Cableguys Curve 2 - Preset Contest Winners

[Obsolete262012]

Yes, it's a general statement', it's just always there at the end of the preset list. But you're right, we could remove it as soon as the user has synced once. Do you find it annoying?

It is not that big of a thing, but as you can see it confused me a bit
I guess people know that they can sync? Maybe you could make the statement "Sync with the server to check for new presets". The statement with the 2000+ presets sounds like: "there are 2000+ new presets, sync now". But I guess you could also remove it?

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Yes, it's a general statement', it's just always there at the end of the preset list. But you're right, we could remove it as soon as the user has synced once. Do you find it annoying?

It is not that big of a thing, but as you can see it confused me a bit
I guess people know that they can sync? Maybe you could make the statement "Sync with the server to check for new presets". The statement with the 2000+ presets sounds like: "there are 2000+ new presets, sync now". But I guess you could also remove it?

Exactly. we introduced that because some users missed the part with the syncing to get new presets. But I see that the current text is confusing - we'll change that!

[hakey]

Is the modulation of lfo rate behaviour staying as is?

Similarly, Velocity to EG behaviour (at low velocity envelope sustain level is raised, even if sustain is set to 0)?

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Is the modulation of lfo rate behaviour staying as is?

Similarly, Velocity to EG behaviour (at low velocity envelope sustain level is raised, even if sustain is set to 0)?

There is two modulation modes, "Old" and "New". The "New" one is intended to stay as it is, yes.

Note that the sustain knob does not show the sustain level, but determines the length of the sustain loop. You can draw in the level for sustain when you click on the magnifier icon in the EG section.

[hakey]

Is the modulation of lfo rate behaviour staying as is?

Similarly, Velocity to EG behaviour (at low velocity envelope sustain level is raised, even if sustain is set to 0)?

There is two modulation modes, "Old" and "New". The "New" one is intended to stay as it is, yes.

I was talking about a change in behaviour that happened between the Curve 2 betas and the final release. Those of my presets that used modulation of lfo rate - eg aftertouch (macro2) to lfo rate - now sound and behave differently. Some of them sound dreadful. Changing the modulation mode doesn't fix them.

What seems to be happening is that the rate modulation overrides the initial rate so that where , for example, lfo is used for vibrato, with aftertouch routed to increase the lfo rate, the effect of applying aftertouch is to first reduce lfo rate to zero and then increase it back up to the initial rate!

Note that the sustain knob does not show the sustain level

I was referring to the envelope sustain level that one adjusts via the graphical EG view.

If, for example, you set Velocity to EG1 at 100 and have EG1 routed to Cutoff with Filter Cutoff at zero and EG1's sustain set to zero, playing a note with close to zero velocity will result in filter cutoff being raised to close to 50%.

I suspect that, when modulated, EG sustain level (not time) is behaving sort of like an LFO - ie it 'zeros in' at the middle of its range.

Both this lfo rate modulation and velocity/EG behaviour are, for want of a better word, wrong. At least, they don't do what one expects and what they do do isn't very helpful.

Please don't take my word for it. Ask some of your pro sound designers - Michael Kastrup, Xenos, Soundsdivine - what they think.

[hakey]

Quick audio examples.

First off, Curve Velocity to EG behaviour.

Settings: Saw wave into 24db filter, Filter1 Cutoff=0, EG1 to Filter1 Cutoff = 100, Velocity to EG1 = 100

Eight notes full velocity for the first note decreasing to zero velocity for the last:

Curve velocity>EG behaviour

Notice filter cutoff level (=the sustain level) rises as velocity decreases.

For reference, here's the same sequence on another synth with near identical settings:

'normal' velocity>EG behaviour

Secondly, lfo rate modulation behaviour:

A simple filtered saw wave with pitch and cutoff modulated by an lfo. Macro2 (aftertouch) is routed to increase lfo rate. Aftertouch is gradually applied about a second after the note is triggered.

Curve: lfo rate mod

Notice the sudden decrease in lfo rate as aftertouch (which ought to increase the lfo rate!) is applied.

[Jakob / Cableguys]

I was talking about a change in behaviour that happened between the Curve 2 betas and the final release. Those of my presets that used modulation of lfo rate - eg aftertouch (macro2) to lfo rate - now sound and behave differently. Some of them sound dreadful. Changing the modulation mode doesn't fix them.

Well, that should not have happened.. then you uncovered a bug! Could you give me the name of one of such presets that changed? Then I will give it a listen with an older beta version and will find out what is responsible for the change. Thanks a lot for reporting it!

I suspect that, when modulated, EG sustain level (not time) is behaving sort of like an LFO - ie it 'zeros in' at the middle of its range.

No, the zero for EGs is at the bottom of the waveform in Curve. We'll add a info text on that to the modulation targets, hope this helps.

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Notice the sudden decrease in lfo rate as aftertouch (which ought to increase the lfo rate!) is applied.

Uh, I will look at this until Friday! Thanks a ton for reporting!

[hakey]

No, the zero for EGs is at the bottom of the waveform in Curve.

In the graphic EG view, yes - but modulate an EG by velocity and something quite different happens.

Here:

Settings: Saw wave into 24db filter, Filter1 Cutoff=0, EG1 to Filter1 Cutoff = 100, EG1 Sustain level=0 (graphic view), Velocity to EG1 = 100

Eight notes, full velocity for the first note decreasing to zero velocity for the last:

Curve velocity>EG behaviour

Notice for the last three notes, as velocity approaches zero, the filter cutoff level (=the sustain level) increases - remember that cutoff is set to zero, the only thing that is modulating cutoff is the EG, and the EG sustain level is itself set at zero (via the graphic EG view). So why is cutoff level increasing with decreasing velocity?

For reference, here's the same sequence on another synth with near identical settings:

'normal' velocity>EG behaviour

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Curve velocity>EG behaviour

Notice for the last three notes, as velocity approaches zero, the filter cutoff level (=the sustain level) increases - remember the cutoff is zero, the only thing that is modulating cutoff is the EG and the EG sustain level is set to zero (via the graphic EG view). So why is cutoff levlel increasing?

You are right. Might have gotten introduced with some code "cleanups", I remember for calculating velocity we moved some code. Will look into this!

[hakey]

Will look into this!

cool

Last niggle - similar to the lfo issue, rather than adding to it, Velocity to Cutoff (in the matrix) overrides Cutoff level (as set at the filter).

This means that setting Velocity>Cutoff to 100 scales cutoff absolutely, and so notes of zero velocity will have zero cutoff even where the Filter Cutoff amount is not zero.

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Just wanted to let you know that we're currently working on the sound bugs reported by hakey.

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Just wanted to let you know that we're currently working on the sound bugs reported by hakey.

The bugs with routing velocity to EG 1/2 and with modulation of LFO speed are fixed now in Curve 2.0.2. Check http://www.cableguys.de

[Jakob / Cableguys]

Will look into this!

cool

Last niggle - similar to the lfo issue, rather than adding to it, Velocity to Cutoff (in the matrix) overrides Cutoff level (as set at the filter).

This means that setting Velocity>Cutoff to 100 scales cutoff absolutely, and so notes of zero velocity will have zero cutoff even where the Filter Cutoff amount is not zero.

Not a bug but a feature.. playing at a velocity of 64 you will have the value set at filter cutoff knob. Lower values will lower the cutoff, higher values will raise it (if Vel->Cutoff is set to a positive value). If you want to avoid that a low velocity results in a cutoff value of 0, you can set Vel->Cutoff to a value smaller than 100.

[mrgrim3]

Wow man these sound really nice i wish i could afford a mac so i could use logic