Hi guys, I've been making tracks for close to 5 years now and my style has gotten really good(well, at least I think so), but when it comes to mixing/mastering, I need some serious advice. I currently use VST synths, FL studio and a myriad of decent plugins. But I keep running into technical mastering/mixing problems. Is there someone who can explain how to make mix that won't sound horrible on my friend's monitors? Should I get monitors? I was thinking about a getting a low budget mixer and a sound card that outputs different tracks, slam on some near field monitors. I know I should probably invest in a keyboard and a fat rack, but I got a system will a crapload of ram and some serious cpu juice. Plus, I can't afford to deck out a mini studio, too much money for a recent college grad. What are your basic mixing techniques, is there a book that explains using FL plugins properly? Or mixing electronic music in general?
What I'm trying to do is eliminate all static and keep levels from peaking red. I use compressors on some of my fatter synths to keep them from chopping the red, but when I playback on a system with monitors, it sounds like a whinny horse with all this crap I can't even hear on my own system.
Check out 2 of my tracks and tell me if I'm a hopeless case.
http://music.download.com/gapaga/3600-8 ... 20574.html
I feel like I'm close, but it's these technical details that bite me in the ace. Is it possible to mix quality pro stuff with FL studio? Someone told me the software rendering of sounds makes it weaker compared to real hardware. Does anyone have samples they made with Fruity for some inspiration?
Thanks a bunch,
Best,
Gabe
[A S M]
http://www.aliensoundmachine.com
Help, I'm a trance nerd in need of serious advice!
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- The Teach
- 8273 posts since 23 Jul, 2002 from flatness
(moved from instruments to everything else)
slainte
rob
slainte
rob-
- Banned
- 6127 posts since 1 Apr, 2004 from Et in Arcadia Ego
Why is there like 3 identical posts from this guy?
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- The Teach
- 8273 posts since 23 Jul, 2002 from flatness
there isnt (any more) ...sickle666 wrote:Why is there like 3 identical posts from this guy?
slainte
rob-
- KVRist
- 110 posts since 12 May, 2004 from Canada
This might be helpful. The whole guide is good.
http://www.tweakheadz.com/mixing_in_the_sequencer.htm
http://www.tweakheadz.com/mixing_in_the_sequencer.htm
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- KVRian
- 574 posts since 6 Jan, 2003 from Somewhere between ))o Left and Right o((
When you don't like the way your mix sounds, set every volume slider to -oo, and all your eq's to 0 dB. Than go out for a smoke to calm down your ears.
Start with the kick and the bass (I say it's the mous important thing). Set a level of -6dB or so for the kick and the bass as they need to me the louder part of the music (ear is less sensitive to low frequencies). Add a compressor too (but keep the level down to have a headroom for other instruments). Sometimes i cut out very low frequencies with the eq, because they are useless and eat up the headroom.
It's important to eq the kick and bass to sound good. My advice is to add one instrument at a time and tweak the sound to sound the best. Eq each instrument separately using good monitors and a spectrum analyzer.
You can add reverb send effect but cut out freq < 1000 Hz because you don't want a reverb on the kick/bass right ?
Actually it's a lot of work and a lot of things to say. I'll let others to negate what i sayed.
Start with the kick and the bass (I say it's the mous important thing). Set a level of -6dB or so for the kick and the bass as they need to me the louder part of the music (ear is less sensitive to low frequencies). Add a compressor too (but keep the level down to have a headroom for other instruments). Sometimes i cut out very low frequencies with the eq, because they are useless and eat up the headroom.
It's important to eq the kick and bass to sound good. My advice is to add one instrument at a time and tweak the sound to sound the best. Eq each instrument separately using good monitors and a spectrum analyzer.
You can add reverb send effect but cut out freq < 1000 Hz because you don't want a reverb on the kick/bass right ?
Actually it's a lot of work and a lot of things to say. I'll let others to negate what i sayed.
Last edited by no_signal on Tue Jun 15, 2004 12:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRian
- 574 posts since 6 Jan, 2003 from Somewhere between ))o Left and Right o((
gapaga wrote:Does anyone have samples they made with Fruity for some inspiration?
http://www.aliensoundmachine.com
Last edited by no_signal on Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRAF
- 1718 posts since 3 Sep, 2003
Monitoring is crucial. Since good monitors are really expensive, the best way (according to me anyway) is to have: A) large-ish hi quality hifi speakers B) cheap nearfields and C) headphones and to continually alternate between them while mixing.
Also test the track with some really crap speakers, like computer speakers or a small radio.
You can make a pair a nearfield monitors pretty cheaply by getting a pair of koaxial car speakers and mounting them in a box.
Good quality large hifi speakers can be found for surprisningly little money if you look at auctions and stuff. You can find stuff that cost a fortune in the early 80's.
Also test the track with some really crap speakers, like computer speakers or a small radio.
You can make a pair a nearfield monitors pretty cheaply by getting a pair of koaxial car speakers and mounting them in a box.
Good quality large hifi speakers can be found for surprisningly little money if you look at auctions and stuff. You can find stuff that cost a fortune in the early 80's.
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- KVRer
- 12 posts since 12 Mar, 2002 from Reading
ummm. lots of stuff to cover:
BTW, can't listen to audio track as am at work, sorry, will do later, but here we go with advice for what it's worth:
1. Get some monitors. Anything half decent would do. Active better if you can afford it. You don't need to buy anything else, as you don't really need a mixer or mutliple out soundcard as you can mix everything from inside fruityloops.
2. What the ? is 'static' on your mix? - maybe it's distortion, in which case - you should turn every track down. Do this before you add any compression
3. The software rendering of sound will be a bit different from hardware as the hardware will put its own character in, but it doesn't stop you from doing pro mixes. People can do pro sounding mixes on any bit of software or hardware.
4. There are so many tips on mixing that it's too much to go into here. (I see there is a link to some tips in another reply anyway). For a bit of general advice though, make sure every part of your track has it's own space in the mix, especially in the bass area, otherwise it will sound muddy.
5. As you probably know, if you create a track and set it's level at 0db, then create another one also at 0db you will have an overal mix that is louder than 0db and will therefore be distorted / clipping. Keep your levels under control before you add a compressor.
6. Once you have your mix sorted, you can bump up the overall level and feel of the tracks by adding a good quality compressor / limiter as an insert over the main mix. I use UAD-1s Pultec EQ and Fairchild Compressor which sounds great (though not sure if it can be used in FL) but if you want a purely software alternative, you could use something like Waves UltraMaximizer or T-racks or PSP Vintage Warmer (which is prob the cheapest)
Hope this helps.
www.djalvarez.com
http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?songs=52717&T=1140
BTW, can't listen to audio track as am at work, sorry, will do later, but here we go with advice for what it's worth:
1. Get some monitors. Anything half decent would do. Active better if you can afford it. You don't need to buy anything else, as you don't really need a mixer or mutliple out soundcard as you can mix everything from inside fruityloops.
2. What the ? is 'static' on your mix? - maybe it's distortion, in which case - you should turn every track down. Do this before you add any compression
3. The software rendering of sound will be a bit different from hardware as the hardware will put its own character in, but it doesn't stop you from doing pro mixes. People can do pro sounding mixes on any bit of software or hardware.
4. There are so many tips on mixing that it's too much to go into here. (I see there is a link to some tips in another reply anyway). For a bit of general advice though, make sure every part of your track has it's own space in the mix, especially in the bass area, otherwise it will sound muddy.
5. As you probably know, if you create a track and set it's level at 0db, then create another one also at 0db you will have an overal mix that is louder than 0db and will therefore be distorted / clipping. Keep your levels under control before you add a compressor.
6. Once you have your mix sorted, you can bump up the overall level and feel of the tracks by adding a good quality compressor / limiter as an insert over the main mix. I use UAD-1s Pultec EQ and Fairchild Compressor which sounds great (though not sure if it can be used in FL) but if you want a purely software alternative, you could use something like Waves UltraMaximizer or T-racks or PSP Vintage Warmer (which is prob the cheapest)
Hope this helps.
www.djalvarez.com
http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?songs=52717&T=1140
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- KVRAF
- 2830 posts since 2 Mar, 2003 from The only civilized county in Texas
Advice #1: Trance is so 90s. Move on already.
Advice #2: yes, buy monitors.
Ok, so I'm listening on pretty simple headphones (I'm at work), and I don't like the sound of the drums on the first track. Not very smooth. In fact they sound phased or flanged. Is that conscious? Also, your pads seem to fill too much of the spectrum. Maybe whatever you're monitoring on sounds a bit thin so you miss how much energy you're throwing into the mix?
V.
Advice #2: yes, buy monitors.
Ok, so I'm listening on pretty simple headphones (I'm at work), and I don't like the sound of the drums on the first track. Not very smooth. In fact they sound phased or flanged. Is that conscious? Also, your pads seem to fill too much of the spectrum. Maybe whatever you're monitoring on sounds a bit thin so you miss how much energy you're throwing into the mix?
V.
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- KVRer
- 1 posts since 19 Aug, 2001 from Los Angeles
Since you say that you can hear all sorts of things on your friend's monitors that you can not on your own computer speakers, that leads me to believe that...
YOU NEED YOUR OWN MONITORS!
That would be the first thing. There have been some great tips so far on this page. Some more important things to note:
. Mixing is an additive process. That means adding more tracks will make your mix louder and it will eventually distort.
. Learn how to use an eq properly. For the most part, you should be cutting frequency with an eq, not adding. This can help more different sounds fit in the mix better as they are not taking up the same frequency range.
. Learn to use the compressor properly. The compressor can be used either on single tracks or on the entire mix.
Good luck.
YOU NEED YOUR OWN MONITORS!
That would be the first thing. There have been some great tips so far on this page. Some more important things to note:
. Mixing is an additive process. That means adding more tracks will make your mix louder and it will eventually distort.
. Learn how to use an eq properly. For the most part, you should be cutting frequency with an eq, not adding. This can help more different sounds fit in the mix better as they are not taking up the same frequency range.
. Learn to use the compressor properly. The compressor can be used either on single tracks or on the entire mix.
Good luck.
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- KVRAF
- 2217 posts since 15 Jul, 2003
one thing to add is the free tool Inspector can be very useful on the master out to check clips, peaks and rms levels and general spectrum mix
works well as a learning tool with selected tracks solo'd, muted, diabled/enabled as well to be able to 'see' what happens when eq is applied and instruments overlap and all that
but I agree in general it's more important to hear it so, some adequate set of speakers/headphones combination is essential.
I was incredibly disappointed when I heard my first mix come through my sound system, but about a dozen iterations later with advice from this forum, and using Inspector and a few choice tools, and I'm fairly happy with what I get now.
and yes I'm certain on ecan get good results using FLStudio. It's not th ehost, it's the user and the mix and the mastering tools.
works well as a learning tool with selected tracks solo'd, muted, diabled/enabled as well to be able to 'see' what happens when eq is applied and instruments overlap and all that
but I agree in general it's more important to hear it so, some adequate set of speakers/headphones combination is essential.
I was incredibly disappointed when I heard my first mix come through my sound system, but about a dozen iterations later with advice from this forum, and using Inspector and a few choice tools, and I'm fairly happy with what I get now.
and yes I'm certain on ecan get good results using FLStudio. It's not th ehost, it's the user and the mix and the mastering tools.
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- Banned
- 4073 posts since 15 Mar, 2004
Agreed. Bad monitors = bad sound.Pukeweed wrote:Monitoring is crucial. Since good monitors are really expensive, the best way (according to me anyway) is to have: A) large-ish hi quality hifi speakers B) cheap nearfields and C) headphones and to continually alternate between them while mixing.
Also test the track with some really crap speakers, like computer speakers or a small radio.
You can make a pair a nearfield monitors pretty cheaply by getting a pair of koaxial car speakers and mounting them in a box.
Good quality large hifi speakers can be found for surprisningly little money if you look at auctions and stuff. You can find stuff that cost a fortune in the early 80's.
H O W E V E R - having said that, I have used these on the fly (in hotel rooms at 03:00am) and they work incredibly well - especially if you can't afford decent loudspeakers:
Shure E2 'In-Ear' Phones
But eventually you need to get some good speakers. This way, you play the tunes to your friends - if you see various parts of their anatomy begin to gyrate along with the beat, you got it dicked... maybe...
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- KVRian
- 574 posts since 6 Jan, 2003 from Somewhere between ))o Left and Right o((
I Don't think so! I like trance music because the way it sounds, not because someone else likes it. I like to listen sometimes to the Armin Van Buuren 3-4 year old mixes. And "Boundries of Imagination" is better than any mix i can hear today...TennesseeVic wrote:Advice #1: Trance is so 90s. Move on already.
V.
Btw, did i mention I hate house music ? No ? I thought so...
And today's dance tracks are crap.
So what better harder-melodic music style do you suggest ?
Please don't feel offended man, nothing personal!
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- KVRAF
- 6519 posts since 13 Mar, 2002 from UK
No. You didn't have to.tranceinstitute wrote:Btw, did i mention I hate house music ?