Rock solid MIDI timing: VSTi sync to rendered audio on a PC based DAW host. Is there such a thing?

[optofonik]

I've rendered some drum tracks to audio and they aren't locking tight, in the pocket, with the unrendered VSTi percussion tracks. Before rendering everything was tight and sounded great. Not so much anymore.

The manufacturer forums for my DAW have users there who are experiencing similar timing issues but I can't find a solution on any of the threads. In my research I found a thread somewhere with very good things to say about PT and Samplitude, or maybe it was Studio One, regarding this subject.

Thanks for any insight. I'm dead in the water with a percussion based piece I am working on.

Kind regards.

[jancivil]

there are more than a few users who don't know how to use Cubase either.

Cubase is rock solid per timing. People rely on it absolutely. I do. Absolutely. I often render the more resource intensive tracks to audio, to keep my latency down, as a matter of course. You have an issue that I have never encountered. Most of my music is heavy on percussion and requires seriously tight timing. My preferences are set at 4000 PPQN to give you an indication of my priorities.


Something is wrong with your system, or something is missing from your understanding of what to do. Cubase in no wise changes the timing of tracks just via rendering.

[optofonik]

I'm hoping some folks with DAW experience outside of Cubase are willing to share their experiences regarding unrendered VSTi tracks staying in the pocket with rendered tracks. I've another thread going that's Cubase specific and inlcudes my system specs and some of my experience. I've also editing my original post accordingly so as avoid referencing Cubase in order to be a bit more clear and avoid the slightest possibility of offending Cubase users.

[siriusbliss]

Rendering and freezing MIDI drum tracks is rock solid in Samplitude.
I do it all the time with good results.

Greg

[optofonik]

Rendering and freezing MIDI drum tracks is rock solid in Samplitude.
I do it all the time with good results.

Greg

Thanks, Greg.

[kontrolfreak]

What program did you use to do the tracks then? I have never heard or seen of this either.

What Vsti's were used?


I have bounced my tracks for years to save CPU for effects for mixing and have never had issues on any of the programs I have used over the years unless it was related to a plug in.

[rasscass]

How does it sound after exporting/freezing the VSTi percussion tracks as well?

Try exporting your tracks after setting a smaller ASIO buffer size for your audio device in Device setup.

Change Audio Priority from "Normal" to "Boost" in Device Setup/VST Audio System/Advanced Options.

[optofonik]

I'll try exporting all the drums and percussion and see what happens. My buffer is at 256 and it was suggested on another forum that raising it could have an effect. I'm also going to render in real time and take note. It's shaping up to be a less relaxing Sunday than I was anticipating.

[Proxima4]

This used to happen to me with Ableton, infact it became very frustrating at times.

I seem to recall though it was caused more by the instrument thant the DAW.

Have you put swing into the track? or have warped or frozen something else that could cause a swing issue?, loop points or something else?

Start and end points of the entire track or single track?

[David Carpenter Wind Core]

I had this problem with many hosts. The song sounds great then you render it an bam sounds like sh#@. The best host I found for rendering and time accuracy is believe it or not REAPER. Try the free version make your song in there and side by side the final rendering. I guarantee that Reaper beats all I know because I spent a whole weekended testing this theory. Whats great is the rendering sounds exactly like it did on playback inside the host.

Another trick I discovered is to use the VOXENGO Vst recorder on the MAster channel hit record then hit play what you hear is what you get. This is a good work around for hosts that have problems in the rendering stage.

Hope this helps and happy trails to REAPER.

[VariKusBrainZ]

And what are your buffer settings for VSTs?
This could possibly cause a problem if it differs to the hosts buffer setting.

[optofonik]

double post

[optofonik]

This used to happen to me with Ableton, infact it became very frustrating at times.

I seem to recall though it was caused more by the instrument thant the DAW.

Have you put swing into the track? or have warped or frozen something else that could cause a swing issue?, loop points or something else?

Start and end points of the entire track or single track?

The track was quantized with a bit of swing. Are you suggesting that quantized swing randomizes the track, playing it back differently with each "live" playback? That would certainly account for the lack of null but I've not understood that swing is randomization of this sort.

[optofonik]

I had this problem with many hosts. The song sounds great then you render it an bam sounds like sh#@. The best host I found for rendering and time accuracy is believe it or not REAPER. Try the free version make your song in there and side by side the final rendering. I guarantee that Reaper beats all I know because I spent a whole weekended testing this theory. Whats great is the rendering sounds exactly like it did on playback inside the host.

Another trick I discovered is to use the VOXENGO Vst recorder on the MAster channel hit record then hit play what you hear is what you get. This is a good work around for hosts that have problems in the rendering stage.

Hope this helps and happy trails to REAPER.

I'll check out the Voxenger plug.

[optofonik]

What program did you use to do the tracks then? I have never heard or seen of this either.

What Vsti's were used?


I have bounced my tracks for years to save CPU for effects for mixing and have never had issues on any of the programs I have used over the years unless it was related to a plug in.

Superior Drummer 2 and Battery.