KVR Audio

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:15 pm

I can't remember.

llze · Post by **llze** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:14 pm

according to this, it cost 299$ and was only available for OS9 to that time..
http://mixonline.com/products/review/au ... on_live_2/

compared to that, and to what bitwig has to offer from version 1 i think the price is pretty fair yes.

see this for a review of features back then.

http://www.audiomac.net/audiomac_archiv ... _live.html

the internet forgets nothing

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:22 pm

600 garbonzas for suite back in Nov of 2012 with a free upgrade to 9. Worth every penny.

llze · Post by **llze** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:25 pm

so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?

Echoes in the Attic · Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:32 pm

Live 2 was $399. Had no VST instruments or instruments of it's own.

https://www.ableton.com/en/pages/2002/l ... ouncement/

Of course you can't really compare prices now to then. Absynth used to cost about that as well, maybe 349.

Bitwig's price is very fair though.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:49 pm

Suloo wrote:so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?

Yes. Though I'm not going to post the next big hit, what I've been able to do in live has been amazing. Push of course I'm new to, but so far it's also been worth what I paid.

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:15 am

Suloo wrote:so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?

What I really like about Ableton is the way they listen to their customers. It's only been a few years, and they've still not fixed the PDC bug. In fact I believe they changed it from a bug to a feature request, wasn't that nice of them?

pdxindy · Post by **pdxindy** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:42 am

virtualmark wrote:
Suloo wrote:so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?
What I really like about Ableton is the way they listen to their customers. It's only been a few years, and they've still not fixed the PDC bug. In fact I believe they changed it from a bug to a feature request, wasn't that nice of them?

It is a feature request and not a bug. Live PDC is functioning as intended.

llze · Post by **llze** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:59 am

cannot be that dramatic when it took so long for people to recognize imo..

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:10 am

pdxindy wrote:
virtualmark wrote:
Suloo wrote:so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?
What I really like about Ableton is the way they listen to their customers. It's only been a few years, and they've still not fixed the PDC bug. In fact I believe they changed it from a bug to a feature request, wasn't that nice of them?
It is a feature request and not a bug. Live PDC is functioning as intended.

That's what I just said. But they changed it to that a while after the bug was reported.

I don't know what sort of music you make, but to most people, timing is important. It is a bug.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:25 am

Sometimes I wonder if this even applies to me or not with how I use live. I don't feel that there is a problem but then again I don't use the arrangement view much. I generally prefer to export my files and work in studio one if I want to get into automation and the like.

pdxindy · Post by **pdxindy** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:16 am

virtualmark wrote:
pdxindy wrote:
virtualmark wrote:
Suloo wrote:so you mean live 9 suite is worth every penny?
What I really like about Ableton is the way they listen to their customers. It's only been a few years, and they've still not fixed the PDC bug. In fact I believe they changed it from a bug to a feature request, wasn't that nice of them?
It is a feature request and not a bug. Live PDC is functioning as intended.
That's what I just said. But they changed it to that a while after the bug was reported.

I don't know what sort of music you make, but to most people, timing is important. It is a bug.

Live has no PDC functionality for automation. Never has. It is a feature that has not yet been implemented. Just as there is no support for PolyAT, Sysex, 3rd party midi plugins before an instrument and so on. To some people, a score editor is important and Live does not have that either.

I guess some people (perhaps yourself) insist on calling it a bug because they think it may shame Ableton into adding that feature quicker. I doubt that is useful.

I'm still curious about PDC in Bitwig. I know there have been some assurances from a few users that it is working, but I have not read of any specific tests to make sure it is handling automation and plugins with latency... particularly 3rd party plugins.

Until I read about some specific tests done, I'm prepared for some issues to be there.

llze · Post by **llze** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:21 am

maybe thats why live sound so...

just to not forget all klichees..

machinesworking · Post by **machinesworking** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:39 am

pdxindy wrote: Live has no PDC functionality for automation. Never has. It is a feature that has not yet been implemented. Just as there is no support for PolyAT, Sysex, 3rd party midi plugins before an instrument and so on. To some people, a score editor is important and Live does not have that either.

I guess some people (perhaps yourself) insist on calling it a bug because they think it may shame Ableton into adding that feature quicker. I doubt that is useful.

This is a little misleading. Most other DAWs I can think of do not have issues with automation being out of sync with their audio PDC etc. I do not recall full disclosure when Ableton implemented PDC in the first place that Automation would remain affected by plug in delay etc? In fact I'm dead certain they didn't mention that. With that in mind this "feature request" can be called a bug, although I would call it a glaring omission.

This is also one of those bugs that is more of a problem depending on how you work. Often I don't flesh out details of a sound before I'm done writing, so Automation comes after I've added almost all the plug ins I'll use, hence no automation issues.
All the guys doing simple but heavily processed House etc. tend to build up a sound after automating various parts, then the bug is a PITA.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:39 pm

I can see why some would call it a bug, if I'm understanding it all. If you're given a musical grid to draw automation in that the automation snaps to it pretty much implies that that is what you are going to hear, and apparently it isn't so.

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