Bach: Little Prelude, BWV 943, mm. 1–5

[rbarata]

Hello again...another exercise...

I've been giving this exercise to find the key and scale.
What I've found was C minor using the C harmonic minor scale but the internet says it's C Maj.
If so, then why the flats on the A and E?

I'm think this small excerpt of the piece is minor while the complete is major.

[jancivil]

Prelude in C major, BWV 943 does numerous modulations to other keys, spending quite a lot of time in G major.
Don't worry about the disagreement with the key in the name.

OTOH, note this:

Screen Shot 2018-07-22 at 2.28.00 PM.png

Where key of F goes thru a sudden viiº6/5 of C [temporarily V] to I6/4 of F, now IV6/4 of C, and a plagal cadence to home, I of C.

NB: Particularly the pedal C.

[rbarata]

So, basically, was I right about it being C minor in this small example?

Where key of F goes thru a sudden viiº6/5 of C [temporarily V] to I6/4 of F, now IV6/4 of C, and a plagal cadence to home, I of C.

Need some time to analyse this but I see what you mean. A subtle change in the reference our ears are using (key change).

[jancivil]

It very likely is C minor, but it isn't harmonic minor before the B natural necessarily. I didn't find it in this piece to hear it. It's not the first 4 bars of Prelude BWV 943.

viiº6/5 of C is B diminished 7th in first inversion: D Ab F B there. IV6/4 of C is F/C Bass (2nd inversion). Figured bass, which *should* be given early in a Music Theory I coursework IME.

So the 2nd half of that bar accomplishes C, Dm, Bº7 [C] thru part-writing, with the top line doing Sol La Si [Do] per C.

[rbarata]

My knowledge so far allows me to analyse more or less easily chord progressions when the note are stacked on top of each other.
This means your example is kind of not easy to me...I can identify diminished 7th chords, I know what a plagal cdence is but finding all of these things from a melody it's not easy to me...lack of training, I guess.
One must start somewhere...do you know a good book with more or less easy pieces to analyse?

About your example I guess the viiº6/5 is at the end of the 2nd bar, right?

[jancivil]

I think this piece is a good simple one for analysis. I don't know off the top of my head. The names of non-chord tones is stuff I learned in diatonic harmony 44 yrs ago, I'm fuzzy on labels in my dotage. The point of the names is contextual*...

The idea I'm trying to push you towards is look at part-writing; you have JS Bach who is at the crux of where linear writing is turning into a lot of nameable chords. So there are lines which push back to home; also the º7 harmony is a property of C minor but pushes to C major with more velocity.

I really mean it when I say whatever coursework you're drawing from should give you a grasp of figured bass by now. So, a Bach example here is a good time to point this out: figured bass is a reveal for contrapuntal thinking, for reasoning through part-writing.

For instance I say IV6/4 to I. Going by ear, I still have the indelible impression of IV from the second bar of my picture. Fact is, a C suspended 4th to the final C is my 'plagal cadence'.

6/4 there works as so: figuring the bass C to the other parts of the harmony, C to F a 4th, C to A a 6th. C F A, triadic harmony is F major. So the part-writing of this type of plagal cadence shows the 6 and the 4 resolving to 5 and 3 while the C is retained. Here the G is *anticipated and we have that Csus4 harmony.

If you're trying to construct a coursework for yourself off of the internet, I strongly advise to get a hold of something cogent; like a class or at least something holistic from somewhere if the 'net is all you can do.
Block chord analysis isn't going to reveal but so much, is the upshot.

Yes, I'm pushing you. You've been at this a while.

[rbarata]

Yes, I'm pushing you. You've been at this a while.

Yes, I've noticed already.

Let me put my goals in context...a few years ago, I don't know...maybe 8 or more, I started learning theory by myself with the aid of some people in music theory forums, and I got pretty far, as far as I have never thought I would be...scales, chords, chord names, harmony, progressions, 4 part-writing, etc (although my forum base was not this one, I'm sure you'll find some old posts of mine in here).
But some events in my personal life pulled me away from it and since then I haven't studied anything music related. So, now I'm trying to recall everything that I've learned before.

I'm following Udemy's Music Theory Comprehensivevideo series and studying Piston's Harmony.
My main issue is that I am trying to do the most exercises I can find (Udemy's and Piston's are not enough) because I want to really get a good hold on the basis (scales and intervals) and I'm doing several from different sources but....many don't have the answers keys. That's why I'm asking for confirmation of my answers in here.

I think, when one starts studying theory, the main (and first hurdle) one can find is the logic behind and the way of thinking about all this stuff. Once this obstacle is overcame everything that comes next is a lot easier.
And I believe I already have gone through that process...now it's recalling everything to start something new.

[fmr]

Hello again...another exercise...

I've been giving this exercise to find the key and scale.
What I've found was C minor using the C harmonic minor scale but the internet says it's C Maj.
If so, then why the flats on the A and E?

I'm think this small excerpt of the piece is minor while the complete is major.

That's the Prelude BWV 934, the second from the "Sechs Kleine Präludien" (Six Little Preludes). And it's in C minor. Don't know where you get that transcription, but the editions I know clearly indicate C minor with the key signature. There's no doubt about it.

But yes, all Bach writings are full of modulations. A good way to study harmony, though, is through the choral harmonisations he did. Since several choral melodies are not clearly tonal, but modal, Bach did some cleverly intricate 4-part writing where he achieved to create a tonal harmony out of a modal melody (sometimes with some really twisting chord progressions).

That's the school I followed myself, and has been followed by many harmony/composition students since ages (I would even say centuries).

[rbarata]

Don't know where you get that transcription, but the editions I know clearly indicate C minor with the key signature.

Hi Fernando

Remember this is an exercise to find the key and scale. The book author didn't put the key signature because that would be giving half of the answer.

[fmr]

Don't know where you get that transcription, but the editions I know clearly indicate C minor with the key signature.

Hi Fernando

Remember this is an exercise to find the key and scale. The book author didn't put the key signature because that would be giving half of the answer.

Ah... OK then. But giving as an exercize a piece as well known as that one is like a hidden cat with the tale at sight.

[BertKoor]

What I've found was C minor using the C harmonic minor scale but the internet says it's C Maj.

Probably a typo in the numbers.
Prelude BWV 934 is in C Min
Prelude BWV 943 is in C Maj

[rbarata]

Well, I've found typos before in this book so it's possible.

[Hooj]

...
The idea I'm trying to push you towards is look at part-writing;

^^ THAT ^^

I would suggest taking an actual class... Part-writing is one of those subjects where you'll need to work through exercises in order to really learn it. It's kinda like algebra.... The rote memorization of formulas is pointless if you can't (or don't know how to) solve problems using those formulas.

[rbarata]

Part-writing is one of those subjects where you'll need to work through exercises in order to really learn it.

I'll get there after a refreshment of some other subjects: progressions.

[fmr]

Part-writing is one of those subjects where you'll need to work through exercises in order to really learn it.

I'll get there after a refreshment of some other subjects: progressions.

What do you mean with "progressions"? The "progressions" are determined by the melodies, and by the strategy you follow when harmonizing. Many chords can follow many chords. As I already told you, when harmonizing the chorales, Bach sometimes created some intricate, almost chromatic, harmonies, just because he was harmonizing tonally a melody that was modal. You will probably never find those kind of "progressions" in your studies.

I repeat my advice - look for a book with Bach Chorales, and start analyzing it. Look especially for different harmonizations of the same chorale, like for example "Herzlich Tut Mich Verlangen". By comparing the different harmonizations, and how the four parts are written, you will learn a lot. Actually, you can also compare what Pachelbel, Telemann, and more recently Brahms, and Max Reger did with the same melody.

Another chorale I particularly like is "Wer nur den lieben Gott läßt walten". There is even an entire cantata composed after this chorale.

If (when) you want to look for more advanced material, you can try the variations over "Sei gegrüsset, Jesu gütig". The correct name is " Partite diverse sopra 'Sei gegrüsset, Jesu gütig'. BWV 768. Or the canonic variations (canonic here means they are in canon form) over the chorale "Vom Himmel hoch da komm' ich her", BWV 769.

You can easily find scores of all these works online.