KVR Audio

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:32 am

Sometimes cheap is just cheap. Sometimes its also good value for the money.

Compyfox posited elsewhere that it might be useful to list the hardware gear by a particular budget manufacturer thats actually good enough value or quality for anyone to consider, whether on a budget or not. I thought he was right, and that a neutral thread specifically for listing such gear from any manufacturer might be a useful resource. Suggestions with an explanation would be preferable, and if any debate over suggestions could stick to constructive criticism only, that might make this a continuingly useful resource.

I'll start with Behringer's PX2000 48-point patchbay. Ive got 3; they're cheap as hell, they're flexible, and they 'just work' . Mechanically, there's not much to go wrong with them and unless you're constantly repatching I cant imagine there's much goes wrong with them.

Kriminal · Post by **Kriminal** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:44 am

Good idea but, cheap is not easy to define. £400 for a new 100% analogue synth might be cheap some, not for others.

topaz · Post by **topaz** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:20 am

Behringer FCB1010

I use it as a foot trigger for ableton live and a stomp controller for guitart rig with my
Custom made bidule layout.

ART Tube Mp Studio V3

I replaced the stock Chinese tube with a Russian one. Sounds great as a preamp warmer.

I purchased a cheap sucker piezo from Hong Kong on ebay and purchased the software only from http://www.pulsecontroller.com

It's a brilliant surface to midi controller

Shy · Post by **Shy** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:56 pm

I'll mention some used things you could get.

Drawmer LX 20 and DL 221

I've used, owned and still own some compressors from "low-end" to "high-end", including models that are commonly touted as "the compressor every serious <insert stupid industry term> should own". There are countless shitty compressors out there. I won't mention names but I will say that every "budget" compressor made nowadays is crap. LX 20 and DL 221 are truly high-end compressors, regardless of anyone's ill-informed preconceptions. They're no worse in quality than the best SSL, Klark Teknik and DBX compressors. LX 20 is the one to get for classic unrestrained behavior with huge threshold, squash, range, and DL 221 is the one for more steady / stable performance, still with very large range and fine character.

Ibanez SDR 1000

Same as Sony MU-R201 minus a couple of useless combination algorithms. It's one of the best reverb units ever made, and that's no exaggeration. Amazing algorithms, perfected spaciousness, everything about it is "magical". I like it better than all Lexicon reverbs (including 224/X/XL). It's THE classic reverb unit as far as I'm concerned, and the most overlooked reverb unit ever. Other than the amazing hall and room reverbs, it also has the best "reverse" and gated reverb ever.

Boss ROD-10:

While people keep talking about the latest distortion box this, overdrive box that (mostly WAY overpriced crap), this little old unit which can be found for pretty cheap in the second hand market is the real deal and much better than all of them. It has real discrete transistor distortion circuits and 5 distortion types that are truly different from each other.

The first type is excellent multi-purpose distortion that keeps your high frequencies perfectly intact. The second type is the best implementation ever of the unique Tubescreamer design. The third mode is a good common "heavy" stacked distortion. The fourth has kind of a similar amount of distortion but a much nicer response and is the perfect classic heavy distortion as known mostly from acoustic and electronic "hardcore" music genres. The fifth mode is harsh Octavia-like "fuzz" which can be useful for some things. The built-in "EQ" is essential and not just for plain EQ, but for seriously altering the overall "texture" and response of each distortion type.

The amount of different kinds of distortion you can get is crazy. There is no "distortion box" that comes anywhere near this except Boss GL-100, a rack unit similar to this but without fuzz, with additional sharper type 4, and with 4 EQ bands.

ART Pro Channel (original, first version)

It's not a great mic preamp, it's just kind of decent. Its real strength is in distortion, but NOT with the included tubes. Change them to ECC83 12AX7 Telefunken or other high quality tubes. Then, not only do you get less noise and overall nicer sound, but the "creamy" distortion you get when overdriving the preamp and compressor sections is not something you can get from other things, including class A, high-end tube preamps, which have quite different distortion. People can keep whining about "starved plate" all they want and post misleading comments like "other tubes don't make a difference with this unit". They do make a major difference, giving you less noise and much better sound, so don't believe people who don't actually have any experience with the unit they're talking about. Note: the EQ circuit is horrible and always seriously degrades the sound quality, so don't even bother getting a tube for it or switching it on.

robogone · Post by **robogone** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 3:18 pm

topaz wrote:Behringer FCB1010

I don't own one, but I definitely agree on the price and those things generally get really good reviews.

To me it would be a great guitar stomp box for guitar through amp sim software, and a great trigger for performing live, including using the expression pedals while playing keyboards.

I really do need to buy one. At $150 and then probably being able to get 15% off at one of the big retailers in the US that's a no brainer (yes, I know not owning one implies that I have no brain...

)

mztk · Post by **mztk** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:03 pm

topaz wrote: ART Tube Mp Studio V3

I replaced the stock Chinese tube with a Russian one. Sounds great as a preamp warmer.

is that the one that's the same shape as the behringer version? sort of 1/2u with rounded
sides? i have the behringer one, and have a couple of 12AX7 kicking around..worth a try?

what's the Intelligate like? i've never used this yet, seemed to make sense to have
some sort of gate unit, it is just sitting there, could do with an opinion.

topaz · Post by **topaz** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:38 pm

This one

mztk · Post by **mztk** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:33 pm

ah i saw one in black the other day(their'usual' black w/purple logo)
ah right so that is the one with presets, the one behringer copied(?)
ofr their v2..i have the simpler one, not rated very highly and i wonder
if a 12AX7 or similar would improve it ('starved plate' etc.?)

i have an ART SC1 compressor, clueless about that one too
(is in a box somewhere now) anyone know+love it?

musikmachine · Post by **musikmachine** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:17 pm

Infrasonic Quartet.

I 've had this a while (won it in a Kvr comp

) but had to install it recently due to a mishap with my firewire interface and i'm glad i did! Had previous issues with the drivers but they seem to have been fixed in the most recent update.

Very good sound quality, believe it uses RME converters but that's what's most impressive. Only 2 channel i/o but has a ton of connectivity including AES/EBU S/PDIF and optical out and the outputs can switch between balanced and unbalanced outs. Can be connected via spdif to another interface as well.

No xlr mic out and i haven't used the mic preamp so can't comment on that and it's pci which i think is obselete on most motherboards now but if you have a spare slot and want to add a couple of channels and digital it's a very good quality interface for under £100.

ew · Post by ew » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:08 am

Shy wrote:There is no "distortion box" that comes anywhere near this except Boss GL-100, a rack unit similar to this but without fuzz, with additional sharper type 4, and with 4 EQ bands.

GL-100s are usually pretty cheap on the used market as well when you can find them. A GL-100 was my secret weapon in recording guitar tracks for a long time- run the CLEAN channel (channel 2) in the clean setting (I) with volume and master almost all the way up as the front end to an old non-master volume Marshall. The sound is absolutely amazing...

ew

cryophonik · Post by **cryophonik** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:23 am

As mentioned in the "other" thread, the Behringer HA4700 is a fine headphone amp for the money. Other notable cheapie gear that I own/have owned:

- FMR RNC compressor - really a no-brainer compressor by many people's standards.

- JoeMeek ThreeQ - a very versatile half-rack preamp/compressor/EQ channel strip

- Drawmer DL241 comp/expander/gate - not sure that this is really considered "budget" gear when you look at the retail price, but they can usually be found second-hand for dirt cheap.

JCJR · Post by **JCJR** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:30 am

whyterabbyt wrote:I'll start with Behringer's PX2000 48-point patchbay. Ive got 3; they're cheap as hell, they're flexible, and they 'just work' . Mechanically, there's not much to go wrong with them and unless you're constantly repatching I cant imagine there's much goes wrong with them.

Thanks, will keep that in mind next time buying a patch bay. Over the years I've found consumer/prosumer 1/4" patch bays rather failure prone, so if the Behringer is good, that's more than I can say about some others.

Problems I've had after a few years, bays just sitting in the home studio not getting used much-- Some of them apparently had inferior plating on contacts, and after awhile, every week or two I'd have to get behind the rack and plug/unplug all the snakes, work each connection to knock off the oxide and get a solid signal back. The little circuit boards can sometimes break too easy. The switches in the normalled jacks can get intermittent. There is nothing more frustrating than a 24 point bay with a couple of random jacks dead. Gap-toothed.

The two I have that still work are a Hosa and a DBX. Had to throw Tascam and Furman bays in the trash because they got too wonky to tolerate, just sitting there in the rack, not used much.

So if the Behringers have some durability, it is more than can be said of some.

Acid Mitch · Post by **Acid Mitch** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 7:55 am

Waldorf Blofeld is pretty good value for money.
Decent sound and a lot of synthesis to explore.

Spiritos · Post by **Spiritos** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:05 am

I believe the Behringer BCF2000 (http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/BCF2000.aspx) should be on top of this list.
It's durable, keeps it value on the used markets and having motorized faders for 75 euros (which I paid for it) is just awesome!

As a second option -although from another perspective- I'd say the Focusrite VRM Box (http://global.focusrite.com/vrm) is another winner. A different pov since there really is no other device like it (aside from the higher end focusrite AI's which have this technology in the box and 2 or 3 plugins). A great (and cheap) alternative if you don't have enough reference resources.

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:19 am

Behringer XM8500 mics. Not bad 58 clones, but at £20 or less they are spectacular.

Steinberg UR22 USB interface. I've owned a ton of cheapass interfaces and this is not only the cheapest of them all, but also the best at £85 or so.

Worthwhile budget gear