Rebuilding Make Noise Strega in the grid?

[esq1]

Hello everyone, I am very enthusiastic about effeckt devices like this one, which invites to manipulate audio signals in real time and builds deep dark ambient walls. Do you have an idea how to rebuild the Make Noise Strega Synth in the grid? Or have any of you already done something like this? Life certainly does this because the effect is achieved by manipulating the buttons, so it is created in the jam.

https://www.makenoisemusic.com/synthesizers/strega

Any ideas?

[Tj Shredder]

Its completely unclear what it is doing. They use terms in a context where I don't know what they mean with it (Tonic). And of course its a controller with touch pads ala crackle box.
To rebuild it you would need one to analyse. But if you have one I bet you wouldn't bother to replicate it and instead play around for hours and hours... Unless you aren't into those noises, but then you wouldn't replicate it either...

But to get into this kind of sound world and just remembering the Strega examples, I bet you can build something in the Grid which is different, but yours...

[foosnark]

The basics of a Strega:

- audio input with envelope follower.
- triangle-core analog oscillator
- a bizarre sub output with an interesting spiky shape (used for modulation rather than audio unless you patch it to the input)
- waveshaper with multiple things going on, it's quite unique and hard to describe.
- lo-fi crunchy delay -- almost certainly based on the PT2399 -- and a lowpass filter with a wet/dry control in the delay's feedback loop.
- sort-of trapezoidal LFO modulation source
- multiple feedback paths for modulation of the oscillator pitch, oscillator level, and delay time, on both knobs and touchplates. Some of the touchplate outputs are different divisions of the oscillator, others are feedback from the delay output processed in some additional way. (None of the touchplates are actually explained in the manual.)

You could never nail the character of this thing in Bitwig Grid.

Someone like Plogue with mad DSP and reverse engineering skills could probably do it in a plugin if they dedicated enough effort to it, but how much effort that would be is the question. So far I don't know of any emulations of a PT2399 in software, and certainly I haven't heard anything that sounds like them. (And this isn't some connoisseur BS on my part -- it's a cheap, shitty chip, it just has a very characteristic way of failing and generating noise when the clock rate is too low, among other things.) And I suspect all the weird feedback connections are also a pain to model, and then how do you reasonably and usefully emulate those touchplates? The weather and your skin conductivity can affect how those behave...

Anyway, you could certainly build Grid patches inspired by the Strega -- it might not sound like the real thing but it could potentially be cool anyway.

[esq1]

More and more I think I spend the money for the strega. First I think ohhh man 600 bugs.. But it seems to worth the money. The live comes with the hands on. On the weakend I do made some simple feedback delay loops in bitwig the grid but it is not the same...
Thanks a lot for your answers

[j wazza]

you could probably get pretty close with softube modular

[Tj Shredder]

you could probably get pretty close with softube modular

Only if it would have a Strega module… Or you face exactly the same problems as in the Grid… And you would still miss the way to control it…

[j wazza]

you could probably get pretty close with softube modular

Only if it would have a Strega module… Or you face exactly the same problems as in the Grid… And you would still miss the way to control it…

not sure what you mean, grid and modular are capable of doing the stuff in this list, main issue i can see is that grid would sound too digital but softube modular wouldnt have that problem, you wont be able to get the exact waveforms and sound but you could get close with softube

- audio input with envelope follower.
- triangle-core analog oscillator
- a bizarre sub output with an interesting spiky shape (used for modulation rather than audio unless you patch it to the input)
- waveshaper
- lo-fi crunchy delay
- sort-of trapezoidal LFO modulation source
- multiple feedback paths for modulation

[foosnark]

I don't think Softube has any advantages over Bitwig Grid in imitating Strega.

The first hurdle is a delay that sounds like a PT2399. Softube doesn't have it (and to be fair, nobody else does either). From the demos I've heard, even their Doepfer BBD only sort of sounds like the hardware it's trying to imitate IMHO.

[j wazza]

I don't think Softube has any advantages over Bitwig Grid in imitating Strega.

The first hurdle is a delay that sounds like a PT2399. Softube doesn't have it (and to be fair, nobody else does either). From the demos I've heard, even their Doepfer BBD only sort of sounds like the hardware it's trying to imitate IMHO.

the strega is analog so any analog modelled modular will sound closer than the grid, and softube and pretty much any other modular just sounds better than the grid, i still love the grid though, but especially for stuff like delay modulation and modulation feedback loops it doesnt sound great, at least having analog modelled feedback modulation will get you a bit closer, if you dont want to pay 600 for the real thing you might need to settle for getting close enough or good enough, if you cant get an exact model of the gear you may need to use models of other gear, which will still be closer than pure digital

[esq1]

I don't think Softube has any advantages over Bitwig Grid in imitating Strega.

The first hurdle is a delay that sounds like a PT2399. Softube doesn't have it (and to be fair, nobody else does either). From the demos I've heard, even their Doepfer BBD only sort of sounds like the hardware it's trying to imitate IMHO.

the strega is analog so any analog modelled modular will sound closer than the grid, and softube and pretty much any other modular just sounds better than the grid, i still love the grid though, but especially for stuff like delay modulation and modulation feedback loops it doesnt sound great, at least having analog modelled feedback modulation will get you a bit closer, if you dont want to pay 600 for the real thing you might need to settle for getting close enough or good enough, if you cant get an exact model of the gear you may need to use models of other gear, which will still be closer than pure digital

In Mai we have the superbooth near my hometown. I take a visit to make noise and have a look to the strega.
Both worlds are great for me. The grid is a fine experimenting field what sounds difrent in his own way. But from time to time I lost my self in building new thinks in bitwig. So a real instrument focus myself to what I do.
But yeah.. If I hear a "real" analog synthesizer all my internal sounds and plugins have not the same vibe. That's the same I feel with my first experiments in the grid it sounds like that but the little extra feel I miss.
There are two lovely difrent worlds.

Thanks a lot.. I feel this as a nice conservation.. And sorry for my rough English

[Tj Shredder]

the strega is analog so any analog modelled modular will sound closer than the grid, and softube and pretty much any other modular just sounds better than the grid…

You didn‘t listen to the Strega demo videos obviously… There is nothing in the sound which is even close to the usual association of an analog sound. It isn‘t at all about sounding „better than“. It is about a certain expression with sound.
It is so much more about controlling sound by touching hardware than just the sound. So far, that it even doesn‘t make sense to emulate it…

[j wazza]

You didn‘t listen to the Strega demo videos obviously… There is nothing in the sound which is even close to the usual association of an analog sound.

i did, it sounds like analog, it is analog, all analog obviously sounds like analog, not that it all sounds the same, but analog all sounds different from digital in a particular way, strega sounds weird just because of its strange setup which could be replicated, im not saying it would sound the same, just saying an analog modelled plugin would get closer than a digital one, not sure how that makes it obvious to you that i didnt listen to it

It is so much more about controlling sound by touching hardware than just the sound. So far, that it even doesn‘t make sense to emulate it…

so its not worth emulating any hardware ever?

[esq1]

Hmmm... I do have bitwig on a surface with touchscreen. I'm more a beginner in the grid like urs here in the forum.
At the weakend (if the sun do not shine ) I will take a look how it feels to tweak on the surface.

Chapeau! MAKE NOISE for your never ending ideas... Verry cool stuff

[foosnark]

the strega is analog so any analog modelled modular will sound closer than the grid, and softube and pretty much any other modular just sounds better than the grid

The delay in Strega, which is a large part of its characteristic sound, is digital. It does have analog parts in the feedback loop as is typical for PT delays.

People make way too much of the analog vs digital thing in general anyway. Which sounds more like a real SH-101: a TB-303 or an SH01A? A Buchla or LuSH-101? Obviously it's not just "the ones that are analog."

Neither Grid nor Softube are going to sound like Strega -- but hey, feel free to set it up and post a video proving me wrong, I'll be both surprised and impressed. Of course, it also won't play like Strega without some analog controller hardware anyway...

[j wazza]

the strega is analog so any analog modelled modular will sound closer than the grid, and softube and pretty much any other modular just sounds better than the grid

The delay in Strega, which is a large part of its characteristic sound, is digital. It does have analog parts in the feedback loop as is typical for PT delays.

People make way too much of the analog vs digital thing in general anyway. Which sounds more like a real SH-101: a TB-303 or an SH01A? A Buchla or LuSH-101? Obviously it's not just "the ones that are analog."

Neither Grid nor Softube are going to sound like Strega -- but hey, feel free to set it up and post a video proving me wrong, I'll be both surprised and impressed. Of course, it also won't play like Strega without some analog controller hardware anyway...

the delay is similar to a bbd which is in modular and yeah as you said it has analog parts

those are analog modelled synths that will sound at least slightly closer to any analog synth than bitwig's grid or any purely digital synth, and a real analog synth will also sound closer to any other analog synth than the grid or a purely digital synth

TB-303, SH01A, Buchla and LuSH-101 will all sound closer to each other and a real sh 101 and any other real analog and decent analog modelled synth than the grid would, thats the point im making

i already said not all analog sounds the same so wasnt claiming they do sound the same as you seemed to interpret it, 'sounds closer than digital' doesn't mean 'sounds the same or sounds closer than other analog/analog modelled synths'

im really not making an extreme point here in saying analog or analog modelled sounds more like other analog than pure digital, you guys are making quite extreme points in disagreeing with that, but i think you think im saying something else that i havent said and youre disagreeing with that