MUTOOLS

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:18 pm

will this ever be?

mutools · Post by **mutools** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 9:42 am

Ok an update on the MUX for Mac challenge:

Some time ago i said MUX for Mac is a top priority for MuTools. So i've done the basic research for it. Conclusion was that i can't R&D MUX for Mac with my current Mac setup, i need to invest in a new Mac etc, quite an investment. I could go for that as i'm confident it will pay itself back. BUT:

But unfortunately Apple proves that OSX is a volatile platform that regularly breaks compatibilities with previous OSX versions. An astonishing example of that, even unrelated to MuTools, is that a Roland SH 201 cannot be used anymore on OSX yosemite because the driver is broken and even a big company like Roland understandably abandons having to update drivers all the time. See http://roland.com/support/article/?q=in ... d=63061613 and see http://forums.rolandclan.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=49240
I only have one word for that: Crazy! This is about a standard synth and it's about a standard feature i.e. playing MIDI via USB, no more, no less. The reality that you cannot simple plug & play a SH 201 on Yosemite anymore is crazy and very user unfriendly imho. And there are many other examples of such OSX version incompatibilities.

I would love to go for MUX for Mac and even do the necessary investments in Apple hardware, software and add-ons and R&D time, but now i'm hesitating because if i do all these investments but the resulting MUX for Mac becomes incompatible due to new OSX version incompatibilities a few months later, then i've done a lot of investments for too little return. And having to chase all OSX incompatibilities all the time like an Apple slave is not really my ambition in life.

Conclusion: I'm still evaluating the decission to do all these hardware, software and R&D investments. Wish the answer was a lot more simple, resulting in a GO, really i would love to have MUX on Mac. But i have to take reality into account and so that's why i'm hesitating on this point.

Feel free to comment on this post, i'm curious what others think about this. It can help in the evaluation.

Michael L · Post by **Michael L** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:46 am

As one mac user, i vote that you focus your limited time on the long list of FRs & improving MuLab & Mux, rather than coding Mux4Mac. This DAW is quite unique & every little improvement makes a difference in workflow & inspirability & ease of use (eg I find MuLab to be the most stable plugin host) so please continue to 'push the envelope!'

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 5:14 pm

for some reason im not able to post without it triggering some spam alert

mutools · Post by **mutools** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 6:22 pm

Here on the forum?

paradiddle · Post by **paradiddle** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:04 pm

Kind of reminds me of IOS also with stuff not working in version 8 anymore. Totally understand why you would hesitate. The author of audiomulch also said the same thing in relation to continuing development for macs also. It's a shame, I also wanted to get a macbook but not so sure anymore.

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:53 pm

is this apples attempt at keeping the playing field for themselves?

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:09 pm

how do other plugin companies make money at mac software? are they all running around in circles?

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:11 pm

mutools wrote:Here on the forum?

i have no idea because i just posted what i tried to before.

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sat Mar 07, 2015 11:14 pm

oh also, does mulab for mac take you on a goose chase? arent the technologies (mux and mulab) related? IE whats good for one development is good for both? wouldnt that reduce r&d time? i assume its that way on windoz too.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Sun Mar 08, 2015 5:35 pm

mutools wrote:Ok an update on the MUX for Mac challenge:

Some time ago i said MUX for Mac is a top priority for MuTools. So i've done the basic research for it. Conclusion was that i can't R&D MUX for Mac with my current Mac setup, i need to invest in a new Mac etc, quite an investment. I could go for that as i'm confident it will pay itself back. BUT:

But unfortunately Apple proves that OSX is a volatile platform that regularly breaks compatibilities with previous OSX versions. An astonishing example of that, even unrelated to MuTools, is that a Roland SH 201 cannot be used anymore on OSX yosemite because the driver is broken and even a big company like Roland understandably abandons having to update drivers all the time. See http://roland.com/support/article/?q=in ... d=63061613 and see http://forums.rolandclan.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=49240
I only have one word for that: Crazy! This is about a standard synth and it's about a standard feature i.e. playing MIDI via USB, no more, no less. The reality that you cannot simple plug & play a SH 201 on Yosemite anymore is crazy and very user unfriendly imho. And there are many other examples of such OSX version incompatibilities.

I would love to go for MUX for Mac and even do the necessary investments in Apple hardware, software and add-ons and R&D time, but now i'm hesitating because if i do all these investments but the resulting MUX for Mac becomes incompatible due to new OSX version incompatibilities a few months later, then i've done a lot of investments for too little return. And having to chase all OSX incompatibilities all the time like an Apple slave is not really my ambition in life.

Conclusion: I'm still evaluating the decission to do all these hardware, software and R&D investments. Wish the answer was a lot more simple, resulting in a GO, really i would love to have MUX on Mac. But i have to take reality into account and so that's why i'm hesitating on this point.

Feel free to comment on this post, i'm curious what others think about this. It can help in the evaluation.

I think you're going over the top a bit, I'm still able to use NI Kore 2, which NI discontinued several years ago, on my Mac, and apparently it still works fine under Yosemite (which I have not upgraded to yet). Yes Apple do stupid things on occasion to compatibility but more things that affect drivers (like Roland) than apps. Plus you already have MuLab on Mac, if you can keep that uptodate with Mac OS changes then you can do the same with Mux too. Without it you might as well abandon Mac development altogether, many Mac users like myself were waiting for a Mac Mux because it would mean things developed in Mux inside MuLab could then be shared in other DAWs too using Mux.

I really don't see why you would need a new Mac to develop Mux when you are developing Mac MuLab, which contains Mux, already on what you have either.

pljones · Post by **pljones** » Sun Mar 08, 2015 5:43 pm

Mulab is standalone, MuX runs inside other hosts. That's definitely an extra layer of complexity added, not a simplification. Though, I guess Jo could say MuX on Mac was only supported if run inside MuLab..?

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Sun Mar 08, 2015 7:15 pm

i value mux over mulab. mux on mac would be more valuable to my workflow than mulab on windoz or mac.

solipsvs · Post by **solipsvs** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:50 pm

not sure if you were ready to hear that. i suspect that you dont care much about numbers, and would prefer to code for your friends here. there sure are many who chime in with what you seem to want to hear. i call those echoes. how has that been working for you so far? seems like a valid reason for why it wouldnt seem worth the apparent extra effort... i mean, if youre not doing numbers, then might as well code for your buddies lol. i hope thats worth your time.

mutools · Post by **mutools** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 3:16 pm

If i ask a question, i'm listening to all answers, otherwise i would not ask the question. I've not yet taken any decission in any direction wrt MUX for Mac, i'm reading the answers and thinking about it. Why did you post what you just posted?

MUTOOLS

KVR Audio

mux for mac please?