KVR Audio

chicagodannyd · Post by **chicagodannyd** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:55 pm

I am currently planning my VST setup, which will include: Harmless VST, Sytrus, Synth 1, and Audjoo Helix. But I keep reading about some kind of a sound problem upon mixdown in FL studio. IS this true? I don't have a lot of patience for moving files around and reformatting to avoid a sound degradation problem caused by the DAW. Wha't the deal?

If there are any problems, I would just go to another sequencer and purchase Sytrus, and Harmless seperately and install them with another seq.

rifftrax · Post by **rifftrax** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:58 pm

It looks like you've been reading threads written by people who have no clue what they are talking about.

In other words, you have nothing to worry about. For fun, you could post where you found these brilliant internet genius' claiming such problems. We all need a good laugh now and then.

tibah · Post by **tibah** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:01 pm

FL Studio is as good as any other sequencer. Stick with it if you like it and dont worry about some dogmas floating around.

mauseoleum · Post by **mauseoleum** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:15 pm

I see no prob.

A tip: Plan your mix so that when you DISABLE ALL fx on your master channel, the PEAKS won't go over -3dB.

Use the limiter/waveshaper on channels only to "shave off" the unwanted peaks - to control the levels.

This way, your mix will still have dynamics, but won't have so much "runaway" peaks.

Only after that, when you have your mix in order, add limiter and maximus to the master channel and make it loud how you want.

BTW - if you are new to purchase, read here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 43#4220543

-------------------------------------------
Of course, if you don't have it already, you can purchase the FLS Signature bundle AND Harmless at once to save more.
.. or if you just prefer the code:
http://affiliate.image-line.com/HACEJC414

donkey tugger · Post by **donkey tugger** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:18 pm

I'd probably have a listen...

Music and that.

tony tony chopper · Post by **tony tony chopper** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:20 pm

But I keep reading about some kind of a sound problem upon mixdown in FL studio

The "problem" is that FL offers quality settings, it can tell a plugin that it's rendering, and thus the plugin can spend more CPU for better quality (better quality = closer to what the user is telling it to do = less CPU saving compromises). For some reason, some people believe that better quality should be inaudible (can something sound better, and exactly the same, at the same time? Scientists have found out that no, it can't).

So yes, *when you tell FL that you wanna render at a higher quality*, your rendered result can sound better/closer to what you want, thus different. But you can switch this off, it will then render as you hear. You can also record while playing.

Some people happen to like the aliasing produced by a synth in draft mode, and then complain that it "lost clarity" when rendered. We offer all options, realtime draft, realtime high quality, rendering draft, rendering high quality, if you know what you're doing there's no problem. In the end it's up to you to decide on the CPU vs quality tradeoff.

That's the common problem. Of course there are other levels in noobness, we've also been reported things like "rendering sucks, when I render an mp3 & put it on a CD, it sounds bad in my car's stereo". More generally it's about playing back through a media player with EQ on, etc.

chicagodannyd · Post by **chicagodannyd** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:21 pm

rifftrax wrote:It looks like you've been reading threads written by people who have no clue what they are talking about.

In other words, you have nothing to worry about. For fun, you could post where you found these brilliant internet genius' claiming such problems. We all need a good laugh now and then.

Here's the thread I was reading:http://www.futureproducers.com/forums/s ... hp?t=98457

rifftrax · Post by **rifftrax** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:35 pm

chicagodannyd wrote:
rifftrax wrote:It looks like you've been reading threads written by people who have no clue what they are talking about.

In other words, you have nothing to worry about. For fun, you could post where you found these brilliant internet genius' claiming such problems. We all need a good laugh now and then.
Here's the thread I was reading:http://www.futureproducers.com/forums/s ... hp?t=98457

Wow, some of the people in that thread are really scaping the bottom of the barrel of intellect.

Every other post is pretty hilarious. "the problem with your rendered wave may be the soundcard you are using. If you don't doesn't have an ASIO standard card, you will get a reduction in quality"

awesome

wait, wait - here's another gem:

"yeah i find that fruity puts its own unwannted compression on mixdown as well as playback. There is a loss of quality when producing in fruity and it ****s me to tears.

Soundcard plays a massive role aswell, on mixdown it runs through the card as using a ****ty card can pick up low level noise. They wouldnt make those high end soundcard modules such as the echo gina 3g and all those for fun, these cards are built so there is zero noise and maintain crispness. Plus you will never get real crisp quality without using hardware snyths, if your just using softsynths for it all and ripped samples then you'l never be able to make industry quality tracks as alot of the softsynths if you listen closely generate noise along with the sound.

I also agree about the mathematical algorithms, without the top mathematical equations and what not, then the sound is doomed, hence the low price of flstudio compared to programs such as sonar etc."

these are classics

I couldn't even begin to decipher the utter 'wrongness' in that last one...

GeorgeZ · Post by **GeorgeZ** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:56 pm

chicagodannyd, the guys in that thread were born with their heads up their asses... they don't know their ass from their elbows...

Man, why do noobies always fall for the idiot's point of view / unfounded opinion? I can explain why 99% of those comments are utter bullcrap, but I'm not gonna bother. Just trust me, those guys don't know shit.

One note, a sound card plays sound, it doesn't render it (on playback). You can run FL (or ANY other audio application virtually) WITHOUT A SOUNDCARD and it'll still render the same and work the same (...not talking about recording or anything else).

VSTJuNkiE · Post by **VSTJuNkiE** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 7:19 pm

FL Studio sounds at least 32.8% better than every DAW out there......

STML · Post by **STML** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 7:35 pm

Wow, that linked thread is classic.

I don't use FL, and haven't played around with it since like FL1, but I know people who use it and get perfectly good results out of it. I think its more about learning to mix properly than anything else. Use 24 bits and leave lots of headroom. You don't need to peak higher than -6dbfs on the master. If you want it louder turn your speakers up (at least until you learn about K-metering). This alone will solve most "quality" arguments people put up about most products. After you are done mixing, mastering is something else you will need to research to get mixes up to "commercial levels", but I'll leave that to you.

sorohanro · Post by **sorohanro** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 7:51 pm

Actually, there is a problem with sound quality in FL.

First, I want to say, I'm a big fan of FL and had most of the versions starting with Fruity Loops 2.4. Was love at first sight, but I always noticed a quality difference between the FL and the "crispiness" of ReBirth.

Time passed... worked with a lot of programs in different studios and FL got a ReWire option. That was the moment when I noticed that there is a difference between a Reason file exported from Reason or same file exported through FL, even with no effects and all knobs/sliders to default position.

Two years ago I was still the biggest fan of FL but made a test, exported same midi file played by same VSTi with FL at maximum quality settings and then with other (Mu.Lab). No additional effects, no nothing.
The file exported with Mu.Lab sounded better and more clear.

deleted · Post by **deleted** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 7:58 pm

DELETED

Kriminal · Post by **Kriminal** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:07 pm

...without the top mathematical equations and what not, then the sound is doomed, hence the low price of flstudio compared to programs such as sonar etc.

..and what not....i like that

sorohanro · Post by **sorohanro** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:12 pm

michi_mak wrote:
sorohanro wrote:...Actually, there is a problem with sound quality in FL...
did you read / understand tony tony choppers post ?

Yep. Read and what he say it's very logical and figured myself years ago.
Tried myself several settings, same result

Again, I say. I'm a fan of FL. FL is probably the easiest program to work with midi, edit everything, all the tools are exactly where you think they should be.

Yet, there are some problems with sound

Is there a sound problem on mixdown with FL Studio or not?