Why EQ a sound doesn't change timbre?

[slipstick]

Oh my god... but have you read my last post?

Yes. You said "How many times I have to told you "I don't give a fXXk about listeners"?". I listen to lots of music. Therefore I am obviously of no interest and have nothing to contribute.

That's a relief.

Steve

[himalaya]

You're not gonna go up the stairs, every time you go down to step one from step four!

You gotta get up to get down.

I think that's a much deeper philosophical statement than the OP's predicament.

[himalaya]

In other words, what goes up, must come down. It's one of life's truths. Like this one: "It's not the timbre of timber that matters, it's the stick with which you hit"...or sommink like dat.

[dark water]

Next we'll be onto woodchucks and pheasant pluckers!

[Nowhk]

You are one seriously confused individual.
...
this word implies an audience. OTHER people. Listeners. You talk about an artist...artists release music for other people to listen...that is 'listeners' - it's all over your question.

We have just different approach of musics. OTHER people can be simply just me, enjoying unexplored/experimental music (made by myself, which nobody have experimented yet maybe).
Go check Richard Devine works and experiments (just an example).

Then it doesn't matter even more! If you make music for yourself, at home, so that you can listen to it at home, then you will know what speakers you have and you will mix the music to sound good on those speakers...where is the issue here?

No, its matter a lot. Because I've different mediums on my own equipment. And each of them seems to give to me different feeling (mood apart). That's why I asked "what the purpose of making music" if every device will shape what I'll consume, once produced. Is this included in the game? Really? I'm not sure. Can you?

I have no way of knowing what will be preserved or not. Maybe the original music contains some super low sub-bass and was made on speakers that could reproduce that low sub bass, but my speakers maybe can't handle that sound and will not reproduce it. How will I know that there is this sub-bass if my speakers can't play it back?
So the original music is not "preserved", as you put it, in this situation. So what? That's how it is. We've established this on every page.

You are repeating what I've never treated. I never talking about High vs Low setups. As I'm not talking only about flat system. Its easy to catch "lacks" from laptop speakers and pro flat monitor when you hear it.
That's just that, I just miss it, and its ok: I will just enjoying "part" of that work.
But here I'm talking of mediums that have solid attributes to correctly reproduce the song, just in a "different". Such as pronounced bass or different transients.

Then, I can play this music on two different speakers, side by side, and hear how the music differs on both (that's why you will find mix engineers using several different monitors, in order to have a contrasting 'picture' of the music). In this situation I am able to make a judgement on how both sets of speakers colour the sound and go from there.

This is what my post is ALL about. Does this doesn't floor you? You work hard to make a specific color, and than simply switch to another speaker, it mess with it? Damn...

That's why I can be emotionally affected by the theme from Gladiator listening to it on a laptop and pro speakers, therefore I 'get' the 'message' the composer may have intended, but at the same time, if I choose to, I may be aware of the vastly different frequency spectrum on both, the laptop an the pro monitors. How can I "get" the message despite such differences in overall 'timbre'? Magic?

That's simply my question How can you get the same message despite such differences in overall 'timbre' (and other elements that will change, its not only the timbre that will change, since these elements ARE part of the message)? Please explain.

So the options are (for YOU single listener, let alone anybody else):
- you listen somethings different everytime BUT all these tiny differences (that you listen and take place on the perception) won't make any significative effects;
- or you listen somethings different BUT you are listening/focus only on some factors that are preserved, and you just discard these tiny differences

For the sake of "how things works", this difference is huge IMO.

It's huge, you say, and so what to do about it? I'm asking again. What do you do about it? Nothing, right? We know there are differences, or not. And?[/quote]
AND... nothing, just trying to understand what's your convictions.

Do you work to make a product that preserve specific elements (so, a fixed product), or are you trying to make a product that will adapt to the circumstances (so variegated)?

In any case, this discussion can't be go ahead anymore I believe. You are now all BIASED by my "confused" and "stupid-asker" behaviour. The "village idiot". So even if I'm standing on somethings that may be interessant, all is f**ked up! It has become a Gearslutz discussion

Force be with you

[himalaya]

I never talking about High vs Low setups.

Sure. I use those to make a contrast. To make it easy for you to understand ...although I'm failing Everyone is....

This is what my post is ALL about. Does this doesn't floor you? You work hard to make a specific color, and than simply switch to another speaker, it mess with it? Damn...

That's life. That's how it is. You are not willing to absorb this truth and keep going round and round in circles.

That's simply my question How can you get the same message despite such differences in overall 'timbre' (and other elements that will change, its not only the timbre that will change, since these elements ARE part of the message)? Please explain.

Because music is not only about the frequency response, the "timbre" which is what you have focussed on for the most part. It's melody, harmony, orchestration, etc... all of which will come through on all playback systems. Parts of orchestration may be affected by some speakers, see my sub bass example above. But the rest of the 'components' that make the music piece will still work and send the 'message'.

AND... nothing, just trying to understand what's your convictions.

Do you work to make a product that preserve specific elements (so, a fixed product), or are you trying to make a product that will adapt to the circumstances (so variegated)?

You can not make a product (music) that will adapt to various "circumstances". There is no magic recipe to account for the countless playback systems with their unique playback properties.

As a music maker, your task is to equip yourself with the knowledge, skills and the right equipment so that you can technically produce the song/sound/instrumental in the best way you can. Make sure that it playes well on as many monitor systems you have access to: your laptop, your pro speakers, some hi-fi speakers. Try the song on all of those and then try to arrive at a mix which translates across the best. This is all you can do. Then....argh! we go round in circles. Just let it go, dude!

AND... nothing, just trying to understand what's your convictions.

Do you understand it now ?

[dark water]

Welcome to the next 22 pages.

[Gamma-UT]

Welcome to the next 22 pages.

Where will the goalposts wind up next time? Find out in the next thrilling instalment.

[himalaya]

Welcome to the next 22 pages.

Where will the goalposts wind up next time? Find out in the next thrilling instalment.

This has to be a full Hollywood production, I say. It can't end up being shown on Amazon or Netflix only.

[Nowhk]

Because music is not only about the frequency response, the "timbre" which is what you have focussed on for the most part. It's melody, harmony, orchestration, etc... all of which will come through on all playback systems. Parts of orchestration may be affected by some speakers, see my sub bass example above. But the rest of the 'components' that make the music piece will still work and send the 'message'.

This is very contradictory for me, I've already said this.
If that's true, than take any piece of music and switch its instrument with another ones, and you get the same music. I can't absolutely agree with this. Timbre is an integral part of the piece (or at least, the pieces I've in mind).

Why hearing a Gibson guitar instead of a guitar toy MATTER, while the differences between a Gibson guitar playback on different speakers/environments SHOULDN'T? You discard it only because the differences are tiny?

The only reply I gave to this question is "Trying to equate these major differences to the comparatively minor environmental differences is folly."

Along these 22 boring pages nobody of us (NOBODY) has been able to explain why these differences "don't matter".

Where will the goalposts wind up next time? Find out in the next thrilling instalment.

Never moved my goalpost dude, its still the same since the beginning. Why are you now reply with these "funny" replies instead of my last question to you?

[dark water]

Nowhk - do you ever get the feeling that you've wasted your time?

[whyterabbyt]

Along these 22 boring pages nobody of us (NOBODY) has been able to explain why these differences "don't matter".

Yes they have. Time after time. Your continued refusal to accept the explanations that have been given does not mean people have been able to give them.

[Gamma-UT]

Along these 22 boring pages nobody of us (NOBODY) has been able to explain why these differences "don't matter".

They have. You just step over it, come up with some irrelevant question and then pretend that people have misunderstood you.

Never moved my goalpost dude, its still the same since the beginning. Why are you now reply with these "funny" replies instead of my last question to you?

Maybe it has something to do with the disingenuous way you invite responses then tell people they aren't answering the right question (which morphs with every post).

You bring it on yourself. Have a nice thread.

[Gamma-UT]

Nowhk - do you ever get the feeling that you've wasted your time?

Then he plays it through different speakers and it all seems different.

[ghettosynth]

Nowhk - do you ever get the feeling that you've wasted your time?

I get that feeling, I tell you what!