How Many Different DAWs Do You Use?

[DuX]

I don't think "power users" use a dozen of DAWs. "Power users" have a complete knowledge of one or two DAWs, and use it, not waste time learning a dozen of DAWs only superficially. That's what most of people do wrong these days not just regarding DAWs. They use everything superficially, and use presets. Instant gratification. A musical hamburger. The "real thing" lies in knowing your tools in depth, having fun with them, exploring them, and it's always best to just choose your tools and learn how to use them. Just IMHO. I still get SO MUCH from the EnergyXT 1.41 because I know it in depth. It's an incredible improvising tool, and gives you results quickly, loads in about 10ms, and you can also use it as a VST plugin, and it's modular. You just use lines to connect your devices just like real hardware... I simply love that! Just as an example. Everybody has forgotten about EnergyXT 1 already... it's incredible! I will never get over the fact that a developer abandoned it and made this v2 which is not really the same thing... honestly, f**k you Jorgen, you're an idiot, a genius idiot. There, I feel better now.

[Hink]

Most power users own many DAW's and Audio editors and also Video and Photo editors. They may work in 1 most of the time and transfer there mix to another and rewire when 1 is lacking.

Agreed. I used only Cubase for the longest time, it did most of what I needed and I learned to work around the few things it lacked. What changed that was the ability to load other DAW's (Maschine, FL Studio, Geist, BPM, etc.) as VST's, there's just no reason to compromise when that's available.

OTOH, I'm willing to bet a lot of classic songs and great pieces of music have been as a result of compromise and workarounds. As much as I love where things are now I am s thankful when I started playing there were few choices for for recording (this is waaaaaay before the 4-track cassette studios). Sure it might be nice to start out with say just FL studio today, have all that at your fingertips and you hit the ground running because you can use the PR tools to write scales you dont understand, you can write chords you dont understand,, you can throw digital processing and fx on things without understanding, just use presets and/or ask on a forum where to go "from here" on a piece.

But if you ask me that's kind of like skipping any basic arithmetic and going straight to algebra in school because we have calculators. We see this here all the time, I wonder if this month will end before we get another "lack of inspiration, satisfaction, or I'm bored should I quit making music" threads. So many people skipping over the basic fundamentals (and I'm not talking music theory here for the record) and then later their ignorance stands out like a sore thumb.

Probably the best example I can come up with off the top of my head is all about fx AND dp, there are people reading this that will say there is no difference...I got a real first hand taste of this a while back when I brought up a point about it. The result is the abuse, overuse, under use and misuse of both...GAS has a side effect, once you get the gear you want to use it and the tendency can be to use it ALL on EVERYTHING. (not so sure I am any different when it comes to my skill sets as a guitarist and my collection of gear, I am constantly reminding myself "less is more")

No sir, I disagree 1000000000000%, compromise promotes learning...some of my best learning experiences came from compromising. I can think of a lot of reasons to compromise. My music deserves my willingness to substitute production with understanding. Sadly, understanding is lost these days, many people want to start at the top and if they drop the right buzz words they can fake their way through understanding when talking with others just like it's easy to fake your way through writing music if one wants. Actually as someone who cares little about how much I produce the truth is my productivity would probably go up by leaps and bounds if I compromised even more.

Now I'm not saying you're this way Eric, I am not even saying that most of KvR is this way...but it does explain a lot of the "I'm bored with music" threads from so many who started out only a few years ago (often less)...I guess when it comes to compromise it's just a matter of what your priorities are because imho there is no compromise when it comes to learning. We talk about learning curves of gear, unfortunately far too often that curve takes you away from learning fundementals

[DuX]

Whoa! I get you, Hink, 1000000000000% Great post, dude, I enjoyed reading it.

Maybe because I've been in "this" since about 1987? ... Does that really matter? Possibly, because I appreciate the tools we have now more. People these days cannot comprehend the restrictions we had at the time, and it's interesting to notice that I think those restrictions weren't that bad at all, especially concerning creativity. They make you investigate a certain tool in depth. Say, Yamaha SPX-90 effect, I remember spending hours tweaking it to get something new and interesting from it! In the same way I use Valhalla FX these days... ValhallaUberMod and ValhallaRoom, for instance. These FX are incredible! I can imagine people using these with presets and saying "it's alright", or "naaah, not good", never even trying to get into it. That's sad. People, plugins are not hamburgers...

Cheers!

[cryophonik]

I don't think "power users" use a dozen of DAWs. "Power users" have a complete knowledge of one or two DAWs, and use it, not waste time learning a dozen of DAWs only superficially.

That may be true for some people, but I'd say that there is probably a large proportion of people that it doesn't apply to. Most DAWs these days have a lot of overlap in their feature set and workflow. So, once you've become a "power user" on one or two DAWs, the learning curve for other DAWs gets much easier. I'm in the process of learning Logic Pro right now and I'm finding it very easy because of my familiarity with Sonar, PT, Studio One, etc. With almost every feature I find myself thinking "oh yeah, that's almost/just like the way DAW X does it". For me, the hardest part of becoming a power user is keeping the keyboard shortcuts straight, but that's because I'm getting old and my brain doesn't monkey universal shifting trains.....wait, where's my spaghetti?

[DuX]

cryophonik... if you know how to do all the same things in all the DAWS, then what's the point in using different DAWs at all? The thing is that DAWs are different, and some let you explore deeper into MIDI or audio, or whatever [algorithmic processing?]. They're different. When you learn how to use Cubase in depth [and that takes A LOT OF TIME and reading the very HEFTY MANUAL] you can try all you want to find the particular function in any other DAW and will not be able to find it [logical edit, anyone?]. That's what I'm talking about. Things that make DAWs different. All DAWs can make basic things pretty much the same, but some excel at different things. Like, Cubase is just incredible at MIDI. Hell, no wonder since Steinberg made one of the first computer MIDI sequencers. I still remember using "Pro-24" on an Atari computer vividly. It was great! On the other hand, some DAWs like Reaper, for instance, are still only able to do MIDI basics. For some, that is enough, for some not. I use EnergyXT to kinda "circumvent" the Reaper's drawbacks. EnergyXT is incredibly powerful regarding MIDI. Incredibly.

However, I'm one of those weirdos that think you should be able to perform great first, and then be able to edit it, not the way most people do it today - program everything with the mouse... errr Learn how to play the bloody instrument first. Then most of the DAWs will be just fine for you.

etc.

[Uncle E]

"Power users" have a complete knowledge of one or two DAWs, and use it, not waste time learning a dozen of DAWs only superficially. That's what most of people do wrong these days not just regarding DAWs.

Yes and no. You're definitely right that a lot of the top mix engineers of the world will stick with what works no matter how out-of-date their equipment might seem to be. At the same time, you might be surprised at how many of them change up their hardware simply because they're looking for a change. Think about it, if you've been mixing 8-12 hours a day, 6 days a week, for the last 2-3 decades, it's sometimes nice to have a new toy to mix things up a bit (no pun intended).

Personally, I've been using Cubase for something like 15-20 years now and I enjoy switching over to Maschine and Studio One every once in a while. They don't do anything I couldn't do in Cubase, it's just the way they do it that's different. The most important thing is I no longer have a right to complain about missing features, I can just get to work.

[Uncle E]

I'm in the process of learning Logic Pro right now and I'm finding it very easy because of my familiarity with Sonar, PT, Studio One, etc.

Agreed. The first time I sat down with Logic 8, I immediately felt at home and began recording. No adjustment time necessary.

[cryophonik]

cryophonik... if you know how to do all the same things in all the DAWS, then what's the point in using different DAWs at all? The thing is that DAWs are different, and some let you explore deeper into MIDI or audio, or whatever [algorithmic processing?]. They're different.

Yeah, I agree that there are important distinctions between DAWs and e.g., each one handles certain tasks more elegantly than another does, which is one reason (among many) that I like to have several options at my disposal. My point was more that the core functionality of most DAWs is the same/similar such that the learning curve gets easier with each new DAW, so it's easier to dig deep into every DAW that I own. That said, I still use Sonar X2 for the majority of my own work, which is wide-ranging in style and uses about equal parts audio, soft synths, and hardware synths. When I'm working with other artists or when my own songs are primarily audio-based, I mostly use PT.

However, I'm one of those weirdos that think you should be able to perform great first, and then be able to edit it, not the way most people do it today - program everything with the mouse... errr Learn how to play the bloody instrument first. Then most of the DAWs will be just fine for you.

No disagreement here. I've been a musician for far, far longer than I've been a "producer" (hate that term for myself). But, unfortunately, the reality is that I often spend as much or more time fixing problems with people's performances than I do writing music.

...you might be surprised at how many of them change up their hardware simply because they're looking for a change. Think about it, if you've been mixing 8-12 hours a day, 6 days a week, for the last 2-3 decades, it's sometimes nice to have a new toy to mix things up a bit (no pun intended).

Personally, I've been using Cubase for something like 15-20 years now and I enjoy switching over to Maschine and Studio One every once in a while. They don't do anything I couldn't do in Cubase, it's just the way they do it that's different. The most important thing is I no longer have a right to complain about missing features, I can just get to work.

That's another one of the many reasons that I like working with several DAWs. Sometimes that change of scenery makes things more interesting, or even inspires some new ideas. And, often times it's more convenient (although usually not necessary) to collaborate with others when you use the same DAW.

The bottom line, though, is that there is no right or wrong. Some people prefer one DAW and are probably more productive with just one, while others are equally productive with more than one. Personally, I'm as productive now with multiple DAWs as I was when I was primarily a one-DAW user.

[Uncle E]

I'm willing to bet a lot of classic songs and great pieces of music have been as a result of compromise and workarounds.

Hink, a thought:

Just as compromise and workarounds can breed their own kind of creativity, can't also happy accidents? If so, are we more likely to come upon happy accidents if we're constantly trying new things and resisting being complacent with our tools? Again, I'm the guy who's been using Cubase for 15-20 years, I'm really pointing at myself when saying this and I can definitely see how my forays into Acid (the DAW ), BPM, iMaschine, and Maschine each sparked periods of me being clumsily prolific.

[Hink]

I'm willing to bet a lot of classic songs and great pieces of music have been as a result of compromise and workarounds.

Hink, a thought:

Just as compromise and workarounds can breed their own kind of creativity, can't also happy accidents? If so, are we more likely to come upon happy accidents if we're constantly trying new things and resisting being complacent with our tools? Again, I'm the guy who's been using Cubase for 15-20 years, I'm really pointing at myself when saying this and I can definitely see how my forays into Acid (the DAW ), BPM, iMaschine, and Maschine each sparked periods of me being clumsily prolific.

I absolutely agree, the problem begins when technology makes it too easy to skip over important steps of development. If one constantly spins around in circles doing the same thing over and over because it's all they know, they might get bored...YMMV but like I said, I'm glad I started out in the era I did because I feel I have a solid foundation to build on and enough of an understanding to keep me growing and following my passion...but that's just me

[Uncle E]

the problem begins when technology makes it too easy to skip over important steps of development. If one constantly spins around in circles doing the same thing over and over because it's all they know, they might get bored...YMMV but like I said, I'm glad I started out in the era I did because I feel I have a solid foundation to build on and enough of an understanding to keep me growing and following my passion...but that's just me

Agreed! I started with tape, too, from cassettes to Studers and Otari's to ADAT's. I don't ever want to splice tape again but boy did the experience teach me to appreciate what we have today.

[EvilDragon]

you can try all you want to find the particular function in any other DAW and will not be able to find it [logical edit, anyone?]

Well, MuLAB has it.

[liquid wind]

Renoise and FLS, I never use both on the same project but I like aspects of both enough to switch between them from time to time. I've also spent some time with other trackers like Modplug and Psycle but FLS is the only piano roll/clips DAW that has ever clicked with me at all

[hibidy]

How many guitar players have ONE guitar? Hmmmmmmmmm? Yeah, hosts......just like les pauls, you can't have too many!

[cryophonik]

How many guitar players have ONE guitar? Hmmmmmmmmm? Yeah, hosts......just like les pauls, you can't have too many!

Hmmmm...sounds like we need a "Your next DAW?" thread.