My 'rule' for iLok (and now Peavey also) is simple.
Never trust a company that doesn't trust you.
Does knowing it's 'NFR' keep you from buying?
-
- KVRAF
- 16977 posts since 23 Jun, 2010 from north of London ON
Definitely this.koalaboy wrote:^^^^^ Exactly this. I buy things that I intend to keep.bluedad wrote:No, it doesn't bother me because I practically never sell anything.
Barry
If a billion people believe a stupid thing it is still a stupid thing
If a billion people believe a stupid thing it is still a stupid thing
-
- KVRAF
- 25053 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
It's never occurred to me. I have one or two regrets, and sold things, but it isn't how I approach this, I believe I'm going to stick with the thing.
-
- KVRian
- 835 posts since 28 Apr, 2014 from Texas
Never trust a company that doesn't trust you AND has a track record of screw ups with customer data without a backup in place eitherBBFG# wrote:My 'rule' for iLok (and now Peavey also) is simple.
Never trust a company that doesn't trust you.
SW: Cubase 9.5 | Komplete 11 | Omnisphere 2 | Perfect Storm 2.5 | Soundtoys 5
HW: Steinberg UR28M | Focal Alpha 50 | Fender Jazz Bass | Alesis VI25
HW: Steinberg UR28M | Focal Alpha 50 | Fender Jazz Bass | Alesis VI25
-
- KVRian
- 616 posts since 8 May, 2012 from Sydney, Australia
I buy things I intend to keep too, but it doesn't always work out that way, especially with samples libraries. Generally, these can't be demoed and many offer very limited walkthroughs, so you're often buying pretty much blind. So I do look at whether something is NFR.
-
- KVRAF
- 13224 posts since 16 Feb, 2005 from Kingston, Jamaica
Not in the least bit. I have never sold any software i have bought and with one exception, had any desire to do so.
I started my professional career in hardware-only days and software is so ridiculously cheap i feel almost like i am insulting the developer by selling it. And i have quite a few software that i no longer used or never really used.
Rsp
I started my professional career in hardware-only days and software is so ridiculously cheap i feel almost like i am insulting the developer by selling it. And i have quite a few software that i no longer used or never really used.
Rsp
sound sculptist
-
- KVRAF
- 3071 posts since 29 Sep, 2005
While that may well be true, in a divorce settlement she will still want her part of part of it, so NFR or not you have to determine the priceBBFG# wrote:Just had a thought to the 'plus' side of NFR...
If you go bankrupt or have your property 'seized', it can't be part of the disposable assets?
Guess you could always split it in two (and give her the negative end of the plug)
Happy Musiking!
dsan
My DAW System:
W7, i5, x64, 8Gb Ram, Edirol FA-101
W7, i5, x64, 8Gb Ram, Edirol FA-101
-
- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7795 posts since 28 Apr, 2013
I think it would have to be claimed as an asset then.dsan@mail.com wrote:While that may well be true, in a divorce settlement she will still want her part of part of it, so NFR or not you have to determine the priceBBFG# wrote:Just had a thought to the 'plus' side of NFR...
If you go bankrupt or have your property 'seized', it can't be part of the disposable assets?
Guess you could always split it in two (and give her the negative end of the plug)
Happy Musiking!
dsan
And If it's NFR, most of us have issues in making that claim.
-
- KVRAF
- 1972 posts since 14 Mar, 2006
I've never tried to sell any music software so I dunno if it matters for me, but then again, maybe I should sell some stuff? Nah, most software I get is either still very useable or outdated to the point of not being resellable, so I think; figure out if you really want it or need it before you buy it.
Therein lies the rub though, can you adequately test something out before purchasing it? In some cases no way.
But generally I don't like software companies using NFR policies and I am opposed to them. Why shouldn't we be able to resell something we bought, used for a while and it doesn't suit our purposes anymore? If the software is cheap enough to be disposable, then ok. For more expensive items, I think its bad policy to have NFR. in the case of lifetime updates, its acceptable I guess in certain situations where something will in fact be updated a lot. A lot of the stuff out there is not actually updated all that much. DAW's, for example, are updated a lot, so NFR on Reaper with lifetime updates, I think is a very reasonable arrangement for both parties. On the other hand, a certain synth plugin comes out, does a bunch of cool stuff and is sold NFR with lifetime updates, but never really sees updates other than bug fixes...rather the maker may release a new synth later or something. So the promise of updates for life on that one are overrated, and the restriction of not being able to resell it if it turns out to not be useful, is not a fair trade.
I recently bought Harmor. its NFR and lifetime updates. Will Harmor be upgraded in the future? I doubt it. But in that case I was reasonably sure in advance that I never plan to part with Harmor, its an awesome synth with a huge amount of potential to be used in too many creative ways to ever get rid of it, and its also 50% off (until tomorrow by the way). So fine, I'll accept the NFR and enjoy the synth.
On the subject of iLok and dongles in general, that's a whole nother discussion, but I have hated every dongle I had to use, often times I end up not using those products because of the hassle it turned out to be. I avoid dongles like the plague now. Opinions differ. Some people have gotten burned by auth schemes that left them inoperable until they could get help from the manufacturer or something. Those are rare instances.
Therein lies the rub though, can you adequately test something out before purchasing it? In some cases no way.
But generally I don't like software companies using NFR policies and I am opposed to them. Why shouldn't we be able to resell something we bought, used for a while and it doesn't suit our purposes anymore? If the software is cheap enough to be disposable, then ok. For more expensive items, I think its bad policy to have NFR. in the case of lifetime updates, its acceptable I guess in certain situations where something will in fact be updated a lot. A lot of the stuff out there is not actually updated all that much. DAW's, for example, are updated a lot, so NFR on Reaper with lifetime updates, I think is a very reasonable arrangement for both parties. On the other hand, a certain synth plugin comes out, does a bunch of cool stuff and is sold NFR with lifetime updates, but never really sees updates other than bug fixes...rather the maker may release a new synth later or something. So the promise of updates for life on that one are overrated, and the restriction of not being able to resell it if it turns out to not be useful, is not a fair trade.
I recently bought Harmor. its NFR and lifetime updates. Will Harmor be upgraded in the future? I doubt it. But in that case I was reasonably sure in advance that I never plan to part with Harmor, its an awesome synth with a huge amount of potential to be used in too many creative ways to ever get rid of it, and its also 50% off (until tomorrow by the way). So fine, I'll accept the NFR and enjoy the synth.
On the subject of iLok and dongles in general, that's a whole nother discussion, but I have hated every dongle I had to use, often times I end up not using those products because of the hassle it turned out to be. I avoid dongles like the plague now. Opinions differ. Some people have gotten burned by auth schemes that left them inoperable until they could get help from the manufacturer or something. Those are rare instances.
MacPro 5,1 12core x 3.46ghz-96gb MacOS 12.2 (opencore), X32+AES16e-50
-
- KVRist
- 86 posts since 7 Jul, 2012
BBFG# wrote:My 'rule' for iLok (and now Peavey also) is simple.
Never trust a company that doesn't trust you.
EXACTLY, i made a huge mistake once with EAST WEST - never again
anything that is ILOK/USB Protected and / or NFR reeks of shady business practice to me (and it doesn't get any shadier than EAST WEST)
the guys from u-he have been able to protect their synths better than most devs and in a way their paying customers never even notice, and no shady NFR rule (which is illegal in some countries) seeing how they are still around only proves that if your work is amazing people will buy it
-
- Banned
- 22457 posts since 5 Sep, 2001
BBFG# wrote:Does knowing it's 'NFR' keep you from buying?
Whether new or used, once you know you'll have it forever make you question if you want a lifetime relationship with it?
100% yes except for RE's, the only exception.
So 99% yes.
