Feedback Compressor II - Gentleman's Edition (discussion)

[Beatworld]

One of the better free comps

That may be remembered as the greatest understatement of all time

[MFXxx]

One of the better free comps

That may be remembered as the greatest understatement of all time

*takes an underentimated bow*

[FabienTDR]

Just a thought..

I think that a simple A/B functionality is sufficient, at least for this specific plug-in. I checked several solutions and prefer a "keep it simple" approach. The A/B switch seems to be the most elegant solution (and also allows the "blind" A/Bing mentioned by djscorb). Maybe with additional "copy A to B" and "copy B to A" options accessible via the context menu.

[Beatworld]

Just a thought..

I think that a simple A/B functionality is sufficient, at least for this specific plug-in. I checked several solutions and prefer a "keep it simple" approach. A simple A/B switch seems to be the most elegant solution (and also allows the "blind" A/Bing mentioned by djscorb). Maybe with additional "copy A to B" and "copy B to A" options accessible via the context menu.

That works for me Fabien.

I think the "keep it simple" approach is the best way forward for the FBCII.

[Hermetech Mastering]

i agree too fabien, a/b is enough.

[djscorb]

Hi again

a,b,c etc is vastly more useful. If a user doesn't want c they don't have to use it. But, if you only have a and b and the user wants c they are stuck. I wouldn't underestimate it's usefulness.

The benefit of having three slots is that one has to hold the existing setting.
When I go back to revisit a compressor's settings, it's because I'm not quite happy with the amount of attack coming through or the release time "grooving" etc. I personally find setting up two alternative settings helps me hone in on what works best on the material a lot quicker.

Also, I tend to keep the first setting in that "a" slot, and when I next play the track out at a club / party and then decide that, actually, maybe I prefer the release setting on the first "a" choice" but the bite added from the second "b" setting.

That's when I try and get the best of those settings in slot c Of course, if I decide setting "a" was the best after all I don't need to do anything other than set it back to "a" with no further tweaking required.

I agree that a-h as in Melda and DMG is perhaps overkill but nobody ever complained of having too many options! Anyway, that's why I suggested a/b/c as it i feel it is the minimum number of slots that still offer this very flexible and useful workflow when (re)tweaking a track

Whether you decide on just two a/b slots or more, it will still be a welcome addition to the GE. I just wanted to explain my reasoning for needing three slots.

Cheers

Scorb

[fgimian]

Hey there, really nice compressor!

One feature which I really miss is auto make-up gain. I think that would be a great feature to add to the premium edition.

Also, it would be good to be able to type values for knobs and save a selected set of settings as default

Keep up the great work!

[Alexiz]

RTAS version(?)
Looking forward to your ideas!

Yes, please do consider the RTAS (well, better AAX now) version. I for one would love having the Gentleman's edition working in Pro Tools. Have spent some time testing the TDR v.2.0.1, and found it a brilliant tool. Really looking forward to the Gentleman's edition (and once again really hoping for the AAX).

[FabienTDR]

Hi everyone,

I finally found the time to focus on the GE edition, here are the latest news:


DSP:

1. The RMS section of the compressor has been improved (now practically distortion free, even with fast attack settings). Sounds slightly different than the original edition.

2. The RMS/Peak transition is now smoother. Again, this sound slightly different than the original (but clearly better IMHO).

3. I tried to implement an "insane" quality mode. But it didn't work as expected. At this high rate (16x the audio rate), the algorithm begins to hit its numeric limits and returns bad results (not to mention the doubled CPU load).

Because of 1) and 2), the benefits of a higher rate are only minimal anyway. I will most probably offer a "Low Quality" mode instead.

4. New SC filters! (including a few exotic modes)

5. Upward expansion mode (up to 1:3, accessible via ratio knob)

6. "Micro timing" is now a continuous control (from very "smooth and lazy" to "fast").

7. I will most probably remove the "RMS Source" control and offer a "RMS Size" parameter instead. Sort of an attack control for the RMS path.


I will post a new screen-shot of the re-worked UI soon.




@djscorb: I'm still not really convinced of the A/B/C benefits. IMHO, a simple A/B is much easier to use, implement and lay out on a limited space. A/B is just a simple switch with "copy to A" and "copy to B" context menus, but A/B/C needs much more buttons (switch next/switch previous/copy to) and a less accessible control logic.


@soundpalace: I don't like auto makeup for several reasons. First of all, there is no way to implement a reasonable make-up function into this compressor, simply because it is extremely difficult to predict its behaviour (which is also the case for practically all auto makeup compressors, they go crazy as soon one touches the timing controls). Second, auto-makeup makes the "louder sounds better" illusion even more problematic and would fool most users who aren't aware of "equal loudness" A/B ethics. I personally want to hear the gain reduction before I compensate for the volume loss.


@Alexiz: RTAS definitely not. And to be honest, I'm tired of Avid's stupid and totally inadequate monopolist attitude and politically driven engineering. I asked them over a year ago for access to their ridiculously confidential pile of shit called "RTAS SDK" and they didn't even reply since (!). I won't offer RTAS/AAX support as long they don't rethink their political and technical attitude from the ground up.

[djscorb]

Hey Fabian

The GE features sound cool, I'm looking forward to hearing the results!

What extra SC options did you add in the end? I hope the tilt one made it in as it can be very useful for mixing and mastering.

No worries about the a/b/c, having the function at all is still most welcome. Good luck with it all, can't wait

Any idea on price yet? Oh and any ETA on the deesser?

Cheers

Scorb

[FabienTDR]

The final HP modes aren't ready yet, but I can already confirm a wide-band inverted pink filter (with the 3dB cutoff frequency still being controllable) and several non-linear modes for frequency dependent harmonic distortion generation (for example, compression below 200Hz exclusively creates odd harmonics, but content above 200Hz creates both odd and even harmonics), frequency dependent ratio and more.

I'm still evaluating/designing further SC options.

Pricing is still open, but I feel that Klanghelm does it right (not just the pricing)! Maybe a good reference?

No news on the de-esser, a central element of the algorithm needs a major re-work but I found no time yet. Maybe another processor will appear before.

[camsr]

Maybe a tape circuit designer with noise reduction but without the tape.

Dynamic EQ?

[FabienTDR]

@camsr: Tape without noise sounds like a good idea


Here's a small update regarding the latest developments on the GE edition:

- I will add some kind of "Mode" option allowing to switch between the default "parallel" mode, a new "serial" mode, the pure peak path and the pure rms path.

The approach has several advantages.

First, all modes sound great. The new serial mode offers a distinct but equally well balanced alternative to the default parallel mode. The idea is pretty straight forward, it simply connects the rms and peak path in series. The signal is first rms compressed, then peak compressed. The technique is well known and an effective way to tame overly wild vocals or even whole mixes.

I probably don't need to mention the great flexibility the pure RMS and peak modes offer, especially during tracking/mixing applications. 4 distinct high quality compressors in one box!

Second, all "mode" switch options remain surprisingly compatible to the previous usability/workflow. The parallel mode still works as known from the standard edition, the serial mode embeds perfectly into the peak-crest based control philosophy. Both the complex hybrid modes and the pure RMS and Peak modes highly remain reasonably comparable to each other because they still depend on the peak crest setting. Makes it easy to tune the peak crest factor for the complex hybrid modes or just compare them "on the fly" (within limits)

- The ratio control now behaves slightly differently, especially at high ratios. Ratios above ~3:1 now trigger a more aggressive compression than before. At very high ratios, the compressor gradually behaves more feed-forward-"ish". Low ratios remain as smooth as they were before. It greatly increases the flexibility of the compressor.

- Next step will be the upward expansion modes (accessible via the first quarter of the ratio knob range!).

- The whole RMS path is being improved. Beside other trickery T.B.A., the new RMS path features a new UI parameter called "release gate". No, this is not a noise gate. Technically, the function freezes the release if the signal drops below a certain threshold (optimally right above the noise floor of the recording). It eliminates useless and bad sounding noise build ups during sudden program pauses and has its most obvious advantages in vocal processing and other material with sudden pauses. But works great with full mixes, too.

- A/B function nearly ready.

- New SC modes still open.

- New external SC input open.



I am very satisfied with the latest state. I managed to drop several previous ideas, as they turned out to be ineffective, inefficient, difficult to control or just bad sounding. This is a good sign!

[Beatworld]

I am very satisfied with the latest state. I managed to dropped several previous ideas, as they turned out to be ineffective, inefficient, difficult to control or just bad sounding. This is a good sign!

Sounds very cool now Fabien
The new modes seem like a fantastic idea.

Thanks for the update.
I'm looking forward to it.

[_dada_]

Yep, can't wait to send some money ...