KVR Audio

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Sat Sep 05, 2015 7:01 pm

Jace-BeOS wrote:Software SHOULD be devalued. Since there's no ultimate accountability to the buyer for the endless beta quality (or worse).

Like hardware is better? Have a look at the PolyMoog will you

sin night · Post by **sin night** » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:16 am

Software is mostly rather cheap because the development cost is spread across multiple customers and because you don't really pay for serious warranties (many EULAs have some "limited liability" conditions), so it's really up to the skills of the developer and the things he has to relate with (libraries, hardware, other vendors product, strange niche user requirements...).

If you want a better level of warranty, you'll have to buy more expansive products or even get some custom development. Then you can likely negotiate the terms, but it will be expensive.

About beta quality: if that'a related to changes of the environment (for example, a new operatonng system), then problems are unavoidable. If the software is a bugfest regardless of the environment, then it says something about the developer skills/priorities.

Of course this is strictly IMHO and assuming the softare requirements are good (they are not always so).

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:24 am

Numanoid wrote:
Jace-BeOS wrote:Software SHOULD be devalued. Since there's no ultimate accountability to the buyer for the endless beta quality (or worse).
Like hardware is better? Have a look at the PolyMoog will you

Don't remind me.

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 4:34 am

Dedicated Apple haters crack me up. I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but you really don't hear Apple users here in this forum going on 'Angry Hate' tangents about Dell, HP or complaining about windows...It's probably because we just don't care...we're happy and that's really what it comes down to. In my opinion, when your happy with your choice of software and hardware, be it Windows machines or Macs, you just don't spend your energy talking about the competition...that is, if your truly satisfied with what your using. Just let that point sink in for a moment....

As others have commented, I can say that I am (not) an Apple 'Hipster vegan'. I switched to Apple about a year ago and have never looked back and for good reason. I'm not a rich person so I had to sell off my photography equipment to get my iMac. Are Apple products expensive?...yes. However, I got what I payed for and that goes beyond just hardware. You get an entire environment including software, hardware, and unbeatable product warrantees and customer support but above all, I'm now enjoying a clean rock solid platform that just works for my needs...and works very well might I add. That leaves me with a nice relaxed peace of mind that I can then use for making music and also implement into my daily life. Apple never forced me to spend the cash and still doesn't. It was a choice. So no, their not evil people who use mind control...

The main difference between Apple, Dell, HP and other brands, is that Apple chooses to only sell a higher end line of products. You can buy pro $2,000 and $4,000+ HP and Dell laptops all day long and nobody complains about that, but that's because you can buy a cheaper $300 version, though performance and quality will take a big hit. Apple just refuses to compromise its build quality and components to please everyone. This is the big reason why Apple is able to maintain stable functional longevity in their product lines. Another good reason why their products hold 70 to 80+% of their original value for years.

Pro music and visual studios primarily use Apple products for a reason. After making my jump to buying a Mac, I now realize why it's the first choice in the pro end of the industry. It's an entire ecosystem that just works. Unfortunately, I just wasn't happy with the previous OS and hardware I was using. That doesn't mean I'm going to bash those products and their users...that would be pointless and silly. There would be no justified reason to do so...just use what works for you and what makes you happy.

By the way, Alchemy is a nice Free added update to logic along with 200+ fixes and performance improvements that came in the 10.2 update. That's pretty nice of them, especially coming from a company who is Very busy making everything from a software OS to a DAW to phones, computers, and now cars. But despite all these products, they treat each product area as if it was their only concern. That speaks volumes.

With all that said, if anyone is angry at my post because I'm an Apple user, or for anything I said, I will gladly pay for your first two therapy sessions

mutantdog · Post by **mutantdog** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 5:51 am

That's quite a long post for someone who "just doesn't care" and doesn't want to "spend your energy talking about the competition!"

The thing is Microsoft haven't bought out a popular cross-platform VST and bundled it exclusively into a Windows only app. There are plenty of Apple-based Live and Cubase users who are now also denied access to Alchemy 2.

I could complain all day about my shitty Dell laptop but its not really relevant to this forum. My studio desktop was built from components I selected myself as the best possible options within my budget. Around the same time my mate bought a considerably lower-spec second-hand Mac Pro for the same sort of money.

While there are many people on both sides who "just don't care" enough to get involved in online Mac/PC debates, there are also many others on both sides who will. It might not seem as balanced in this thread but consider the context.

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:11 am

mutantdog wrote:That's quite a long post for someone who "just doesn't care" and doesn't want to "spend your energy talking about the competition!"

You think I'm being contradictive in those statements? "I just don't care enough to be (angry) about anything". that's my point there. My second point is just as solid because I spent nearly all of my energy in my post talking about Apple (what I use), not bad mouthing the competition. Your trying to make me sound contradictive and it's not going to work.

As far as windows based software, there's (tons) of windows based developers who refuse to provide the same apps for OS X. Seems pretty familiar if you ask me...

Sampleconstruct · Post by **Sampleconstruct** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:19 am

Realx, it's not important really...

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:23 am

Sampleconstruct wrote:Realx, it's not important really...

Oh I'm fine, I find this fascinating

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:39 am

I find it so amazing how anyone can be mad at Apple for the purchase of Alchemy. How about turning that agrivation towards the 'previous owners' who sold it...Camel Audio. I hear no mention of that? I mean if there was any betrayal to the windows community, wouldn't that be by the actual seller? It's not like Apple came in at gunpoint and forced them to sell...and the Apple company owes no one anything. I understand the agrivation to a point because of users investments in alchemy 1.5...but the Apple Hatred thing is jus so cliché, unoriginal and downright cheesy. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that people make no mention of Camel Audio but just make Apple the bad guy in this.

Sampleconstruct · Post by **Sampleconstruct** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:46 am

But it's all been discussed to death, you're a bit late to the party.

werp · Post by **werp** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:49 am

I hate that, the chips are all soggy.

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:52 am

Sampleconstruct wrote:But it's all been discussed to death, you're a bit late to the party.

Lol, yes I suppose your right. I just put in my 2 cents. I do like alchemy, but if it makes anyone feel better, Apple did remove a lot of import options for 3rd party patches and things like that.

Anthony Newcomb · Post by **Anthony Newcomb** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:53 am

werp wrote:I hate that, the chips are all soggy.

Excellent change of subject, and yes...I agree

mutantdog · Post by **mutantdog** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 7:04 am

Anthony Newcomb wrote:I find it so amazing how anyone can be mad at Apple for the purchase of Alchemy. How about turning that agrivation towards the 'previous owners' who sold it...Camel Audio. I hear no mention of that? I mean if there was any betrayal to the windows community, wouldn't that be by the actual seller? It's not like Apple came in at gunpoint and forced them to sell...and the Apple company owes no one anything. I understand the agrivation to a point because of users investments in alchemy 1.5...but the Apple Hatred thing is jus so cliché, unoriginal and downright cheesy. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that people make no mention of Camel Audio but just make Apple the bad guy in this.

Relax dude, its all just a bit of fun really. Apple likely welcome the anger, for one thing it keeps people talking about them, secondly it helps to foster the defensive attitude that Apple want its users to have.

I've said before my stance about Camel, I can't be that pissed at them, they no doubt got offered a shitload of money. I admire those that refuse to sell-out but i can totally understand those that choose to.

Anyway, you say its only Windows users that get angry at the competition. Likewise I'd say it's only Apple users that feel a need to defend the honour of the overlord they have sworn loyal service to.

werp · Post by **werp** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 7:08 am

I have Mac and Microsoft. Doesn't stop the chips getting soggy though

Alchemy welcomes to Logic X Pro 10.2 and Mainstage 3 (Update 20.1.2016)