KVR Audio

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:06 pm

Yes I saw a lot of those too when looking, but didn't list them as some are no longer downloadable, some have stopped being cross platform, some are no longer really free, others have different version numbers, and some are honestly a bit too 'far out' and some like Harmonical gobbles cpu like you've never seen. Only ones left are really NWBass, which is quite ok and Orca which sounds good but may be a bit too simple, certainly didn't get many cheers when mentioned some OSCs ago..

As it looks, apart from the TAL stuff and some others, cross grade synths are very limited indeed and to be only occasionally used for the challenge..

(also note that Crystal was already used in OSC 5)

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:34 pm

As there was a general question about using bitcrusher in a submissions thread, maybe it's time to look at the FX rules again.

Currently, the rules say:

Code: Select all

External effects: Allowed but must be freeware and easily available to all except your DAW's native EQ which is ok. Modulation effects like chorus, phaser, flanger etc or effects that transform the sounds to make them
unrecognizable as being from the synth are not allowed.

I've honestly been in 2 minds about the FX restrictions from the start. Phaser and flanging can f.i. be done with delays, eq and filters which are all allowed, and chorus by layering synths with the same sounds and pitch shifting and delay etc.

I know some have (I suppose inadvertently) used modulation effects in the past and got away with it, and might be easier and more creative overall to free up the rules and just judge in the final voting what was too much in each case?

What's your take on this?

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:03 pm

Another thing: About the synth voting we were lucky to get a few votes for SuperWaveP8 during OSC 23 vote to get a winner synth, but it was a shave and that's after 3 unsuccessful votes..

So maybe the best idea is to vote from a limited list like Mac suggested earlier.

Likely it will be from my own fav top 10 list, but that will be open for suggestions as well.

So far it looks something like this:

ZynAddSubFX
Voyager
Minimogue
String Theory
Rez
EVOL
Pure-Pone4 (mono, but stonking sound and filter)
PolyIblit
Model Pro (mono, but maybe some other Elektrostudio synth)
MassTurboTar

U-he's latest Tyrell is still in alpha, but with a beta to come shortly I think should make the list. Try it out and have a listen to it here:
http://bedroomproducersblog.com/2010/12 ... -download/
(no awards for guessing where the name and song inspiration comes from..

)

tattiemannie · Post by **tattiemannie** » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:15 am

Hmmmm there are two ways of considering the use of modulated delays ( flanging, chorus, phasers etc )

We allow automation, therefore it is possible to use a static delay plug and use automation to change the delay period over time. It is also possible to use a static delay, with high feedback level to produce tones/notes which are independent of the the featured synth. It is therefore possible, with automation to create sounds, and melodies with only a delay, and there is where I see the problem.

From what I have written there, it could be concluded that there is no point in ruling out modulated delays.

OK, the rules state that all sounds must be created via the featured synth, and also there is a rule which discourages tranformation of the synths sound to the point of misrepresentation.

However, I dont see it as desirable to make it easier for folks to create sounds from effects based modulation which, if used in a subtle manner, can go unnoticed, or assumed to be from the featured synth, and effectively give the user an advantage in the comp.

At least if an artist feels he/she must automate to modulate, then at least he/she will have to work at it, and will as a result at least apply some creative thought to the process.

From my own experience, playing keyboards ( badly ) with a band, I used a cheap casio which sounded like shit ... but when I ran it through a flanger ( which I seem to remember cost more than the keyboard ) ... it really was a different instrument.
Likewise, with my punk band, I used to unplug my guitar at certain points, hold the jack plug and 'play' that same flanger as an instrument... through the distortion pedal, this was very effective.

I'm not suggesting there is a great desire right now for folks to do any of the above, but I do think, if we make the statement that it is allowed, then inevitably, folks will! ... then we will struggle to place defined limits on the extent to which the technique can feature in the finished track.

All in all, if we want to look at the history of OSC, generally, the rules on fx have been gradually relaxed already, but I still view bitcrushing, distortion, vocoders, samplers/pitchshifters/timestretchers and modulated delay type fx as potential contaminants to the honest presentation of a featured synths range and limitations.

Without some sensible limit on fx, it becomes possible to create a track with no more than the click of a pair of sticks. Maybe if there is enough support for a One-Sample-Challenge we can accomodate all the Fx junkies out there

Anyway, thats my view .. which I am sure many are already familiar with, carry on and discuss

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:56 pm

Well argued, hard to counter any of that.

But was bitcrushing specifically disallowed before?

gorgorgathgorgorgor · Post by **gorgorgathgorgorgor** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:41 am

We could do one with a piano and all the fx you want... but that wouldn't really be a One Synth Challenge...

satYatunes · Post by **satYatunes** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:34 am

if we select "4 front piano" as the synth... then it'll still qualify as one synth challenge.

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:36 pm

Suit me as I'm quite into piano atm after not really enjoying the sound before, but believe even 4 Front uses samples also which I don't know how well fits? There are however pure synths that can do decent piano sounds I believe.

gorgorgathgorgorgor · Post by **gorgorgathgorgorgor** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:24 pm

V'ger wrote:Another thing: About the synth voting we were lucky to get a few votes for SuperWaveP8 during OSC 23 vote to get a winner synth, but it was a shave and that's after 3 unsuccessful votes..

I noticed that the process of choosing a synth is less formal than submissions and voting. might it help if we added one more thread for each OSC to formalize this a little more, and include a "news" item to get it started? Those of us who use the rss feed would then be prompted to participate...

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:20 pm

In theory a good idea, but just look at the last voting threads how few nominated a synth and even this one how little participation there is generally. We are also limited to 2 sticky threads, so the thread would likely fall off the radar pretty quickly. But I guess we could try, maybe for OSC 27.

But how are you all generally for using commercial synths? I'm thinking it would fit KVR well to do both freeware and payware stuff, but not necessarily every other month. Maybe pro stuff every 3rd month?

el-bo (formerly ebow) · Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:37 pm

any idea when the osc will, again, be viable for us mac AU users...never entered, but might like to give it a go

gorgorgathgorgorgor · Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:17 pm

Not feelin' the pay-synth thing particularly...
Had a crazy idea though, OSC winner picks next OSC synth, or three we can vote on.

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:48 pm

Yes those are the alternatives, but it's been proven how little people will vote on synths generally. Of course this might pick up if only a choice of 3, but as it was, one could vote for absolutely any synth of all your favorites and still no one really did.. If we made a separate thread for synth vote, do you think it should be choice of 3 or free?

As for winners choosing, we had losers choosing before and there were some untested choices with bugs etc. It might be better with winners in that they have often been longer on the scene etc, but there's always the chance they will not take further part and just throw one out there without really testing or thinking how it fits in the line. I'm choosing for the next comp, but might still get it wrong despite having put some thought into it, so I guess it's minimal..

ebow wrote:any idea when the osc will, again, be viable for us mac AU users...never entered, but might like to give it a go

Unfortunately so limited cross platform synths, but check previous page for a short list and what you would prefer from those. (keeping in mind we've done 2 TAL's and Crystal already).

As it is, for next comp will be a cross platform but between Win and Linux, guess what it will be..

HiEnergy · Post by **HiEnergy** » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:26 am

Does its name start with 'Z' and end in the letter 'X'?

el-bo (formerly ebow) · Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:51 am

V'ger wrote:next comp will be a cross platform but between Win and Linux, guess what it will be..

a waste of time ??

One-Synth-Challenge: General discussion thread