Bitwig

Fleer · Post by **Fleer** » Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:31 pm

I'm back in. Thanks to Markussomething. Stepped out for a while 'cause I didn't want to combine Mainstage/Logic with another DAW. However, kept on feeling an itch. So I'm glad to be back. When I watched the Ableton video, I understood why I prefer Bitwig. I consider Bitwig to be the Logic Pro version of Ableton Live. It just feels right and inspires. And it's ideal to use with a Nektar Panorama, which is one of the finest controllers one can get. Also, I'm a sucker for eye candy as well and Bitwig beats Live even in that department.
Please add some AU support and I'll gladly stay

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:36 am

+1 on the nektar, I have a P6 and love it with BWS, can't wait for the update which I suspect will come with 1.2 mapped to all the new presets

Fleer · Post by **Fleer** » Fri Mar 06, 2015 6:38 am

Gogledd Cymru

Sjefke · Post by **Sjefke** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 5:20 pm

The one thing setting ableton above all other DAWs is M4L...

Reece's Pieces · Post by **Reece's Pieces** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 7:37 pm

Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!! COOL VID BRO.

Now add scroll zooming, or is that too hard for those 50 coders?

I honestly wouldn't think that many people would make so little progress, this isn't a pointlessly negative comment, it's an actual question to ponder.

Stop doing "Google Funweeks" and start going through REPEATEDLY requested features made by your PAYING costumers.

Christ.

adamlwatson · Post by **adamlwatson** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:47 pm

Fleer wrote: Please add some AU support and I'll gladly stay

Why let that little detail stop you? Get a copy of BlueCat's PatchWork, and you can have AUs in your BitWig project now, instead of waiting

sovietpop · Post by **sovietpop** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:53 pm

Seeing this video im glad i've chosen to support Bitwig.
Ableton just remind me where i use to work as a dev. Anyway thats just me

strovoknights · Post by **strovoknights** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:03 am

How many programmers in bitwig team?

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:15 am

I think 4 now? They just hired somebody.

Dearly Deported · Post by **Dearly Deported** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:48 pm

Sjefke wrote:The one thing setting ableton above all other DAWs is M4L...

Having to use a second, CPU heavy program just to access modular functions is ridiculous. Usine Hollyhock does it better, and I'm sure Bitwig will beat out M4L as well once V2 comes out.

M4L is just sloppy.

u-u-u · Post by **u-u-u** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:53 pm

Dearly Deported wrote:
Sjefke wrote:The one thing setting ableton above all other DAWs is M4L...
Having to use a second, CPU heavy program just to access modular functions is ridiculous. Usine Hollyhock does it better, and I'm sure Bitwig will beat out M4L as well once V2 comes out.

M4L is just sloppy.

How's version 7? (don't use it myself or consider doing it in future but this question just came to my mind

)

Dearly Deported · Post by **Dearly Deported** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 4:59 pm

u-u-u wrote:
Dearly Deported wrote:
Sjefke wrote:The one thing setting ableton above all other DAWs is M4L...
Having to use a second, CPU heavy program just to access modular functions is ridiculous. Usine Hollyhock does it better, and I'm sure Bitwig will beat out M4L as well once V2 comes out.

M4L is just sloppy.
How's version 7? (don't use it myself or consider doing it in future but this question just came to my mind )

6 was the last I touched.

maitake · Post by **maitake** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:17 pm

can you guys expand upon the reasons some people don't like max4live's implementation? preferably without any "m4l sux blahh".
probably the worst place to ask this question, but i'd like to know what perspectives the bitwig crowd has.

is it true that cycling 74 removed the ability to export VSTs when they made a deal with ableton? i only read a brief statement about it, but if that is true that seems quite a dirty thing to do. maybe it was unrelated to the ableton collaboration.

just how deeply integrated is m4l into ableton? what are it's limits? as mentioned above I forsee bitwig following the usine road as the DAW turns into a big modular environment itself.. proper!

adamlwatson · Post by **adamlwatson** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 3:44 pm

maitake wrote:can you guys expand upon the reasons some people don't like max4live's implementation? preferably without any "m4l sux blahh".
probably the worst place to ask this question, but i'd like to know what perspectives the bitwig crowd has.

I wonder the same thing. M4L and Max/MSP in general is an excellent toolkit. You can make anything you can think up with it, and the fact that it runs inside Live is pretty game-changing. I look forward to seeing how the Bitwig team implements the modular system in V2 as a comparison.

maitake wrote: is it true that cycling 74 removed the ability to export VSTs when they made a deal with ableton? i only read a brief statement about it, but if that is true that seems quite a dirty thing to do. maybe it was unrelated to the ableton collaboration.

It is true. C74 used to have a product called "Pluggo", which was essentially an interface to building your own VST plugins with Max. You could export the patch with the Pluggo runtime, then run it in any host. Shortly before announcing the Ableton partnership, Pluggo was discontinued.

It has since been replaced by "gen~", which is a way to run and export compiled code generated from a Max patch. Gen C++ code can be included in a plugin, but the process has a much steeper learning curve, and requires that you also know how to build a VST or AudioUnit plugin in addition to understanding both Max and the specifics of gen~. It's not easy—certainly not as easy as it was to create Pluggo plugins—and this is coming from a software engineer.

maitake wrote: just how deeply integrated is m4l into ableton? what are it's limits? as mentioned above I forsee bitwig following the usine road as the DAW turns into a big modular environment itself.. proper!

It's deeply integrated. There are a set of objects specifically for interacting with Live tracks, controls, clips and such. There are a few limitations (no sysex, for example) but you can build pretty much anything you can dream up, including the ability to control other external hardware (lights, video, etc) all from the Live set.

I agree with you, though... if Bitwig does this correctly, they will develop quite the impressive toolkit-within-a-DAW. Keep in mind that Max/MSP has had an *extremely* long time to mature. There are objects available for pretty much any kind of audio, cv, video, or data manipulation you can think of. There is also a mountain of documentation and working examples (literally drag-and-drop-functional-examples) which make it a deep and broad tool for any musician or audio/visual artist. It's also been extremely optimized over the years for great performance. So, Bitwig definitely has their work cut out for them in order to create something with as much depth and maturity as Max/MSP.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 4:22 pm

adamlwatson wrote:There are a set of objects specifically for interacting with Live tracks, controls, clips and such.

That's interesting. What I've seen of the bigwig modular system was just for creating and editing devices.

Thanks for the informative post.

Bitwig

KVR Audio

seems like Ableton going on the offense now