Tone2 Gladiator 3 (public beta)

[wagtunes]

They are not expensive. You are poor. Big difference.

I'm not a rich person myself, but I have to back the devs on this; the time, the effort, the education that went into this is not cheap - people are earning a living. Then they have to support/upgrade it and continue educating themselves with new tech and so on. What can you do with 150 Euros today anyway?

I think it's a small price to pay for the enjoyment it brings. Wanting everything for free is unreasonable.

Well, I look at it this way. And I agree, the devs deserve to earn a living. However, when I price instruments and ultimately decide if something is overpriced, I compare to other instruments in their price range and the features each one brings.

My perfect example is this. And mind you, I own 5 Tone 2 synths.

Saurus 2
Electra 2
Nemesis
Icarus
Rayblaster

So I'm not a Tone 2 hater.

Okay, my example. And I am not going by the current sale prices but by the regular prices that I paid for the synths.

Electra 2 - $199
Zebra 2 - $199

If you're going to tell me that, feature for feature, Electra 2 is as feature packed a synth as Zebra 2, you are on some serious drugs. There is absolutely no comparison between those synths. Zebra 2 blows Electra 2 out of the water on every count.

That is pretty much the scenario for every Tone 2 synth. If you compare them to other synths in their price range and synths even cheaper than Tone 2 synths, Tone 2 synths do not stand up.

That is not to say that Tone 2 synths aren't good. That's not the same thing. All I am saying is that I can get a synth of equal or better quality for less money.

Icarus 2 - $199
Serum - $189

I actually think both of these synths are overpriced but Serum is clearly superior in design to Icarus and it costs $10 less.

Rayblaster at $199 is almost criminal given how little that synth actually does.

Were I not someone who buys synths because he runs a business around buying synths, I probably would not have purchased more than maybe Saurus 2. I actually think that synth is a good value at $119. Not an amazing value, but a good value. Their other synths, not so much.

Tone 2's synths, based on the competition, are $150 synths outside of Saurus 2. That's what they should be selling for. Essentially they are all about $50 overpriced. That's a lot of money for some people.

Again, this is based on a synth by synth comparison comparing feature to feature.

I don't expect you to agree, and I'm sure you don't, but I just wanted you to know where I'm coming from. It has nothing to do with entitlement or not feeling that devs don't deserve to make a living. But with all the competition out there and the quality that you can get today, Tone 2's prices are on the upper end for what their synths do.

There is no disputing that.

[LeVzi]

The G3 update is a very welcome one, I do love how Gladiator works and sounds.

It makes me laugh at the blatant fanboyism on KVR though, especially where T2 is concerned, always under attack for stuff that's god knows how long in the past.

Synths have their pros and cons, if one was that superior we'd all be using it, but it simply isn't the case.

Pricing wise, I appreciate that a) the dev spends a hell of a lot of time on these things, b) they have to make a living c) they need the modern tech to keep things up to date etc and that costs a lot too.

So I can appreciate the higher price tags from all dev's , some synths are good value , some are unreal but others are high, but that's why there are demos, you try them, if they click with you, you have to buy them. I dont agree with transfer fees anymore, I prefer to see that as a free service, so that is not ideal.

I adore the T2 synths, best i've used, and i've tried most of the others around, there are some others that cannot be matched by anything though, Sylenth , Massive but to name a few, but with the likes of E2, Saurus, and G2 I have most bases covered. T2 effects are essential in my work too, filterbank and bifilter are goto's, warmverb is so versatile.

So I don't really begrudge dev's asking a good price for a good product.

[PietW.]

Where is the announcement of Gladiator3? The announced version is 2.7

[chk071]

They are not expensive. You are poor. Big difference.

No, i'm not. I just have a strict budget for a hobby i won't pursue nearly extensive enough to make it worth to buy thousands worth of equipment. But, that's not even the point here. 150-200 € for a soft synth is a lot of money. I discovered the Korg Monologue today, which is a fully fledge analog synth, with one knob per function (welll... almost), a 2 octave keyboard, and even an arpeggiator/sequencer thingie. For 250 €. Not sure if one can still argue that it is justified to offer 150-200 € soft synths then.

Anyway, back to Gladiator then.

[Nielzie]

Electra 2 - $199
Zebra 2 - $199

If you're going to tell me that, feature for feature, Electra 2 is as feature packed a synth as Zebra 2, you are on some serious drugs. There is absolutely no comparison between those synths. Zebra 2 blows Electra 2 out of the water on every count.

That is a risky comparison, because Electra2 is one of the very few synths out there that is actually packed with an enormous amount of features

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!

So to say that Zebra2 blows Electra2 out of the water on every account is a bit of an odd statement.

Zebra2 is of course a whole different beast, with its modular approach.

[jsp1979]

Where is the announcement of Gladiator3? The announced version is 2.7

Tone 2 forum. Gladiator 3 isn't out yet. The OP has quotes from the Tone 2 forum.

[wagtunes]

Electra 2 - $199
Zebra 2 - $199

If you're going to tell me that, feature for feature, Electra 2 is as feature packed a synth as Zebra 2, you are on some serious drugs. There is absolutely no comparison between those synths. Zebra 2 blows Electra 2 out of the water on every count.

That is a risky comparison, because Electra2 is one of the very few synths out there that is actually packed with an enormous amount of features

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!

So to say that Zebra2 blows Electra2 out of the water on every account is a bit of an odd statement.

Zebra2 is of course a whole different beast, with its modular approach.

I can do the same feature list crap with Zebra 2 that you did with Electra 2 but I won't waste my time. You think the synth is worth $199? Fine. I don't.

[fmr]

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!.

WTF?!! ...

What is the difference between Vitual Analog and Subtractive? Analog isn't even a synthesis type. Care to explain?

How is Ultra-Saw a synthesis type? It's just a waveform.

Waveshaping and Phase Distortion are pretty much the same thing (althoug implementation may differ).

Physical Modelling? Not even Tone2 lists that as an available synthesis type. Where did you take that?

Fractal synthesis... It's just an algorithm to create noise (or somehow contollable weird) shapes. I would hardly call that a "new synthesis" method... but whatever. It may become interesting in some ways, for fans of circuit bending.

Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise... Sync, Noise, RM, PWM, are pretty common features in a synth (ANY synth). That leaves vocoder as the only feature not commonly seen.

Don't take me wrong. I have Electra2, and I like it, but you are sounding like a fanboy. There isn't any way to compare Electra2 with Zebra, IMO.

[Nielzie]

Electra 2 - $199
Zebra 2 - $199

If you're going to tell me that, feature for feature, Electra 2 is as feature packed a synth as Zebra 2, you are on some serious drugs. There is absolutely no comparison between those synths. Zebra 2 blows Electra 2 out of the water on every count.

That is a risky comparison, because Electra2 is one of the very few synths out there that is actually packed with an enormous amount of features

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!

So to say that Zebra2 blows Electra2 out of the water on every account is a bit of an odd statement.

Zebra2 is of course a whole different beast, with its modular approach.

I can do the same feature list crap with Zebra 2 that you did with Electra 2 but I won't waste my time. You think the synth is worth $199? Fine. I don't.

No, this was not about my or your opinion, you gave facts, and I just begged to differ on those facts.

[Examigan]

Electra2 has a lot of features also. I just wish they’d add one or two more insert effects.

[Nielzie]

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!.

WTF?!! ...

What is the difference between Vitual Analog and Subtractive? Analog isn't even a synthesis type. Care to explain?

How is Ultra-Saw a synthesis type? It's just a waveform.

Waveshaping and Phase Distortion are pretty much the same thing (althoug implementation may differ

Physical Modelling? Not even Tone2 lists that as an available synthesis type. Where did you take that?

Fractal synthesis... It's just an algorithm to create noise (or somehow contollable weird) shapes. I would hardly call that a "new synthesis" method... but whatever. It may become interesting in some ways, for fans of circuit bending.

Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise... Sync, Noise, RM, PWM, are pretty common features in a synth (ANY synth). That leaves vocoder as the only feature not commonly seen.

Don't take me wong. I have Electra2, and I like it, but you are sounding like a fanboy. There isn't any way to compare Electra2 with Zebra, IMO.

Where did I say all are synthesis types? Of course they are not. I listed some features. The guy stated that Zebra has hands down more features on every account, but I just think that's not true on every account.

I'm not a fanboy. I do own Electra2 as I do own or have owned many synths, but I haven't had it installed for quite some time actually, since I got a new laptop. Should intall it again soon though

[Examigan]

Electra2 has Virtual Analog, Wavetable, Subtractive, Phase Distortion and FM synthesis, Physical Modeling, Ultra-saw, Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise, Wave-shaping, Fractal synthesis and it can import, automatically tune your samples, as well as suggest loop points. And then there is 37(!) filter types. Beyond that there is even has a huuuuuuge (32) amount of different types of effects too. And that in 4 layers.. I mean wtf?!!.

WTF?!! ...

What is the difference between Vitual Analog and Subtractive? Analog isn't even a synthesis type. Care to explain?

How is Ultra-Saw a synthesis type? It's just a waveform.

Waveshaping and Phase Distortion are pretty much the same thing (althoug implementation may differ

Physical Modelling? Not even Tone2 lists that as an available synthesis type. Where did you take that?

Fractal synthesis... It's just an algorithm to create noise (or somehow contollable weird) shapes. I would hardly call that a "new synthesis" method... but whatever. It may become interesting in some ways, for fans of circuit bending.

Vocoder, Sync, Ringmod, PWM, Noise... Sync, Noise, RM, PWM, are pretty common features in a synth (ANY synth). That leaves vocoder as the only feature not commonly seen.

Don't take me wong. I have Electra2, and I like it, but you are sounding like a fanboy. There isn't any way to compare Electra2 with Zebra, IMO.

Where did I say all are synthesis types? Of course they are not. I listed some features. The guy stated that Zebra has hands down more features on every account, but I just think that's not true on every account.

I'm not a fanboy. I do own Electra2 as I do own or have owned many synths, but I haven't had it installed for more that a year I think actually, since I got a new laptop. Should intall it again soon though

Yes I recommend installing it again as there are many new features added in the last year.

[fmr]

Yes I recommend installing it again as there are many new features added in the last year.

Actually, to be fair with Tone 2, they have been great at supporting Electra2, Icarus, and Gladiator (which is great, since these are my favorites). They have been releasing important updates, with new features added, and they have been doing that for free (now they even announced Gladiator 3 for free to Gladiator 2 users - hope they don't change their mind later).

This contrasts with what they did with Saurus and Rayblaster, which both received what I consider minor updates with a number increment, and with an upgrade fee I think is exaggerated. Glad they changed their way.

[Nielzie]

Yes I recommend installing it again as there are many new features added in the last year.

Yes I will do that

[fluffy_little_something]

Aren't Gladiator and Electra becoming more and more similar, anyway? With some Tone2 synths I fail to see the real difference, it always says zillions of synthesis types that make sounds never heard before.