my take on soundtrackish orchestral

[synthgeek]

This is my attempt at writing an orchestral soundtrack for a film that doesn't exist... the idea was to pick a mood & try to capture it with orchestral instruments (courtesy of many instances of Wusikstation). Other than talent, my main obstacle is the fact that I have very little knowledge of how an orchestra actually works. I think if I spent more time on it I could get it to sound better, but I have other projects I want to spend the time on, so here it is:

Remembrance

This also happens to be the first time I've actually finished a song in 3/4.

Please feel free to share constructive criticism or tips, as I might like to explore this sort of thing more.

[Audio Gnostic]

pretty interesting, overall actually sounds pretty damn catchy with the exception of the fact that i think you possibly unintentionally progrramed in some dissonant notes. and they dotn really sound good dissonant, just like bad dissonant, so u might wanna clean that up. also sounds defintely very much like its played on a keybord, i think in this situatin it might have to do with the way that teh instruments are actually played and the way in which they get mixed when an orchestra is being mixed instead of a hip hop song for example. your song sounds very much like a hip hop beat type orchestra, i just keep waiting for the beat to come in lol.

but it really sounds pretty dope/ catchy, the idea is deifntely great, if like you said, you were an expert at orchestral instrumentation, and if you cleaned up those dissonant notes, mixed it more realistically, and put in a little bit more spice, i coudl defintely hear this being used in a movie.

i do, however wanna tell you that i need to put a more positive spin on my review here, cuz liek i said its very catchy and pretty dope

[Lady J]

If Norman Bates from Psycho conducted a symphony orchestra the result would be nearly identical to this.

Seriously this is awesome. Forget hip hop, it would make a great intro to some dark goth metal. Can I use it?

[polyslax]

Yeah that's wicked sg - you've definitely captured a mood! I think it has a vibe that could go soundtrack with a bigger mix and some high quality samples. As it stands I think Lady J may be on to an idea with the goth metal suggestion, I could totally see it in this context. Hope to hear some more this from you, it's an interesting departure!

[WilliamK]

Nice track indeed. I would just add a bit of extra Reverber and maybe change the release of some instruments.

Wk

[Jazzyspoon]

You got me, this is not what I expected.
Kinda creepy. I have a small collection of stuff I used to make that sound a lot like this. I agree with AG that there are a few odd dissonant notes among many nice dissonant notes, but it's cohesive enough as a scratch tablet composition to take to the next level. Only advice I would have given has been given, though I may add that smooth tempo fluctuations (even small ones) can make this style all the more moody.

Can your host export midi? Would be interesting to hear what kind of collab you could create with some of the folks on this forum who work in this genre more than we do (folderol, jancivil, Daniel Pompougnac). Just a thought. You could even work part of this into a break on one of your more rhythm oriented tracks.

Thanks for sharing. Cool stuff. Let's collab soon (or maybe I'll finish your remix, too)(oh, the shame)...

[synthgeek]

...also sounds defintely very much like its played on a keybord, i think in this situatin it might have to do with the way that teh instruments are actually played and the way in which they get mixed when an orchestra is being mixed instead of a hip hop song for example.

Yes, you're definitely right here- with time I think I could somewhat fix these issues, but it's time I don't want to spend on this right now. That's one thing I intend to practice in the future though- trying to make this kind of thing sound less obviously like samples.

i do, however wanna tell you that i need to put a more positive spin on my review here, cuz liek i said its very catchy and pretty dope

Thanks! No worries, I asked for criticism- your comments are appreciated.

If Norman Bates from Psycho conducted a symphony orchestra the result would be nearly identical to this.

I'll take that as a definite compliment. If you really want to use it, feel free- but I want to hear the result.

@ polyslax: thanks man! No promises on just when, but I do plan to try more stuff like this.

A WilliamK: thanks! Cool to hear from you here, since it was your instrument I used.

You got me, this is not what I expected.
Kinda creepy. I have a small collection of stuff I used to make that sound a lot like this. I agree with AG that there are a few odd dissonant notes among many nice dissonant notes, but it's cohesive enough as a scratch tablet composition to take to the next level. Only advice I would have given has been given, though I may add that smooth tempo fluctuations (even small ones) can make this style all the more moody.

Thanks Jazzy! Ah yes, tempo changes- would've been a good idea.

Can your host export midi? Would be interesting to hear what kind of collab you could create with some of the folks on this forum who work in this genre more than we do (folderol, jancivil, Daniel Pompougnac). Just a thought.

As far as I can tell, Reaper can only export one track's midi at a time- but yes. That would be cool- if any of you guys read this & wanna take a stab, let me know...

You could even work part of this into a break on one of your more rhythm oriented tracks.

You read my mind. I was resisting the urge the whole time to add some crunchy drums & filtered synths... I do plan to do a more synth-based remix of sorts, perhaps when I finish my current batch of other stuff.

Thanks for sharing. Cool stuff. Let's collab soon (or maybe I'll finish your remix, too)(oh, the shame)...

Heh, no worries... but yes, we should get together on something. And you know I'm always down to hear a Jazzyfication of one of my tracks.

Thanks again for all the comments folks, much appreciated!

[alvin18]

Interesting.

Is it only me but seems like beginning from 0:24-... one lower violin note is in wrong key? Maybe there also could be a little bit more some lower frequencies (lower notes) to add more power and darkness, just a thought.

If you know a movie "Butterfly Effect", I imagine this track can suit with some episodes from this movie

Alvin

[synthgeek]

Interesting.

Is it only me but seems like beginning from 0:24-... one lower violin note is in wrong key? Maybe there also could be a little bit more some lower frequencies (lower notes) to add more power and darkness, just a thought.

Thanks for the comments! Yeah, that was something I noticed as well- there are definite holes as far as the instrumentation goes- again, I'd like to blame my lack of knowledge on the workings of an orchestra. Especially when it comes to the horns, I really have no clue as to what roles they play. I understand the strings a bit better because I've actually seen string quartets in action up close- but my experience with full orchestras is limited to listening to recordings and only one or two actual symphony concerts. I have much to learn.

[folderol]

This is very good style-wise. I think it could definitely do with better samples though - especially the horns. I would say Daniel is really your man here. He understands orchestras better than most of us.

I do hope you get to do more on this in time.

[deltro]

I have much to learn.

Yes you do, good sir.

My high-school wind ensemble experience should help some.

One thing I noticed is that the panning is very inconsistent. If you really are going for a realistic orchestral sound, keeping the bass on one side, but giving it a bit of reverb to keep it almost ghostly would really help. Sometimes when you want a higher note to come out more, you move it away from the group it was originally with, this is wrong!

Percussion. Due to the fact that you don't have the most dynamic/realistic violin sounds, I suggest getting some good Timpanis, Crashes, Bass Drum, Bells, Malleted Instruments (some good marimba and vibe parts would fit this very nicely).

There is very much a problem with the arrangement. Orchestral arrangement is an art that requires a pretty huge amount of experience actually playing in bands and listening to it to see how expression is made. Really the hardest part of orchestral music is that single instruments need to be able to take on multiple roles which is hard to replicate synthesized.

As an orchestral writer, because you don't have much freedom with complexity of note patterns, you have to create growth with dynamic contrast. Your song here sits at forte the whole time- save an attempt at a mezzo forte section for a very short period of time at 1:06ish. Notice how real instruments change their characteristic tone somewhat when you are playing quieter, another challenge to this.
Also, Syncopation doesn't work so well in orchestral music. (the brass parts)

Create sections.
The reason that panning is such an issue here is that you want instruments to be able to take on different roles without becoming a different instrument, but this doesn't achieve that, because you probably actually are using different instruments because of the huge panning changes.

Think of an orchestra as a single instrument that happens to produce multiple sounds.

wait for it...
hold on...
one more line...
just kidding...

Think of an orchestra as a single instrument that happens to produce multiple sounds.

While simple when you think about it, this idea takes a very long time to really grok. Pay very close attention to how orchestral writers introduce and remove parts. this is Eric Whitacre, he is a god.

tl;dr: With orchestral music, volume = feelings. This song's volume does not change enough, and as a result very little feeling is had. I think it's a pretty good try though, you were quite close- and while static, your instruments sound pretty good overall! Love to hear more.

[synthgeek]

@ folderol: thanks!

@ deltro: thanks to you as well, for the kind words as well as the insight. Yeah, the panning was admittedly pretty much random. I understand what you're saying about the dynamics as well- something to work on in the future. The point you make about thinking of the orchestra as a single instrument is what got me thinking about trying it actually- I was noticing how where I might use a filter sweep in an electronic piece, classical music has layers of instruments dedicated to that one sound- say a string swell. And yes, I do realize the irony here.