Pan positions. How many?
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 298 posts since 9 Feb, 2015
I like to use 3 pan positions: Centre and then around 50% R/L. Im considering adding 2 more making the overall shape 0 25% 75% R/L. I tend to group instruments by timbre and then pan them out t the relevant spots which creates real unity. Im a little concerned that what ive proposed is overkill.
- KVRAF
- 15277 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
I don't look at the position of the knob, I use whatever sounds right
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
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My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 298 posts since 9 Feb, 2015
Headphone mixing at the moment so from what ive read and been told its a bad idea to go via instinct. I have to use headphones unfortunately due to sensitive neighbours -_- I'd totally use instinct were I using my monitors thoughBertKoor wrote:I don't look at the position of the knob, I use whatever sounds right
- KVRAF
- 15277 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
If the neighbours are complaining, your monitors are set too loud. Best is to mix at a level the same as your TV or radio would be, maybe a little bit louder. Neighbours won't complain then, would they?
Problem is: a mix that sounds right at low listening levels also sounds right at higher levels. But the reverse is not true. It's very hard to keep yourself restrained, but your mixes will improve vastly if you do it at low volume.
Problem is: a mix that sounds right at low listening levels also sounds right at higher levels. But the reverse is not true. It's very hard to keep yourself restrained, but your mixes will improve vastly if you do it at low volume.
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 298 posts since 9 Feb, 2015
Its the looping that drives them insane I guess. The walls are rather thin. Panning on headphones is a nightmare. Things like phase inversions just sound really jarring and unpleasant to me on cans. Hard panning is the same. It sounds really unnatural imoBertKoor wrote:If the neighbours are complaining, your monitors are set too loud. Best is to mix at a level the same as your TV or radio would be, maybe a little bit louder. Neighbours won't complain then, would they?
Problem is: a mix that sounds right at low listening levels also sounds right at higher levels. But the reverse is not true. It's very hard to keep yourself restrained, but your mixes will improve vastly if you do it at low volume.
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- KVRAF
- 2063 posts since 14 Sep, 2004 from $HOME
I start with simple LCR panning. Then maybe finetune some to 50% and sometimes also in between, depending on how many tracks the song has, whether tracks might clash and what kind of tracks. Usually I try to refrain from too many pan positions, but e.g. for a four part vocal harmony i go wherever it sounds good to me.
If mixing pretty much exclusively on cans, why not invest some time (and little money) in something like Toneboosters Isone? That might help a bit.
If mixing pretty much exclusively on cans, why not invest some time (and little money) in something like Toneboosters Isone? That might help a bit.
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- KVRAF
- 6427 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
...and pan laws will also be different how to set for a certain result....
Some are linear and some logarithmic, some have adjusted center pos by -3dB etc.
So I'll go with BertKoor suggestion - listen - since frequency content in each instrument part may be different and decide how you want it. And how instruments overlap in content may tell one panned a bit left and the other right not to clash.
And with sends you might work with depth as well, making it different.
Some are linear and some logarithmic, some have adjusted center pos by -3dB etc.
So I'll go with BertKoor suggestion - listen - since frequency content in each instrument part may be different and decide how you want it. And how instruments overlap in content may tell one panned a bit left and the other right not to clash.
And with sends you might work with depth as well, making it different.
- KVRAF
- 4590 posts since 7 Jun, 2012 from Warsaw
I always pan instruments in pairs - if there is something in the left channel, there must also be something in the right one.
Other than that, I keep most of instruments in the middle and use stereo spread / detune / microshifting to keep them wide. Ping-pong delay also helps to place instruments away from each other.
Other than that, I keep most of instruments in the middle and use stereo spread / detune / microshifting to keep them wide. Ping-pong delay also helps to place instruments away from each other.
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Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 298 posts since 9 Feb, 2015
Fourtet introduces new material by selecting a pan position and making the new sound blend spectrally with the existing content. He also will remove one sound and replace it with another very similar sound. This is delightful to hear because its like listening to Bach except its spectral counterpoint
- KVRer
- 5 posts since 29 May, 2015 from Houston, TX
I think it depends on how dense the arrangement is. I find that LCR mixing gives me really wide and open mixes, while panning elements in between at 10%, 25%, 50% and so on, actually makes everything more closed in and not as wide. There is no correct way, only what best suits the song. Do what makes you smile!
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- KVRer
- 21 posts since 24 Mar, 2015 from Pittsburgh, PA
I'm with TitanTraxx; whatever sounds good, tends to be good.
And, also consider why you're panning and what is it you're panning. Something small like hi-hats and other transient percussive sounds I think work best with volume panning. But, maybe if you're mixing in some sort of ambience or pad sounds you might want to pan the sound in a manner that is a little fuller & less localized like, for instance, the haas effect (shameless plug), or other stereo image control options mentioned in the thread.
I can't really speak to LCR mixing because I've always just gone by ear on the ol' pan pots, haha.
And, also consider why you're panning and what is it you're panning. Something small like hi-hats and other transient percussive sounds I think work best with volume panning. But, maybe if you're mixing in some sort of ambience or pad sounds you might want to pan the sound in a manner that is a little fuller & less localized like, for instance, the haas effect (shameless plug), or other stereo image control options mentioned in the thread.
I can't really speak to LCR mixing because I've always just gone by ear on the ol' pan pots, haha.
Hey! Check out my first plug-in (Haa5) at http://www.apexaudio.org Sounds great, and it's just $10 (or free, or whatever price you want to pay)!
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- KVRAF
- 3089 posts since 4 May, 2012
As a personal rule, I don't mix using headphones and pan following instinct. Also tend to avoid visual feedback and will close my eyes if I need to double check that I'm not being influenced by what I am seeing.