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Urs
u-he
 
21972 posts since 7 Aug, 2002, from Berlin

Postby Urs; Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:38 am Zebra goes CZ

Well, almost :shock:

Download

As has been posted elsewhere, the latest beta versions of Zebra have 2 new OscFX. One of these is called "PhaseDist" and it does pretty much what it says.

Download new Zebra (Mac + PC) from this thread.

Huh?

With PhaseDist the oscillator waveform acts as function of the phase of an inverse cosine waveform. Unfortunately all images I found on Google got it totally wrong. They always use sine waves (starting at a zero crossing) and that's plain crap. Even the example code on Wikipedia is wrong. Arrrgh

Nevermind. What I want to say is, Phase Distortion like in the old CZ synths is a little bit less trivial than is commonly known (mostly because of misinformation), as it's a bit abstract.

Example patches

Hence I have posted a few presets that explain the basic waveforms sawtooth, square, peak (aka impulse), double peak (aka double impulse), sawsquare (aka half sine):

http://www.u-he.com/Z2PhaseDist.zip

Additionally I'm using the existing "Ripples" OscFX to simulate the resonant waveforms of the CZs. It is however not as accurate as the other examples, and I found a little bug in Ripples that makes it a bit grainy unless one adds another OscFX :oops:

When you open the example patches, you always simply have a CZ-ish filter sweep. The sweep is always done by modulating the oscillator waveform in GeoMorph mode. Check out the Osc1 tab to see what happens.

closing the filter, sort of

In the end, the "closed filter" (or "DCW" as Casio called it) is always an upwards sawtooth waveform, resulting in a sine wave. The sawtooth basically "plays" one full cycle of the sine (ahem, cosine) waveform. To add harmonics, some points within the sawtooth move around, effectively slowing down some parts of the sine while accelerating others within the cycle. That's Phase Distortion.

You can however create different effects, the possibilities are endless. For instance, instead of morphing from saw up to anything else you can also of course modulate the OscFX depth, which simply blends the waveform with an upramping saw. That's often less spectacular, but who knows... 8)

And of course, check out the resonant example. It's done by using the waveform as an envelope (or window) for multiple cycles of a sinewave. the higher the OscFX setting, the more cylcles of sonewave are stuffed into the thing. If beginning and end of the waveform/window are in the zerocrossing (middle), then the waveform is continuous and sounds quite smooth. I might add a "Ripples II" OscFX which uses - you get it - cosine waveforms instead of sines, and which uses the whole range of the waveform (positive + negative part) as the window area. Then we can do pretty perfect CZ stuff, without any audible aliasing.

Note though that this comes at a cost. A Osc Resolution of 8.00 is mandatory for smooth effects!

Enjoy,

;) Urs
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Urs
u-he
 
21972 posts since 7 Aug, 2002, from Berlin

Postby Urs; Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:54 am

Oh yes, you can of course combine waveforms - just start with two sawtooths.

The double impulse waveform is interesting as it's basically two cycles of cosine waves, with one squeezed into the corner by the other.

It's unfortunately not possible to combine a non-resonant waveform with a resonant though... but maybe someone figures out how to do resonantish waveforms without the Ripples effect... I guess one needs two oscillators for that though...
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Bronto Scorpio
KVRAF
 
5563 posts since 13 Feb, 2006, from Wiesmoor, Germany

Postby Bronto Scorpio; Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:54 am

I don' like these posts where smileys are all over the place but........
:o :o :-o :-o 8) :hail: :hail: :wheee: :wheee: :hail: :hail: 8) :-o :-o :o :o

Very great news! I'll try it immediatelly!
Thanks for your hard work Urs!

Cheers
Dennis
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Bronto Scorpio
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5563 posts since 13 Feb, 2006, from Wiesmoor, Germany

Postby Bronto Scorpio; Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:39 am

A quick test patch: http://bit.ly/NewOscFX I love it!

Do yourself a favor and use the modwheel with this one :hihi:

Cheers
Dennis
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Krakatau
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5431 posts since 24 May, 2002, from Bobo-dioulasso\BF__Geneva/CH

Postby Krakatau; Mon Oct 18, 2010 12:23 pm

@Urs

:clap: :tu: :clap:

@Bronto Scorpio

I for one, excuse your poor english

:hihi:

(using mine, that is likely even poorer)

:oops:
Musical Gym
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4883 posts since 23 May, 2004, from square1

Postby Musical Gym; Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:40 pm

64 bit only, right?
hersoot
KVRist
 
448 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Postby hersoot; Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:55 pm

Musical Gym wrote:64 bit only, right?


I know the Windows installer contained both 32 and 64.
Musical Gym
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4883 posts since 23 May, 2004, from square1

Postby Musical Gym; Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:02 pm

hersoot wrote:
Musical Gym wrote:64 bit only, right?


I know the Windows installer contained both 32 and 64.


Thanks for info. I thought the referenced thread was for 64 only.
paradiddle
KVRian
 
1431 posts since 14 Aug, 2001, from montreal, canada

Postby paradiddle; Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:26 pm

Perfect Urs!
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Urs
u-he
 
21972 posts since 7 Aug, 2002, from Berlin

Postby Urs; Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:07 pm

hersoot wrote:
Musical Gym wrote:64 bit only, right?


I know the Windows installer contained both 32 and 64.

Yup, and Mac version contains both 32 and 64 bit AU in a single component. VST to come later...
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Sendy
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5231 posts since 20 Jul, 2010

Postby Sendy; Mon Oct 18, 2010 4:06 pm

Finally, a synth that lets you actually *experiment* with PD techniques instead of simply 'using' them as implimented by Casio in the days of yore :)

This, along with the wrap/foldback thing, is a really exciting update for Zebra 2! I just can't begin to imagine what's possible combining all this stuff...
AL321
KVRist
 
296 posts since 9 Feb, 2009

Postby AL321; Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:16 pm

Sendy wrote:Finally, a synth that lets you actually *experiment* with PD techniques instead of simply 'using' them as implimented by Casio in the days of yore :)

This, along with the wrap/foldback thing, is a really exciting update for Zebra 2! I just can't begin to imagine what's possible combining all this stuff...


This may sound like a silly question to someone with your knowledge, but do the osc fx give us anything that we can't already do with Zebra's wave morphing? I mean, i thought the fx were just a quicker way of morphing the wave shape, but is there actually more going on than that?
Don't get me wrong, i really like the osc fx, especially the liquidy sound that scatter gives square wave basses, and wouldn't want to try and replicate that with morphing, but when you say we now have phase distortion, does that mean i'm underestimating the osc fx, and they are doing more than wave morphing?

I got to be honest though, as much as i like Zebra, i'm a bit disappointed if the update amounts to nothing more than 2 osc fx.
Especially after all the talk about osc wave node snap, and module preset saving.
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pdxindy
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13210 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds

Postby pdxindy; Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:34 pm

AL321 wrote:
Sendy wrote:Finally, a synth that lets you actually *experiment* with PD techniques instead of simply 'using' them as implimented by Casio in the days of yore :)

This, along with the wrap/foldback thing, is a really exciting update for Zebra 2! I just can't begin to imagine what's possible combining all this stuff...


This may sound like a silly question to someone with your knowledge, but do the osc fx give us anything that we can't already do with Zebra's wave morphing? I mean, i thought the fx were just a quicker way of morphing the wave shape, but is there actually more going on than that?
Don't get me wrong, i really like the osc fx, especially the liquidy sound that scatter gives square wave basses, and wouldn't want to try and replicate that with morphing, but when you say we now have phase distortion, does that mean i'm underestimating the osc fx, and they are doing more than wave morphing?


I don't really know how it all works so cannot answer your question... but in practice the oscFX give more than morphing wavesets cause I would not know how to do that stuff even if it were possible nor would I want to spend the time on it. But on top of that they give more cause you have 2 oscFX which used together certainly cannot be matched just by wave morphing...

and then you can modulate oscFX while you modulate the waveform as well!! :shock:
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pdxindy
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13210 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds

Postby pdxindy; Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:37 pm

AL321 wrote:I got to be honest though, as much as i like Zebra, i'm a bit disappointed if the update amounts to nothing more than 2 osc fx.
Especially after all the talk about osc wave node snap, and module preset saving.


IIRC there has been no talk of any additional features at all for this update... just the 64-bit versions of U-he software. Some cool new oscFX is a bonus, and you never know what else might appear but I would not expect it so soon.
AL321
KVRist
 
296 posts since 9 Feb, 2009

Postby AL321; Mon Oct 18, 2010 8:01 pm

pdxindy wrote:I don't really know how it all works so cannot answer your question... but in practice the oscFX give more than morphing wavesets cause I would not know how to do that stuff even if it were possible nor would I want to spend the time on it. But on top of that they give more cause you have 2 oscFX which used together certainly cannot be matched just by wave morphing...

and then you can modulate oscFX while you modulate the waveform as well!! :shock:


Yeah, i know what you're saying. They just make it a lot easier to get a sound. The fx remind me a lot of the way i work in Surge. I like to load 16 different waves into one sample, and use Surge's shape slider to morph between them. A lot of the sounds i get from that, sound similar to Zebra's osc fx. For sure i wouldn't have the patience to find these sounds just by experimenting with simple wave morphing.

I was just a bit curious as to why, only now, we have phase distortion.

pdxindy wrote:
IIRC there has been no talk of any additional features at all for this update... just the 64-bit versions of U-he software. Some cool new oscFX is a bonus, and you never know what else might appear but I would not expect it so soon.


Ah right, i remember him talking about working on osc snap and module presets, so i just assumed it would be the next update. I think it just disappointed me a little, because i was checking this forum regularly to see if it had been updated.
But yeah, any update is a good update, and i'm sure i'll put the fx to good use!

Thanks for the reply.
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