Installer or not? what do you prefer?

[AdmiralQuality]

I voted for the cleaner registry.

Registry entries have nothing to do with installers. So voting for a cleaner registry would imply you voted for installer, as there's probably an uninstaller too that will clean the registry.

I don't understand he need for installers in most cases. There are several FX I've passed on using because of .exe files. I'd like to make my own choices, keep my system as clean as possible.

Exactly what choices are keeping your system "clean"? You guys are anal about stuff you clearly don't understand.

Plugins should be just a DLL, even bigger apps such as Native Instruments and Arturia. And unzipping is much easier than going thru an installer. Hitting "del" is easier than uninstalling properly too.

Where would you prefer applications save their state information? Like preferences? In a little text file turd (that's hard to locate as you never know where the host thinks the current working directory is)?

this vote was done in a millisec.
no no no no installer. i detest programs that create useless folders everywhere over the system.
if it was me at microsoft, the stupid "my documents/music/etc" would also be banned forever. as if the rest on the harddisk was not mine.

What useless folders? My .exe installer puts the payload wherever you want it. And defaults to the obvious place, underneath the vstplugins directory (the location of which you FIND in the registry!) in it's own folder, but if you want it mixed up with a million other plugins, you're free to strip that off.

I am using a 3rd option offering BOTH "installer" and "archive", 7-zip's SFX archive format, you then have an EXE file, which can be run as an installer AND you can extract the files/folders manually using 7-zip or WinRar. The custom installer code is only 50kB. When running the installer the 1st page shows the following:

Please take into account that some users DO have difficulty using WinZip, WinRar, 7-zip ...

BTW you can manually extract the files from Rubberfilter.exe by using 7-zip ...

THANK YOU for pointing that out. Yes, many people, even MUSICANS, don't know nor want to know where their vstplugins folder is or are apt to make a mistake (or at least a mess) in unzipping. It will also take them minutes instead of the seconds you're guaranteed with an automated installer.

Should be an undecided option here. I mean If the plugin has many complex dir levels and perhaps files that have to placed in the sys folder etc then I'd rather an installer. Plus it's probably easier for a noob. For the more experienced or DIY user maybe an archive would be ok. So it's kinda hard to say.

L

Yup! All KVR polls should have an "other/fish" option or you're forcing binary decisions on people who may not feel so strongly black/white about it.

Archive. From what I understand though, developers use .exe files to add an exrta layer of security. Unfortunately people will always find ways round this layer & will still be able to hack the s/w. All it does is annoy people who buy s/w legally by clogging up the system & registry.

How would you even KNOW if your registry was "clogged"? I haven't had a sense of a fragmented registry since I moved to XP from 2000, 5 or 6 years ago (same install too! System still as responsive as day #1). And there's not necessarily ANY "security" (I assume you mean copy-protection) function in an .exe installer. That's bad design. In the case of MY plug-ins, your registry will get "clogged" the first time the plug-in runs. Whether you use the installer or extract the .dlls manually using some tool, or get your friend who wasn't afraid of the installer to send them to you. .DLLs are JUST AS POWERFUL as .EXEs, and can do whatever they feel like to your registry/filesystem/anything.

It's worth mentioning that many developers use installers as EULA agreement mechanisms more than anything else. That can be done through the web download link, too, but not if the installer has been mirrored somewhere else.

Exactly.
Since my stuff seems to be "mirrored" (without my permission, mind) halfway across the fcking universe

Yup. Unscrupulous sites, including crackers, will try to save themselves bandwidth by linking direct to your downloads and bypassing any web-based EULA.

Now, I KNOW there are some bad installers out there. But they're probably for equally bad products, from unqualified developers. But if you trust a developer enough to run their .dll, you should trust their .exe too. (If you want to argue this, I'll be happy to make you a demo VST .dll that will do something harmless without your permission, like make a file or shit in your registry).

Finally, as in the Rubberfilter thread, I direct you all to the Dunning-Kruger effect:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning-Kruger_effect

Who'd have thought there was ONE theory that explains KVR in a nutshell?

[mkdr]

Dunning-Kruger effect:
- incompetent individuals tend to overestimate their own level of skill
- people with true knowledge tend to underestimate their competence

[Aleksey Vaneev]

I have an experience in distribution of free plug-ins in ZIP archives. And I have collected enough statistics that suggests that ZIP archives are at least in no way worse than installers. Actually, ZIP archives generated much less questions than installers (e.g. Boogex, SPAN, and other free plug-ins) - while they are downloaded more frequently than commercial plug-ins (yep, that's true).

As for the competence question, musicians who would like to use third party plug-ins MUST know what VstPlugins folder is, if they do not want to get into trouble of having 100s effects listing without organization. VstPlugins folder should be organized manually, for best workflow.

And that's not to mention Mac OS X workflow which does not require installers, at all - simply drag and drop the plug-in bundle into the right folder, from the mounted .dmg disk image (that's instead of ZIP archive).

[kp]

Remember that KVRers are probably more tech savvy than the average user and can handle zip files and extracting to the "right" place - lots of people can't.

Now *bad* installers on the other hand are something to get angry about, but good installers are nothing to worry about.

[whyterabbyt]

I slightly prefer a decent installer/uninstaller, generally, for anything thats more than a single .dll file. But its pretty bloody trivial either way.