Chord changes in techno songs?

[lucypickle]

Just inquiring:

Do techno house songs normally have chord changes?
Or do they normally just have, for lack a better word-a musical phrase that runs through the whole song?

I know house/dance/disco songs usually have chord changes.

I'm just interested in learning more about this subject concerning "club" songs.

Because the songs I'm working on have no chord changes they are just in a certain key.

[camsr]

Unless you're playing monkey chords, an average chord in a western key is 4 notes. So from what you're saying you would only be playing these 4 notes the entire song? Hey for trance that might actually work, with a pedal bass, and some small melody that stays near the tonic.

That musical phrase DOES have chord changes in it, sometimes small progressions (which are hard to interpret as chord changes) or long drawn out progressions.

To answer your question, "Club" music definately has chord changes.

[lucypickle]

Then I guess my songs just have melody lines in the same key through out the whole song. No chords-just changes in the melody line.

Is this wrong?

I know these are silly questions but I'm trying to learn.

[Bonteburg]

oftentimes in techno it's more about clever intervals or triads rather than 'proper' chords, like having a C and E interval expecting you a C-major feel and an e-minor bassline giving you a complete gestalt switch of sorts. (when it kicks in)

Also try to find and match drum samples and filtering - it sometimes develops into a 'chordy' vibe, techno at it's best imo.

My advice as to chord progressions would be keep them as simple as possible. Too much song can ruin a techno track, again imo.

Marco

[lucypickle]

Thanks for chiming in guys.

My next question is how important or chord changes in songs?
The majority of hip hop(sample and synth based) seem to have no chords or chord progressions. Correct me if I'm wrong. I know there are no hard fast rules for song writing.

But rock/pop/disco/house do have chord changes.

comments

[deastman]

It sounds like you're on the right track. Techno songs generally don't have well-defined chord progressions. I'm sure that music theory experts (not me) could look at these songs and point out the obvious 1-5-1 structure of the overall song, but it isn't particularly useful to examine techno that way. Techno generally consists of a simple bassline, with various notes, noises, textures, effects, and rhythms coming in and out of the arrangement. Just stick to one key and you'll be fine.

[Reverse Engineer]

Joey Beltram - Forklift, (more or less) only has one note through the whole track...it's an amazing track.

[deastman]

In response to your second question...

At the risk of starting a flame war, I feel that hip hop barely counts as music. It is created by people who self-identify as "producers" rather than "musicians", and they make "beats" to rap over, rather than "songs". In *general*, they are making short loops which play with minimal variation for large portions of the song, so it isn't surprising that you don't find a whole lot of complex chord progressions. Again, this is a generalization, and there are plenty of exceptions to the rule.

Now, for "club", "dance" or electronic music in general, the rules vary quite a bit from one genre to the next. As a rule of thumb, you probably want to avoid overly complex chord progressions, or it will start to sound too much like an electronic version of prog-rock. Instead, complexity should come from the arrangement of textural elements in your songs. If that makes any sense.

[Reverse Engineer]

In response to your second question...

At the risk of starting a flame war, I feel that hip hop barely counts as music. It is created by people who self-identify as "producers" rather than "musicians", and they make "beats" to rap over, rather than "songs". In *general*, they are making short loops which play with minimal variation for large portions of the song, so it isn't surprising that you don't find a whole lot of complex chord progressions. Again, this is a generalization, and there are plenty of exceptions to the rule.

Talk about a generalisation (which you admit to, so why even go there?) based on complete and utter ignorance to a musical genre. Please, don't define hiphop (or any 'type' of music) based on clearchannel and mtv playlists.

[deastman]

Well, I did say at the risk of starting a flame war...

I don't listen to clearchannel stations or watch MTV, and I'm not utterly ignorant of the genre either. But you're certainly entitled to disagree with my admittedly sweeping generalization. Instead of just flaming me for it, how about helping lucypickle with a more accurate description of chord usage in hip hop?

[lucypickle]

Yeah thanks for weighing in guys. No need for a flame war. Both points/opinions are valid.

I produce/ think of myself as a musician when working on hip hop. This is where I started out.

But I'm trying to branch out now and learn other styles of music.
Learning chords & arrangements. I'm trying to push myself musically.
I love learning about music. blah blah blah

I'm just trying to wrap my head around a few things.

Thanks for the discussion!

[Music Engineer]

i'm not into hip-hop but i talked to quite a few hoppers and all of them told me, that hip-hop is mostly about the lyrics, not about the music. and i agree with them as, IMHO, many (not all, of course) hip-hop tracks consist just of the lyrics/rap plus some dreary loops. but as for techno/trance/electronic - i would say in these genres it is also not so much about the music, but here i see the sound-design as the most important part. in the ideal case, just a single note-struck on the keyboard should give the "YEAH - that sounds great" effect. and then some simple chord-changes (or none at all) will suffice.

[bduffy]

I'd say chord changes are important in House, or rather a main chord refrain is important; you'll very often have a rhodes or pad sample play a chord sequence that is the foundation or "hook" of the song. Maybe you will have an actual change at a break, but it's not necessary. Like everyone's been getting at: dance and hip hop are more about finding "that vibe" and just manipulating dynamics. Once you get into full-on chord changes, you're veering into pop territory, a la Kylie Minogue, where you'll want to grab some talent and lay down a proper vocal.

But, my god, there are no rules.

[Paul @ Micro]

I'd say there are no rules.
One note, or simple/ complex chords.
Whatever sounds best to you, not what you think you should be doing.

Very liberating, do anything you want.



Paul/ Microscopics

[snooky]

Just inquiring:

Do techno house songs normally have chord changes?
Or do they normally just have, for lack a better word-a musical phrase that runs through the whole song?

I know house/dance/disco songs usually have chord changes.

I'm just interested in learning more about this subject concerning "club" songs.

Because the songs I'm working on have no chord changes they are just in a certain key.

this question comes up now and again - AND IT'S A FUCKIN' STOOPID ONE.

techno is about experimentation, having one's own sound - don't fuckin ask if techno has chord changes...don't know how to make EDM? THEN DON'T! (simply becasue there are no rules to speak of)

have a nice day