Loom II has landed!

[robotmonkey]

I absolutely love when a new product or upgrade is released and KVR turns into a disappointed bitchfest. The entertainment value is always so high.

As far as AIR products are concerned, I own (between my brother and I) the better part of AIR plugins. There's definitely some useful stuff there. None of the plugins are exceptional or must haves and they do feel like included DAW plugins released as distinct products, but none of the plugins are bad either. Xpand2 I have found very useful for what it does. Hybrid3 is also a great synth that in sound and features kind of reminds me Terratec Komplexer and has since replaced it. Strike2 can also be quite useful, and so can be Vacuum Pro and Velvet. But the best surprise for me was the Creative FX Collection Plus. It has several fx that are absolutely top notch and that I like very much (choruses, non-linear verb, diffusion delay, talkbox, filters). Don't have Loom or the rest of the bundle though.

I have no problem with them heavily discounting their plugins. Actually, if I would not have gotten those plugins dirt cheap in the 15$ range, most likely I would not have gotten them at all.

And of course much of the criticism is justified. The GUI's are painfully small, the AIR website sucks (needs better user area and downloads), AIR is painfully slow with updates, their support seems to suck badly and so on.

Overall I'd say there's definitely some potential in AIR products if they would get their act together.

[ghettosynth]

Overall I'd say there's definitely some potential in AIR products if they would get their act together.

To be clear, I like the AIR products enough that I think that the bundle was excellent value. I'm not at all unhappy with them in any way, but especially at the price that I paid.

I do wish that simon would respond to one of my beta requests as our conversation seemed to have just been dropped

[EnGee]

Note >> Open image in a new tab as it is the actual image I see on my screen

Isn't this how the world always looks??? FML, I better get to the eye doctor if this is considered an issue...farkin' diabetes!

(I meant with my sight glasses)!
That reminded me of my first sight glasses (few years ago only!). When I put them on, I was very surprised from the details I could see, and asked the optician : "Oh wow! Is the world really looks like this?"

[imrae]

There is no point in yelling at the owner of a Chinese restaurant that you want Pizza...

A better analogy would be telling a Chinese restaurant owner that you want soup. For years. And then the big relaunch still doesn't serve soup.

"By popular demand, we're including one more rice cracker."
"Opening sale; free tap water".

[Aloysius]

There is no point in yelling at the owner of a Chinese restaurant that you want Pizza...

... unless you are holding his family hostage.

[DJ Warmonger]

I have 2 4k monitors, One on a laptop and a stand alone 4k monitor and I had gui scaling issues prior to the previous update and now Loom II is even worse. I can't even access some controls. It also replaced my Loom 1 install. I''m going to hold off on the upgrade for now.

Loom Scale.JPG

Maybe this is related to 4k monitors, as in Windows 10 - Reaper (64bit latest) I don't have such a problem.

Here, how it looks in mine (27" 1920x1080):

LOOM 2 in Reaper 5.5.JPG

Note >> Open image in a new tab as it is the actual image I see on my screen

No it's not. It still takes a half of my 27" 4K screen. But that's not the point, moving to 4K screen didn't make it more difficult to operate than it was before - as it already was.
The controls are tiny just for the reason their size related to pixel is small, and thus their values are quantized and even difficult to see under mouse cursor. I still have to click them with one pixel precision to get anywhere near I want. Just compare these tiny envelope nodes to ADSR sliders in Sylenth1 (which are not very large in fact).

[EnGee]

I have 2 4k monitors, One on a laptop and a stand alone 4k monitor and I had gui scaling issues prior to the previous update and now Loom II is even worse. I can't even access some controls. It also replaced my Loom 1 install. I''m going to hold off on the upgrade for now.

Loom Scale.JPG

Maybe this is related to 4k monitors, as in Windows 10 - Reaper (64bit latest) I don't have such a problem.

Here, how it looks in mine (27" 1920x1080):

LOOM 2 in Reaper 5.5.JPG

Note >> Open image in a new tab as it is the actual image I see on my screen

No it's not. It still takes a half of my 27" 4K screen. But that's not the point, moving to 4K screen didn't make it more difficult to operate than it was before - as it already was.
The controls are tiny just for the reason their size related to pixel is small, and thus their values are quantized and even difficult to see under mouse cursor. I still have to click them with one pixel precision to get anywhere near I want. Just compare these tiny envelope nodes to ADSR sliders in Sylenth1 (which are not very large in fact).

I wasn't talking about tiny controls or fonts in my reply to him/her! Have you seen the image posted? Here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 0#p6894729

So, do you have the same problem in your 4k screen? (although I'm not sure how it could take the half of your 4k screen and still not readable!).

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

There is no point in yelling at the owner of a Chinese restaurant that you want Pizza...

... unless you are holding his family hostage.

[DrFolder]

I have 2 4k monitors, One on a laptop and a stand alone 4k monitor and I had gui scaling issues prior to the previous update and now Loom II is even worse. I can't even access some controls. It also replaced my Loom 1 install. I''m going to hold off on the upgrade for now.

Loom Scale.JPG

Maybe this is related to 4k monitors, as in Windows 10 - Reaper (64bit latest) I don't have such a problem.

Here, how it looks in mine (27" 1920x1080):

LOOM 2 in Reaper 5.5.JPG

Note >> Open image in a new tab as it is the actual image I see on my screen

No it's not. It still takes a half of my 27" 4K screen. But that's not the point, moving to 4K screen didn't make it more difficult to operate than it was before - as it already was.
The controls are tiny just for the reason their size related to pixel is small, and thus their values are quantized and even difficult to see under mouse cursor. I still have to click them with one pixel precision to get anywhere near I want. Just compare these tiny envelope nodes to ADSR sliders in Sylenth1 (which are not very large in fact).

I wasn't talking about tiny controls or fonts in my reply to him/her! Have you seen the image posted? Here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 0#p6894729

So, do you have the same problem in your 4k screen? (although I'm not sure how it could take the half of your 4k screen and still not readable!).

I had size issues with Loom1 like you get with older vsti's and scaling. The interface was tiny but the fonts were huge and couldn't fit in the little boxes(?) above the modules. Loom 2 is a different issue where the size is ok but the gui doesn't line up. I can't even see all the modules in Loom 2 making it impossible to use unless I'm just changing presets, Which I can do. The screenshot below shows the problem with scaling with older plugins (in this case Absynth) and the issue with the gui in Loom 2. They got the size right but not the layout of the gui, Which I'm guessing is also a scaling issue.

Loom2.JPG

[EnGee]

I had size issues with Loom1 like you get with older vsti's and scaling. The interface was tiny but the fonts were huge and couldn't fit in the little boxes(?) above the modules. Loom 2 is a different issue where the size is ok but the gui doesn't line up. I can't even see all the modules in Loom 2 making it impossible to use unless I'm just changing presets, Which I can do. The screenshot below shows the problem with scaling with older plugins (in this case Absynth) and the issue with the gui in Loom 2. They got the size right but not the layout of the gui, Which I'm guessing is also a scaling issue.

Loom2.JPG

Yes, I meant this problem that I don't have (the messy modules positions/sizes). Do you have this problem with another host as well, or just with Reaper?

Anyway, I suggest you take a full snapshot and send it to their support or directly to Simon (sbangs_air) by PMing him first.

[Aloysius]

...

Anyway, I suggest you take a full frontal and send it to their support or directly to Simon (sbangs_air) by PMing him first.

[cron]

I had size issues with Loom1 like you get with older vsti's and scaling. The interface was tiny but the fonts were huge and couldn't fit in the little boxes(?) above the modules. Loom 2 is a different issue where the size is ok but the gui doesn't line up. I can't even see all the modules in Loom 2 making it impossible to use unless I'm just changing presets, Which I can do. The screenshot below shows the problem with scaling with older plugins (in this case Absynth) and the issue with the gui in Loom 2. They got the size right but not the layout of the gui, Which I'm guessing is also a scaling issue.

Loom2.JPG

Have you checked out the DPI scaling in Windows? Maybe it's just called 'zoom' or somesuch. Not sure, can't remember as I'm not in front of my machine. IIRC Windows defaulted to something other than 100% for me and I never had a problem with it until I installed Eurydice CM, where I got something much like this. I definitely got Loom after troubleshooting that though, so wouldn't have noticed if Loom was also affected. Dig through the control panel and give it a look anyway.

I still think Loom is a great little synth behind the dated ergonomics. I probably wouldn't care if I didn't like it.

Agreed, soundwise it's very capable, and comes up with some decent and varied textures, the morphing works well and there's a lot of potential for sound design. It's this latter point that's frustrating as the inability to swap or delete modules, when part of it's original USP was that it was a semi-modular additive synth, seems to have been overlooked in the original and now in the update. It has the basis of being a very good synth but, if we compare it to Spectral or Harmor, once you want to go further than the onboard presets, it's quite limited in what it can do compared to what's possible with the competion in terms of modulation sources and targets. Adding a sub-oscillator when these are already standard on so many synths doesn't really seem like a breakthrough.

I can't really speak for Spectral, but agreed that Harmor is a FAR more capable synth. I often go for Loom over Harmor if there's a sound in my head which I know Loom can do though. Kinda like why I'll generally choose Serum over the competition in my plugins folder most of the time - the workflow is so ultra fast I can overlook the issues with sound quality or architectural limitations. So long as the sound in my head is achievable. I'll only go for something else if I know Serum can't do it straight off the bat.

Being far too kind to Loom associating it with Serum mind. Serum is a masterpiece of ergonomics, while Loom is merely 'faster than Harmor' in the very small sonic space where they overlap.

Edit: apologies drfolder, you explicitly mention scaling in the text I quoted. Still, double check it's not enabled anyway as newer versions of Windows seem to default to something other than 100% these days.

[DrFolder]

I had size issues with Loom1 like you get with older vsti's and scaling. The interface was tiny but the fonts were huge and couldn't fit in the little boxes(?) above the modules. Loom 2 is a different issue where the size is ok but the gui doesn't line up. I can't even see all the modules in Loom 2 making it impossible to use unless I'm just changing presets, Which I can do. The screenshot below shows the problem with scaling with older plugins (in this case Absynth) and the issue with the gui in Loom 2. They got the size right but not the layout of the gui, Which I'm guessing is also a scaling issue.

Loom2.JPG

Yes, I meant this problem that I don't have (the messy modules positions/sizes). Do you have this problem with another host as well, or just with Reaper?

Anyway, I suggest you take a full snapshot and send it to their support or directly to Simon (sbangs_air) by PMing him first.

Thanks Engee. It also does it in Reason. I'm on a trial for Loom 2 to test before I by the upgrade so I'll either contact support or wait for an update and see if that works before upgrading. I'm working on 2 projects that use Loom 1 so I need to reinstall the old version so I can finish the projects (Loom 2 installed over the old one). So your in Auckland? I'm in Melbourne Australia but I'm a born Kiwi and lived in Auckland for half my life. Beautiful place:)

[DrFolder]

Edit: apologies drfolder, you explicitly mention scaling in the text I quoted. Still, double check it's not enabled anyway as newer versions of Windows seem to default to something other than 100% these days.

I override scaling in the properties and windows 10 is at 100% (Loom 2 bugs out the gui even without overriding the scaling). I don't have issues with any other Vst or Vsti with their layout, Just Loom 2. U-He plugs are the best because I can zoom within the Vst if the interface needs to be enlarged.

[EnGee]

Thanks Engee. It also does it in Reason. I'm on a trial for Loom 2 to test before I by the upgrade so I'll either contact support or wait for an update and see if that works before upgrading. I'm working on 2 projects that use Loom 1 so I need to reinstall the old version so I can finish the projects (Loom 2 installed over the old one). So your in Auckland? I'm in Melbourne Australia but I'm a born Kiwi and lived in Auckland for half my life. Beautiful place:)

Off topic rant (not Loom related!):
Yes I live in Auckland for more than 10 years now I born and grew up till my early 20's in Iraq and spent the other 30 years making a big circle around the world (poor but wonderful life ). Well, I hope Winston would choose Labour tomorrow, it would be good news for the poor of us