Which CPU better for music production : Intel 12900K i9 or AMD Ryzen 3960X?

[JerGoertz]

Thinking about putting together a new Windows 10 machine to run all these CPU-heavy VST's that keep getting made and forcing me to buy them.

Trying to decide between the 2 processors in the title. The 12900K is about half as expensive as the 3960X, but the 3960X has twice the threads (48 vs. 24). In single-core performance, it appears that the 12900K is the winner, but which is more important? My intention would be to run a bunch of CPU-intensive modular plugins in a DAW (think Softube Modular inside Bitwig) without glitches or hiccups. My current i5 4-core routinely craps its pants even thinking about running more than 1 instance of such a plugin.

[Pictus]

May help
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=574244

[JerGoertz]

Thanks. I'm thinking that if single-core performance is good enough to run an instance of Modular with the Ryzen, then I'd go with it. But I did just see that it doesn't have on-board graphics, so maybe not.

[Pictus]

If single-core performance is what you want, than the 12900K is a better choice now.
The 12900K also have the built-in GPU.
But pure DSP power is better with the AMD 5950X, some stuff will be better with Intel
and others with AMD, I would ask Softube and Bitwig what CPU would give better results.

[AdvancedFollower]

Keep in mind that Windows 10 (and probably 11) limits the number of MMCSS (Multimedia Class Scheduler Service) threads a DAW can use to 28. This means in practice you can only use up to a 14 core/28 thread CPU. After this point, performance degrades and you will begin to experience audio stuttering, cutting out and other performance problems. If your CPU has more than 14 physical cores (e.g. 16-core), you're better off disabling SMT/HT, and if it has more than 28 physical cores (e.g. 32), you have to disable physical cores to get the best performance.

In general, DAWs are more dependent on single core IPC/clock speed once you go above 8 cores. A lot of audio processing is serial in nature and can't be parallelized (for example multiple channels running through one effects chain on a bus track). So both the 12900K and 3960X are a waste of money if they're only going to be used with a DAW and may in fact perform worse than a fast 8 - 12 core CPU.

[xbow]

If your CPU has more than 14 physical cores (e.g. 16-core), you're better off disabling SMT/HT, and if it has more than 28 physical cores (e.g. 32), you have to disable physical cores to get the best performance.

Would you have any advice on how to achieve that under Windows (i.e., disabling hyperthreading and using only my 8 physical cores instead of 16 virtual ones)?

[Atlatnesiti]

Neither…
Apple M1 pro/max is the current king.
…until M2 to be released soon…

[JerGoertz]

Keep in mind that Windows 10 (and probably 11) limits the number of MMCSS (Multimedia Class Scheduler Service) threads a DAW can use to 28. This means in practice you can only use up to a 14 core/28 thread CPU. After this point, performance degrades and you will begin to experience audio stuttering, cutting out and other performance problems. If your CPU has more than 14 physical cores (e.g. 16-core), you're better off disabling SMT/HT, and if it has more than 28 physical cores (e.g. 32), you have to disable physical cores to get the best performance.

In general, DAWs are more dependent on single core IPC/clock speed once you go above 8 cores. A lot of audio processing is serial in nature and can't be parallelized (for example multiple channels running through one effects chain on a bus track). So both the 12900K and 3960X are a waste of money if they're only going to be used with a DAW and may in fact perform worse than a fast 8 - 12 core CPU.

The 12900K has 16 cores, but 24 threads as 8 of the cores are "efficiency" (only 1 thread per core, AFAIK). So, does what you said still apply to it?

[Debutante]

Keep in mind that Windows 10 (and probably 11) limits the number of MMCSS (Multimedia Class Scheduler Service) threads a DAW can use to 28. This means in practice you can only use up to a 14 core/28 thread CPU. After this point, performance degrades and you will begin to experience audio stuttering, cutting out and other performance problems. If your CPU has more than 14 physical cores (e.g. 16-core), you're better off disabling SMT/HT, and if it has more than 28 physical cores (e.g. 32), you have to disable physical cores to get the best performance.

In general, DAWs are more dependent on single core IPC/clock speed once you go above 8 cores. A lot of audio processing is serial in nature and can't be parallelized (for example multiple channels running through one effects chain on a bus track). So both the 12900K and 3960X are a waste of money if they're only going to be used with a DAW and may in fact perform worse than a fast 8 - 12 core CPU.

Thanks for that bit!!!... but what if you disable the service?

...looked for the service and it's not there... or what else does it fall under?

[Debutante]

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 2a552f56a9

So AAAAAAAAAAAALLL that I wanted to upgrade to would have been for naught. OMG. Thank goodness I hadn't already. Why do they suggest downgrading to Win 8.1 if this thing had been around since XP... and are there any major drawbacks to doing so?

Also:
"As of Windows 10, the amount of real-time processing threads with Multimedia Class Scheduler Service (MMCSS) priority is limited to 32 per process - 4 of which are blocked by non-audio-threads already running."

Does that mean that 32 threads is OPTIMAL since the remaining 28 capable are free for DAW... or what does that mean?

[Ah_Dziz]

The Intel is kicking ass over here. I don't have both to try side by side, but I wouldn't risk trying an AMD DAW. I had many problems with the last AMD DAW I used (to be fair it was right as things were seriously going over to 64 bit) and unless I end up in a position to build a system just for fun I'll be sticking with Intel for the foreseeable future.

[ROTMetro]

I have had zero issues on an AMD 5900 with Ableton but don't have experience with your particular use case. It's not 2010 anymore AMD definitely competes fine with Intel now.

[Pictus]

Keep in mind that Windows 10 (and probably 11) limits the number of MMCSS (Multimedia Class Scheduler Service) threads a DAW can use to 28. (...)

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 2a552f56a9

Check
https://gearspace.com/board/music-compu ... st15266657

[sir-haver]

Keep in mind that Windows 10 (and probably 11) limits the number of MMCSS (Multimedia Class Scheduler Service) threads a DAW can use to 28. This means in practice you can only use up to a 14 core/28 thread CPU. After this point, performance degrades and you will begin to experience audio stuttering, cutting out and other performance problems. If your CPU has more than 14 physical cores (e.g. 16-core), you're better off disabling SMT/HT, and if it has more than 28 physical cores (e.g. 32), you have to disable physical cores to get the best performance.

In general, DAWs are more dependent on single core IPC/clock speed once you go above 8 cores. A lot of audio processing is serial in nature and can't be parallelized (for example multiple channels running through one effects chain on a bus track). So both the 12900K and 3960X are a waste of money if they're only going to be used with a DAW and may in fact perform worse than a fast 8 - 12 core CPU.

Hasn't it stopped being an issue since Cubase 10?
Thanks!

[ideny]

I would go for a Ryzen Laptop, whilst using an Intel Desktop, but move soon to AM5.

Intel is top notch in single core, super wen starting an apllication. As soon as more cores are used the freqeuncy goes down, wenn all cores are active its getting worse. I dont know how VST2 code and Windows is considering the effiency and power cores, so it might randomly swap between the cores.

The AMD stay cooler when the load spreads the cores.

IMO. Compate the prize between the amd and intel buseniss classes of the fovarity company. 2 Years ago I would say go for an Intel. Now I think AMD provides better , price perfomance and powerconsumption.

Whilst I also thought about entering the apple cage, the M2. !!!!

But just bought a AMD 6800Xt..