Selling VST2 after October 2018: Steinberg agreement

[ghettosynth]

Steinberg got CLAP'ped though, so its all working out in the end.

Imagine if it was named SLAP'ed . Seamless Link Audio Protocol

Sucks Less Audio Protocol.

Talk about a missed opportunity, SLAP slaps.

Fork CLAP, call it SLAP, that's how open source works.

Laugh, that's how jokes work

I mean, cmon, getting the CLAP is never going to get old.

[wikter]

VST2 is a plugin format from a German company (Steinberg). In Germany there does not and never existed somehing like 'software patents'. VST2 is just an interface. Not even the idea for audio plugins was new back in the days. DLL files are a basic functionality of Windows and DX plugins and other plugin formats existed before VST. According to various court decisions it is legit to write software for an interface by reverse enginerring it (see SAP, Oracle et al).
Luckily you only can change the terms of a signed contract with the written agreement of both parties.

Controversial...

[xos]

RST1.0 A Request for Comments (RFC)

A general DAW compatible audio plugin format under the MIT license. Other alternative API's to this ABI is allowed.

Presented here is a audio plugin header file with support for voice killing for synthesizers and support for silence for audio effect units for reduced CPU load...

https://github.com/logos-maker/RST1.0

[wikter]

RST1.0 A Request for Comments (RFC)

A general DAW compatible audio plugin format under the MIT license. Other alternative API's to this ABI is allowed.

Presented here is a audio plugin header file with support for voice killing for synthesizers and support for silence for audio effect units for reduced CPU load...

https://github.com/logos-maker/RST1.0

Whats the point?

[BertKoor]

Whats the point?

Have you looked at the code? To me it looks like an attempt at DSP plugin programmers humor:
https://github.com/logos-maker/RST1.0/b ... _0_0/rst.h

But I see a missed opportunity:

Code: Select all

enum { LEFT, RIGHT }

[...]

int32_t number_of_inputs;	// number of audio inputs in plug
int32_t number_of_outputs;	// number of audio outputs in plug

I'd expect these both to be required to be &h0001 (meaning two channels because we start counting at zero and no channel makes no sense)

[mystran]

I'd expect these both to be required to be &h0001 (meaning two channels because we start counting at zero and no channel makes no sense)

Why would no channels make sense? I've written plugins have zero inputs and outputs, typically they are MIDI in and MIDI out.

ps. For compatibility reasons I'd still declare stereo in, stereo out and just let the audio be pass-thru.. but in many cases the plugin itself might not have any use for that.

[Music Engineer]

Whats the point?

Have you looked at the code? To me it looks like an attempt at DSP plugin programmers humor:
https://github.com/logos-maker/RST1.0/b ... _0_0/rst.h

To me, this looks like another take on making a drop-in replacement for Steinberg's now depublished VST2 SDK (the other two, I'm aware of, are FST and vestige - are there any others, by the way?). The point being that some people may still want to make VST2 plugins and/or hosts (or have to, for legacy reasons). I think, having such a "legacy SDK" available has value but I also think that going forward, we should move on to more modern and open formats like clap. I'd also be worried about being legally sued by Steinberg for publishing such a thing.

[Music Engineer]

double post - ignore

[wikter]

Nice to see alternative options but does these worth the effort? Anyway, Tone2 drop a comment two days ago about this.
What we really need now is a *working* Clap>VST2/3 adapter, in the way Buzz Polac Adapters work inside any DAW.
Being able to switch to CLAP is the key to avoid VST and start a new Virtual Sound Processing Revolution.

[Urs]

We (u-he) have started using the CLAP->VST3 adapter extensively in our internal builds. The user and the host sees no difference between a wrapped VST3 version of our CLAP plug-ins and a version that isn't wrapped.

If someone needs a CLAP->VST2 adapter, developers can use the base class that the CLAP->VST3/AU adapter is built upon and build such an adapter in next to no time.

Unfortunately it can't be open source and thus the CLAP team can't provide it - for the same reasons that this thread exists, and to some extent also for the reasons CLAP exists.

[xos]

RST1.0 A Request for Comments (RFC)

A general DAW compatible audio plugin format under the MIT license. Other alternative API's to this ABI is allowed.

Presented here is a audio plugin header file with support for voice killing for synthesizers and support for silence for audio effect units for reduced CPU load...

https://github.com/logos-maker/RST1.0

Whats the point?

You can make plugins that will register as VST2 plugs.
But it has 2 new functions that report what channels in are silent. That require almost no changes to existing VST2 plugs to able to use.

And it's only a ABI as it allows other API's. You can make a drop in replacement API that will old plugs compile and then make small changes to and give it modern compatibilities.
And you can make no changes to VST2 plugs and comply to the format.
And you can make small changes that will give the plug lower CPU usage.

And the host can give id number on notes, and events so you can modulate voices on synthesizers.
And synthesizers can report on dead notes so hosts can stop modulating them.

And you get synthesizers with almost endless modulation possibilities without getting the clap.

Here is some things that comes to mind...

• It needs no registration.

• You can use it in closed source applications.

• Can make faster plugs.

• Easier to make plugs.

• Most DAW's already supports in.

• New stuff can use it without licence.

• Endless polyphonic modulation capabilities.

• Don't needs code generators like VST3.

• A chance to improve old stuff without total rewrite.

You can create proper documentation and best practices.
You can make tests programs that gives info about plugs, to make development easier.
Get users for these plugs.

The game here is to make a format that can load into existing DAW's and ensure no craches.
And stop the guesswork when it comes to complying to DAW's with a new plugin format that is more compliant to with DAW's than VST2 plugs.

[wikter]

Thanks xos! That explanation is clear.

[BobDog]

Well, obviously they changed their mind. And their terms.

Hi Urs,

I'm posting here rather than the Bitwig thread where this was mentioned.

I'm finding it difficult to find where Steinberg are saying that previously agreed and signed licensing agreements for the VST 2 SDK are being canceled.

Could you please direct me to where they are saying this?

Many thanks

Andy

[Urs]

Well, obviously they changed their mind. And their terms.

Hi Urs,

I'm posting here rather than the Bitwig thread where this was mentioned.

I'm finding it difficult to find where Steinberg are saying that previously agreed and signed licensing agreements for the VST 2 SDK are being canceled.

Could you please direct me to where they are saying this?

Many thanks

Andy

In the VST3 SDK license agreement, available as pdf from their Github:

https://github.com/steinbergmedia/vst3sdk

§1.6 specifically does not include a license for VST2

§9.8 terminates all prior agreements with Steinberg, including any prior VST2 or VST3 ones.

This is not subject to any interpretation from my side, we have clarified this with Steinberg's legal department. Unfortunately that exchange is subject to an NDA, so I guess you'd have to go through it yourself if you want to hear it from them.

[seafire]

When does this come into effect exactly?