Install Pack: VSTs you consider essential - any payware?

[indigocat]

I'm sure there's a similar topic somewhere (though I didn't find it) about which VST's you consider an essential part of your setup, foundation instruments for your music, and also, whether you would actually pay for any machines? Bearing in mind in my case that I am using FL studio which comes with some pretty good stuff, you may be using a different DAW.

Since I'm on my work machine at the moment I can only partly answer this question myself. The only paywares I'd get would be first, ALL the machines by H.G. Fortune - but the freeware versions he has on his site are as useful (and the paywares are cheap). I just think you can't beat the warm beauty of his sounds. Probably the only payware I would shell out for would be N.I.Absynth, and I had spare $$, NI Massive and Image-Line Morphine and maybe Poizone, and ImPOScar. But the best freewares can do anything the paywares do.

Then freeware - as I say I'm not on my home machine, but Rez, Green Oak Crystal, Toda Synth 1, and Dante to start. Then I'd want something for guitars and plucked instruments - DSK Electric Guitarz, Acoustic Guitarz, World Stringz, Asian Dreamz. Then also DSK Oranze and a few DSK others, like his Sax rompler which gives better sound than paywares costing $$$100's. Something for keyboards, probably Richman. Something for bells and tinkles, there is a Japanese synth I've forgotten the name of. Xoxo's FX machine. To start off with.

I think people over-rate the old analogue synths in memory. The early Korgs were pretty thin, and I've recently been playing with some '70's-'80's machines, they are not all that great. I get fatter sounds from the softsynths on my machine. I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have an old J4, but not from the sound Point-of-View. What do you think?

[eduardo_b]

I think people over-rate the old analogue synths in memory. The early Korgs were pretty thin, and I've recently been playing with some '70's-'80's machines, they are not all that great. I get fatter sounds from the softsynths on my machine. I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have an old J4, but not from the sound Point-of-View. What do you think?

Some here who have used these early synths seem to insist that no software emulation comes close, so clearly there's a great difference in reactions to the entire issue of hardware as opposed to software. I think the differences only matter to purists, and everyone else simply gets on with using what they have.

[ozmoz2008]

I think people over-rate the old analogue synths in memory. The early Korgs were pretty thin, and I've recently been playing with some '70's-'80's machines, they are not all that great. I get fatter sounds from the softsynths on my machine. I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have an old J4, but not from the sound Point-of-View. What do you think?

I agree with you...there seems to be people wanting to protect their habits by lying about quality...I've work over 20years with the old hardware synth...and I find that is total BS to say that they sound better...If you like hiss...maybe but not for the quality of the sounds in itself...You can find sounds that are as good on VSTs....it's only matters of what you'll do with them...your imagination is the most important part...

Hardware or software...there is good and bad sounding productions out there in both ....maybe a little more in the software world because it is now more accessible...but if the same talented people that can work with the hardware synths work with the software synth....there is absolutely no difference what so ever as for sound quality! That's a plain fact

[indigocat]

Well, I rented a Moog 12 when they first came out (it was the only one in New Zealand - the New Zealand Broadcasting Corporation contacted me halfway during the rental trying to hire it from me - I said "Yes, but I come with it") and that had quite a fat sound, so I was really disappointed when I first used the new Korg MS-20, I thought it was very thin indeed. Last night I was playing with a Yamaha CS-50, more like a toy really, when I got home I was comparing the sound of Dante and Dragon Pro VST's and thought "well, these shit all over the CS-50". I think what people mean is that the imperfections in the circuitry of those machines gave them a more organic quality than today's softsynths, I would go along with that. But I agree, you use what you have.

[D.Wako]

Anyone tried to add nebula EQs and stuff on SW synth to give it warmth? is this even a good idea?

[aciddose]

you just need to keep in mind two things:

1) before 1980 there was no such thing as "fat" sounds, nor were they desireable.
2) most syntheists treat synthesizers like instruments and find specific characteristics of these instruments highly desireable.. like the feel of the neck on a guitar, the feel of a keyboard or the particular performance of a envelope is quite important when you're playing the instrument.

(note another thing.. it doesn't need to make you a million dollars, create a hit track or even impress a single person. it simply needs to be enjoyable while you, YOU, one person is playing the instrument. if another person doesn't feel the same way, that's just fine because that isn't the point. personally i sort of hate the junos, jupiters, prophet, moogs and heaps of other synthesizers while a lot of people love them. that's because we have a difference of taste, plain and simple. for people who want 'fat' trance sounds, you need to stay about 1000 miles away from any analog synthesizer.)

[shanecgriffo]

i tried the mooged lowpass setting with something else (cant remember what- maybe an eq or preamp setting) after or before it (cant remember which, sorry) and it sounded very good on a lot of software synths.... it was a while ago now, might try it again.

[ew]

I'm sure there's a similar topic somewhere (though I didn't find it) about which VST's you consider an essential part of your setup, foundation instruments for your music, and also, whether you would actually pay for any machines?

I have very little on my machine that isn't payware. The essentials for what I do? Reaktor and Absynth are used on 95% of everything I've done in the last seven years. Kore's been an essential in my setup since before the initial release of v1, and with v2 it's been even more so. The rest vary from day to day- I could probably get by on those three alone, but as long as I don't have to...

But the best freewares can do anything the paywares do.

Ah- no, they can't. Show me the freeware that comes close to Alchemy, for example- I'm waiting...

There is some amazing freeware; no doubt about it. The Krakli synths, HGFortune's free stuff, Crystal, Ugo's stuff, Xoxos' concoctions- instruments like those make music making affordable, and they sound good. However, I've yet to find an Absynth replacement as freeware (and no- Crystal or some of the HGFortune synths aren't a replacement to my ears), and while there's some good SE synths and I admire the people who can build good synths with it (every time I've worked with SE, my synths have come out sounding like garbage), I've yet to find a SE synth to match any of my favorite Reaktor ensembles.

I think people over-rate the old analogue synths in memory. The early Korgs were pretty thin, and I've recently been playing with some '70's-'80's machines, they are not all that great. I get fatter sounds from the softsynths on my machine. I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have an old J4, but not from the sound Point-of-View. What do you think?

True to a point. The thing that makes the really great analogs stand out are the imperfections; for example, take my old Oberheim Four-Voice. There's no way that you could program the voices to sound exactly the same, and you also had all the little instabilities happening with each voice as well. And while I can get really close with Reaktor by inserting miniscule random fluctuations into the fairly good Four-Voice emu that Josue Arias did way back when for R 2.3/R3, it still sounds a little flat in comparison. But that's an exception to the rule- for the most part, 99% of the people aren't going to be able to tell once you've run your old analog through an A/D converter and recorded it into your host of choice.

ew

[jplanet]

I guess the essential VSTi's for me are telling of the genre I usually compose - Synthogy Ivory, NI B4, M-Tron, Minimonsta, Lounge Lizard.

[indigocat]

Yes, that's interesting, Camel. Certainly, if I was looking for a replacement for Absynth, Crystal and the HG Fortune machines would be the first place I would look, so we are of one mind there, and Yes they wouldn't replace Absynth. I don't know Alchemy and haven't used Reaktor, but again, Massive is...well...massive. Big sound. And Albino and imPOScar are nice, very nice...

But I could as well say the opposite, no? I haven't seen any payware that can do what DSK's Romplers do so well. And there are a lot of other quirky machines out there that do their own thing. Someone said (in the deep past) that ninety percent of electronic music sounded like water going down the plughole (perhaps Dripsody by Hugh le Caine was a retort). I find that ninety percent of freesynths either go buzz buzz or whoop whoop whoop. But so do ninety percent of paysynths. It's the ten percent that make the difference. There are certainly a lot of payware synths out there going for $100-$300 that I would cheerfully throw in the rubbish-tin for a copy of Synth 1 or Dreamstation.

Most SynthEdit machines sound to me somewhat cold and metallic, but there are a great many exceptions, especially where people have created custom modules. From memory the Kriminal and Killerz and Osiris syths were created in Synthedit and those are fine machines. I have to admit here to a red face, because I know bugger-all about FX and mastering, but I'm inclined to think that Yes, once you had run them through a tube emulator, no-one could tell the difference.

I think the discussion about Analogue machines is a bit of a red herring, 'though I was hoping for a fairly rambly thread. Though we may not have used the term Phat in 1972, we were certainly looking for some bulk for a lead (am I the only person who thinks that Dik Mik was one of the best synth colourists ever?). Certainly when the first digisynths, such as the Kawais came out, the people I knew were a bit frustrated and missed the hands-on control ofered by analogue knobs. But now you can get that on any Midi controller.

[indigocat]

Oooh I dunno those jplanet, and I love prog (Crimson Rules!). Do you have any lynx?

[glokraw]

Ive come to the conclusion that if we held a competition, and the 10 best sound designers
here were each paired with one of the 10 best musicians here, and each pair were randomly assigned 5 payware synths from the top 100, and could choose any 5 freeware synths,
and any 2 hardware devices, to make a song competing for the grand prize, that at the end
of the week, there would be 19 dead guys, and a Buy-It-Now sale on ebay.

[indigocat]

Oh OK Jplanet, what we have there are paywares: an acoustic piano emulator, a mellotron emulator,a minimogue emulator, and an electric piano emulator. I have freewares that will do all of that, however if you are recording you may well be needing and getting a much better quality. For the Mellotron I am using Mellosoftron, which ceratinly has limitations.

[Caleb]

I must admit - the plugs I put in my essentials pool are all payware - although not terribly expensive.

Wusikstation, ManyGuitar, ManyBass, LiveSlice, pretty much anything Guido puts together and ST2 with SS2 and Miro Philharmonik loaded. I'm mainly sample-based and if I want to go synth, I'm usually using Wusikstation for it.

Ironhead and MTheory provide less used but still intruiging additional options.

I do have some freebies that I like eg. Oatmeal, XHip - but I don't actually USE them very often. I just like them.

I use freeware VST alot more in the effects/midi department with very few payware plugs being used - CSR, Tunguska, Dualism and Metallurgy being the notable exceptions. Limiters, compressors, chorus, flangers, delays, EQs etc.. I tend to use freeware or host-included. I even have freeware reverbs in case I don't want to use the more full-on CSR.

I think these days I tend to limit the amount I buy or even try in terms of new instruments. I don't even road test anything really these days unless it really does look like something essential to me which is pretty rare.

It got to the stage where I decided that although it was very nice that a new instrument or effect was coming out every day whether freeware or payware I didn't NEED them to continue putting things together. Thank God I made that decision or otherwise I'd never get anything done - oh hang on - wait a minute - I don't get anything done anyway. Nevermind.

The area where I still tend to stuff around and road test is actually the hosts themselves. I'm less content with the hosts I use than the instruments I put in them - but that's another thread.

Regards
Caleb

[tomg]

I think people over-rate the old analogue synths in memory. The early Korgs were pretty thin, and I've recently been playing with some '70's-'80's machines, they are not all that great. I get fatter sounds from the softsynths on my machine. I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have an old J4, but not from the sound Point-of-View. What do you think?

I think people that don't know what they are talking about should do less talking. You don't have a clue or you wouldn't be looking for one. I would take the time to answer your question if you had one. However it seems you only want know if I agree with you or not.

I don't.