance basslines