BIG FAT disclaimer: this has become quite a bit of text - for the impatient, the heart of the matter is in bold at the end

Right, here it goes. I've been working in Logic for 10+ years, but recently demoed Live and immediately fell in love with it's workflow. It so easy and intuitive to get ideas down and try different variations of clips in the session view. I had my mind made up, I would get Live, especially with the current sale (and I still have a 30 euro coupon), this was the time.
Only thing that left me scratching my head was whether to go for the Standard or Suite edition. In the end, you get an awful lot for that extra 150 euros, so Suite it would be.

But…. In the time deciding whether to go Suite or not, I tested Live some more, compared it to Logic and… I'm in serious doubt. Yes, the workflow of getting ideas in the system is vastly better, but is it just me or is the workflow of the mixer so much worse that it almost nullifies the benefits?
Sure, Live's routing is much more versatile, but it's just quicker in Logic. Example, in Live, I have to select a channel to see what instruments and inserts are there. There's no way to have an overview as in Logic. Therefor, any instrument or effect in Logic is only one click away, in Live it's at least two. Then there's the representation of VST/AU's, it's a big fat XY pad that I never ever intend to use and just takes up much needed screen estate. Worse, to actually open a plugin, there's this minuscule button, as if the action will only rarely be executed.
Other example, an instrument with multiple outputs. In Logic, select instrument in track, track gets a + symbol, click it to get an extra channel which represents another output of that instrument. Live on the other hand, create channel with instrument, create other audio track, select the instrument from the dropdown, then select audio channel from that instrument.

It's almost as if, in their venture to do away with the old, Ableton decided than everything had to be different in Live, for better or worse. For earlier versions, that would be understandable and applaudable, but we're almost at 9 now, you'd think they would have ironed this out by now.

Please understand, I do think that Live is a great product, and this is in no way intended to have a stab at Live. It's just that it made me seriously reconsider my intention to move over to Live. Any advice (maybe I'm just not that familiar with Live yet) would be appreciated. Although I see that these decisions may vary from person to person. But I'm just so torn right now that maybe, maybe, someone could shed a different light to this matter.

Live's supernice clip workflow, or Logic's nicer (to me) audio workflow?

FWIW, most of what I do is producing electronic/loopbased stuff without live recording (or live performing for that matter )

You can always arrange in Live and mix in Logic. That is, use the Session View to manipulate ideas, maybe get to a full arrangement and then dump stems to Logic.

Having said that, the routing possibilities together with the racks make Live very powerful for audio manipulation. The trouble is that it works quite differently to Logic, and so takes some getting used to. I have flat-forehead moments thinking how to do something in Live and then realising there's a way easier way to do it simply by messing with the channel routing (a prime example is getting the kick drum audio out of a drum rack for special processing - it's not immediately obvious how to do it, but it's possible).

The upshot: as with Logic there is a learning curve and it is frustrating at first.

The other thing is that, as of Live 8, MIDI editing is rubbish and you don't have curvy fades even now (although this should change with v9).

That's it.

Sequence/ arrange in live, export and mix in logic.

I personally mix in pro tools 9, but have logic 9 (unused)

Thanks for your comments, it's really appreciated!

For the moment, I'll still try to keep it to one (active) DAW. It's more of a hobby for me, the last step of mixing in Logic would be overkill. Plus, there are many inserts that shape the sound in such a way that it's an integral part of arranging for me. Once that's done, the step to mixing is fairly small (as are my standards in mixing )
I didn't really consider the learning curve , but yes, you're right, it will take time to get used to the Live workflow. Hmmm, I will sleep another night over it before I pull my credit card.

Another big draw to Live which I keep on forgetting is M4L (included in 9), which will allow me to use stepsequencers and the likes.

Hi BDeep - we are in the same shoes ...
I did the same, demoed Live and liked many things.
But my main DAW is REAPER and won't change it or extend it with anozther, because Live has disadvantages too.

I HAVE THE "CRAZY" idea to use one daw only, and I advise you the same.
Stay with your main daw, where you can create everything as i stay with reaper.
Master your 1 daw and know everything bout it!
If you have 2 daw, you can't track all of their changes...

Thanks, but the big advantage over Logic is that Live inspired me to do something, I get stuck in Logic relatively quickly with ideas. Logic wants you to make progression in a song, laying out the structure as you go. It's the bit that I'm frankly, not very good at. I just like to add different loops, and exchange them for others, before I even begin to think about a song structure. Live encourages this behavior by design.
It's for that reason that I want to switch. If it works as I envision, than that's priceless. I am worried however that I get stuck on other stuff, like the mixer issues I outlined.

Besides, I know Logic quite well, time for a change

I would say switch and don't look back within two weeks at the most you'll be comfortable in ol'Abez I would suggest mixing in Logic if you don't use third party plugins though, at least until Live 9 comes out.

Use both! Rewire live and logic for the best of both worlds!

Thanks guys. Yep, I can always decide to Rewire or export stems should I feel the need. Somehow I don't fancy that idea though, seems like adding a layer of complexity. On the other hand, what's the use of being able to mix flawlessly if the idea's dry down so fast? I'll just go for it.

Nice theory, practically live does not run 3rd party plugins as rewire slave.

I use both Live and Logic; they really are complementary. If you must choose one, and composition is your focus, then I recommend Live. Session view rules, especially combined with TouchAble on an iPad or an APC40. Honestly, I can't wait for Push.

Push is nice, but way to expensive for my needs (but yeah, very very nice... Hmmmm). Anyway, since I have an iPad, I will get TouchAble, seems like a really nice app. Maybe Lemur as well, as soon as Live 9 has been released.

I don't use Logic, but Studio One and Live and honestly I love Live and just upgraded to Suite and it is my primary, but I think that for different things it is good to have a linear host you are very comfortable with when you are needing that. You don't always have to export stems, you don't always have to rewire, you don't need both hosts for every project, but I'd say Live is a wonderful addition on its own even if you have a favorite linear host for most things. In 9 for example, you could take your linear-produced track stems from Logic and go the other way, importing to Live's arrangement view, using the new feature to convert selected regions into scenes, and easily have a 'playable' version of your song for further mixing and live use without relying on creating the content even within Live. You could then rewire back into Logic for final mixdown. Anyhow, I think Live is the bee's knees and everyone should have at least a lite version. It's just too cool.

If you rewire Ableton Live to Logic, why would you need 3rd party plugins in Live?

I think rewiring Live to Logic is a good solution, and allows you to get the benefits of both worlds. Ableton Live rewires well with Logic, Cubase, and Pro Tools.

Good video re: Zombie Disco Squad using Ableton Live rewired with Cubase. Setup would be virtually the same with Logic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdvcyzSLHJc

BOTH!