KVR Audio

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:23 am

I think Guenon is right. You still have a problem (OP). I have just downloaded and tested my system which I'll write down the spec, so you compare with yours (it is a similar build). Here is the snapshot of the LatencyMon of my PC:

LatencyMon.jpg

My PC:
650w PSU - Ryzen 5 1600x - Asus B350 Plus - 16GB (2x8) Kingston Fury 2400 DDR4 - GTX 1060 3GB - SSD 500GB - Win 10 64 with Presonus iTwo interface (256 buffer / 44.1 Khz)

Result:
Crystal clean sound in Cubase with no crackles or any other noise (if not clipping of course!).

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:16 pm

EvilDragon wrote:The main audio thread will always run at one core only. Once that one trips over, it doesn't matter how many cores you have, you will get dropouts. This happens in any DAW, sooner or later.

Also, Live's CPU meter doesn't work like Task Manager's, it measures time to process a single audio buffer, rather than actual CPU usage.

This. I posted this on gearslutz many months ago and it affects virtually all Audio/MIDI apps to some degree. Keep in mind that the Track, AUX Sends (Returns,) and the 2-Bus all are in the Signal Path and thus represent Serial Processing when Record-Armed -- or even in Playback if the Track is selected in some apps:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/showpos ... tcount=170

"Further to my previous comment, it would appear the Single Core Issue is not isolated to just certain DAWs, but has to do with the overall process itself (even today):

https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view ... ce#p507148

Peter Kaine speaks to S1's handling:

"Check your project now.
I reckon you might see 1 single core running at 100% and the rest running at 20%.

Channels are allocated to a thread each, as the system can't split channels over threads.

So if you have one really complex channel that has some heavy duty plugsin on it, it's possible to overload one core, that can cause the rest to fall over too."

The same can even go for Reaper, though it has a proprietary "Lookahead" feature & I'm not sure what effect it has on latency, if any:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=190244
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=194872

"Originally Posted by Distressor
Q: What is Afxp for anyway?

A: It's a look ahead kind of thing. Proprietary to Reaper. Not a straight ahead buffer but a pre-processing thing for subsets of stuff you have dialed up on the mixing board."

"Maybe their issue with AfxP is related to the PDC error?
AfxP crashes in Reaper are a little bit cagey. You can run suspect plugins in small/medium projects and never know the difference. Dial up a 300 track project with just as many plugins and automation, etc etc and these faux pas start to appear. The telltale is when you get clicks and pops but are not maxing out your CPU (even a single core). That means AfxP is struggling with a plugin."

[Xenakios] "Single thread floating point performance is the key for audio applications in order to get a satisfactory experience. Multiple CPU cores don't hurt, but broadly speaking they are not as useful for audio as they can be for example for video. (Due to the nature of audio processing where things often have to happen serially and not in parallel.)"

Bottom Line: Clock Speed can be even more important than the number of Cores in some cases.

zoogoo · Post by **zoogoo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:01 am

EnGee wrote:I think Guenon is right. You still have a problem (OP). I have just downloaded and tested my system which I'll write down the spec, so you compare with yours (it is a similar build). Here is the snapshot of the LatencyMon of my PC:

LatencyMon.jpg
My PC:
650w PSU - Ryzen 5 1600x - Asus B350 Plus - 16GB (2x8) Kingston Fury 2400 DDR4 - GTX 1060 3GB - SSD 500GB - Win 10 64 with Presonus iTwo interface (256 buffer / 44.1 Khz)

Result:
Crystal clean sound in Cubase with no crackles or any other noise (if not clipping of course!).

OK, yeah so from what i read i have an issue still that needs resolving, and honestly after troubleshooting for awhile, i do still occasionally get that popping sound. Not nearly as bad as before.

I really need to consider how to best optimize my system. Im sure my old sound cards have something to do with it. But i am not really left with too many options to choose from. All the PCI cards look so cheap. The m-audio 1010lt offers a lot of music capabilities with no latency. I mean there are just tons of these USB interfaces and from what i understand have latency issues. Im sure there are some that utilize the USB 3.0 which might be something to research more, yet how can you beat a hardwired PCI.

Ive kind of hit a brick wall with troubleshooting. i have read and heard others mentioning BIOS configurations, but have yet to receive ideas or related threads that i could try out.

Yes im not the most technically inclined, which makes it all the more frustrating.

t3toooo · Post by **t3toooo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:09 am

Windows 10 is balancing the cores way better than 7.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:30 am

zoogoo wrote:
EnGee wrote:I think Guenon is right. You still have a problem (OP). I have just downloaded and tested my system which I'll write down the spec, so you compare with yours (it is a similar build). Here is the snapshot of the LatencyMon of my PC:

LatencyMon.jpg
My PC:
650w PSU - Ryzen 5 1600x - Asus B350 Plus - 16GB (2x8) Kingston Fury 2400 DDR4 - GTX 1060 3GB - SSD 500GB - Win 10 64 with Presonus iTwo interface (256 buffer / 44.1 Khz)

Result:
Crystal clean sound in Cubase with no crackles or any other noise (if not clipping of course!).
OK, yeah so from what i read i have an issue still that needs resolving, and honestly after troubleshooting for awhile, i do still occasionally get that popping sound. Not nearly as bad as before.

I really need to consider how to best optimize my system. Im sure my old sound cards have something to do with it. But i am not really left with too many options to choose from. All the PCI cards look so cheap. The m-audio 1010lt offers a lot of music capabilities with no latency. I mean there are just tons of these USB interfaces and from what i understand have latency issues. Im sure there are some that utilize the USB 3.0 which might be something to research more, yet how can you beat a hardwired PCI.

Ive kind of hit a brick wall with troubleshooting. i have read and heard others mentioning BIOS configurations, but have yet to receive ideas or related threads that i could try out.

Yes im not the most technically inclined, which makes it all the more frustrating.

I'm not sure it's the sound card! So that I asked about Asio4All that works with the internal sound card comes with the motherboard. Just test to see if there is still noise with it.

I still suspect the wireless adapter or the network. How do you connect to the internet?

Also, did you update the drivers yet? There is a utility CD comes with the motherboard.

zoogoo · Post by **zoogoo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:31 am

t3toooo wrote:Windows 10 is balancing the cores way better than 7.

how can you be sure?

did you run same exact test on separate operating systems with same specs?

zoogoo · Post by **zoogoo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:34 am

ok, so i took some screen shots of the progress here. it looks like its sorta of spreading it on just like half of the cores. which still seems better,

i ran a dpc latency tester, looks a little high but no spikes. same problem in latencymon, it basicly is saying the m-audio driver is spiking high levels on dpc, Maybe the driver itself is just garbage. I ran ASIO but that just utilizes the m-audio driver, so didnt help or change at all.

t3toooo · Post by **t3toooo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:04 pm

zoogoo wrote:
t3toooo wrote:Windows 10 is balancing the cores way better than 7.
how can you be sure?

did you run same exact test on separate operating systems with same specs?

Yes i did.
I would not bother to tweak Windows 7 for now.Download the 1709 64 bit Windows 10 ISO from Microsoft and install it on a separate hard drive (can be an old one for testing because this isn't affecting the cores much) skip the serial. You can use Windows 10 for 3 days,i believe.Install all drivers and get the latest updates online.
Before that, create a test protect using just a couple of plugins on Windows 7 (but many instances of them).This way you don't need to install too much on 10.Then compare.
In Bios and in Windows 10 leave everything by default,if not automatically,manually switch the power plan to "high performance" (when you run the project).Luckily,Windows 10 is way faster to install than 7,that's one reason i would not go back to 7 anyway.

t3toooo · Post by **t3toooo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:15 pm

Regarding the M-Audio Delta 1010LT PCI,i've read that some people run them successfully on 10 since there is a working Windows 7 driver available it should work.

Guenon · Post by **Guenon** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:48 pm

t3toooo wrote:Before that, create a test protect using just a couple of plugins on Windows 7 (but many instances of them).This way you don't need to install too much on 10.Then compare.

Hey, which DAW did you use? Can you share the test project and instance counts that you ran successfully?

t3toooo · Post by **t3toooo** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:29 pm

I went to 10 in 2015 so i don't have any reference project.
Installing Windows 10 is a breeze,just download the Media Creation Tool from Microsoft and create a USB Stick for installation.

Guenon · Post by **Guenon** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:43 pm

Not in the need of Win 10 myself

, but yeah, thanks. Was more interested in actual test specifics / project files.

zoogoo · Post by **zoogoo** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:11 am

as i explained earlyer, its not a driver or OS. i used a differend SSD with it and had same problem.

i took everything aprt and returned to newegg, BTW they suck. %15 restock fee and i cant return the RYZEN 5

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:30 am

Sorry to hear that! What’s your plan then?

zoogoo · Post by **zoogoo** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:38 am

EnGee wrote:Sorry to hear that! What’s your plan then?

i think i just took apart a perfectly good computer.

having same issues on old computer.

I am not sure its ether jbridger which lets you use 32 bit programs in live 9. or its just live 9 itself.

seems to be less clippy in live 7 but still sounds bad.

idk anymore, about to quit making music

why does Ableton only using one thread core? CPU overloading.