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How to change instument in middle of MIDI part in Cubase

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?

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KVRer
 
28 posts since 22 Jan, 2013

Postby dizbmm; Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:46 am How to change instument in middle of MIDI part in Cubase

Hi
I want to experiment with switching to different instruments while playing a certain midi part. I cant find the way to achieve this in Cubase. Basically what I'm looking for is some kind of automation that can change the VSTi that currently plays.
Help anyone?
Thanks.
KVRAF
 
1537 posts since 19 Apr, 2003, from Copenhagen, Denmark
 

Postby olepro; Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:05 am

Make two tracks... unless you want to mimic a multi instrumantalist playing two instruments at the same time... :)
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KVRer
 
28 posts since 22 Jan, 2013

Postby dizbmm; Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:08 am

olepro wrote:Make two tracks... unless you want to mimic a multi instrumantalist playing two instruments at the same time... :)


I'm not talking about merely two instruments, but many instruments. I want to achieve a kind of glitchy/IDM sound by switching between multiple instruments in the middle of a midi part.
KVRAF
 
6223 posts since 6 Sep, 2008
 

Postby Mushy Mushy; Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:14 am

dizbmm wrote:
olepro wrote:Make two tracks... unless you want to mimic a multi instrumantalist playing two instruments at the same time... :)


I'm not talking about merely two instruments, but many instruments. I want to achieve a kind of glitchy/IDM sound by switching between multiple instruments in the middle of a midi part.
Record as audio
Dump both into a sampler on two separate keys.
Randomise with a MIDI note selector or the samplers own LFO.

It's a shame you don't use Live. There's sooooo many ways to do it in that program.
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"Oooh I dont know. Sounds a bit scary"
"It's not scary. You just lose a sense of who you are and all that sh!t"
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KVRAF
 
10129 posts since 18 Jun, 2008, from Melbourne, Australia
 

Postby ZenPunkHippy; Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:27 am

Assign multiple synths to different tracks, each with a unique MIDI channel. You will need to set up a MIDI transformer effect on each track to delete all notes that do not match the desired channel for the track.

During your performance, switch MIDI channels to change synth.

Peace,
Andy.
KVRist
 
475 posts since 18 Mar, 2008, from germany
 

Postby enroe; Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:13 pm

dizbmm wrote:Hi
I want to experiment with switching to different instruments while playing a certain midi part. I cant find the way to achieve this in Cubase. Basically what I'm looking for is some kind of automation that can change the VSTi that currently plays.
Help anyone?
Thanks.


Very simple: Insert a program-change-event at the beginning of the new midi-part.

Additionally you have to enable the track so that it "receives" program-change-events.
free mp3s + info: andy-enroe.de songs and weird stuff: enroe.de
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KVRAF
 
10129 posts since 18 Jun, 2008, from Melbourne, Australia
 

Postby ZenPunkHippy; Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:57 am

Another way to do this would be to use a MIDI FX note splitter to send different octave ranges to synths on separate tracks. Assuming a 4 octave keyboard, you can now play 4 synths (transposed appropriately) using a different section of the keyboard.

Peace,
Andy.
KVRer
 
28 posts since 22 Jan, 2013

Postby dizbmm; Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:07 am

enroe wrote:
dizbmm wrote:Hi
I want to experiment with switching to different instruments while playing a certain midi part. I cant find the way to achieve this in Cubase. Basically what I'm looking for is some kind of automation that can change the VSTi that currently plays.
Help anyone?
Thanks.


Very simple: Insert a program-change-event at the beginning of the new midi-part.

Additionally you have to enable the track so that it "receives" program-change-events.


I think that program change is the way to go here. But I'm not sure how to use it. Could you give me a hint on how to use it? I see "Program change" in automation of the midi part (cubase 5), but it doesn't seem to change anything. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place?

Plus, can it switch between instruments? Or just between different presets of same instrument?
Thanks!
KVRist
 
475 posts since 18 Mar, 2008, from germany
 

Postby enroe; Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:18 pm

dizbmm wrote:
I think that program change is the way to go here. But I'm not sure how to use it. Could you give me a hint on how to use it? I see "Program change" in automation of the midi part (cubase 5), but it doesn't seem to change anything. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place?

Plus, can it switch between instruments? Or just between different presets of same instrument?
Thanks!


Hi,

First: Program-changes do change presets of (multitimbral) instruments. Usually every preset of a slot of a sampler (Kontakt, Halion, Shortcut etc.) is an "instrument"! Thus by activating a program-change-event you change the preset - and with that you also change the instrument.

That of course means: The assignment of your VSTi to a track is fix. You can't change that while a song is running by a program-change or any automation. You can only change presets of course (and in sample-language a preset is an instrument - yeah, it's the definition of the term).

Insert program-changes: Open the list-editor of a midi-part, go into "edit-mode" and choose "program-change" - that easy. :)
free mp3s + info: andy-enroe.de songs and weird stuff: enroe.de
KVRer
 
28 posts since 22 Jan, 2013

Postby dizbmm; Sun Jan 27, 2013 7:07 pm

enroe wrote:
Hi,

First: Program-changes do change presets of (multitimbral) instruments. Usually every preset of a slot of a sampler (Kontakt, Halion, Shortcut etc.) is an "instrument"! Thus by activating a program-change-event you change the preset - and with that you also change the instrument.

That of course means: The assignment of your VSTi to a track is fix. You can't change that while a song is running by a program-change or any automation. You can only change presets of course (and in sample-language a preset is an instrument - yeah, it's the definition of the term).

Insert program-changes: Open the list-editor of a midi-part, go into "edit-mode" and choose "program-change" - that easy. :)


Thanks for your answer enroe

It doesn't seem possible in Halion or Kontakt, but it does seem to work for some random synths.

Not sure what's the consistency here... Anyone knows why it works for some VSTi and doesn't work for others?
KVRer
 
15 posts since 14 May, 2013, from Utrecht, Nederland

Postby jantjie; Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:32 pm Re: How to change instument in middle of MIDI part in Cubase

Hi,

See (also) this post: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5357921

Regards,
Jan
Last edited by jantjie on Mon Jan 27, 2014 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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KVRist
 
292 posts since 4 Oct, 2009, from Portland, OR

Postby UltimateOutsider; Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:48 pm Re:

dizbmm wrote:It doesn't seem possible in Halion or Kontakt, but it does seem to work for some random synths.

Not sure what's the consistency here... Anyone knows why it works for some VSTi and doesn't work for others?

Program Change has to be explicitly supported by the target instrument in order for it to work. Also, some synths have different requirements (some break their presets into 'banks', so you have to specify both a bank and a preset number).

Say you've got a hardware synth that can store a maximum of 256 patches, broken up into two banks. (A common setup in the 80s.) Addressing patches via MIDI is super easy.

But then look at a modern soft synth, that doesn't have any concept of a finite patch bank at all, but rather a tagged database of hundreds, or even thousands of presets. As a result, some softynths don't respond to program changes at all, while others might have a "favorites" concept where you can assign specific presets to virtual slots that will correspond to a standard MIDI program change. So, it really depends on the synth... modern hardware synths have varying levels of program change support as well.

But in your initial post you ask this:
dizbmm wrote: Basically what I'm looking for is some kind of automation that can change the VSTi that currently plays.

Are you really looking for a way to change the entire plugin that you're playing? (In which case you might be able to automate plugin disable/enable or maybe even channel change) Or is changing programs within a single plugin sufficient?

Also, don't overlook synths like FM8 and Alchemy where you can have multiple patches or sound sources loaded and morph between them in real time.
KVRist
 
236 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from Phuket Thailand
 

Postby soundmagus; Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:30 pm Re: How to change instument in middle of MIDI part in Cubase

Use a program change message.

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